Laura Babcock: Dellen Millard & Mark Smich charged w/Murder in the First Degree #1

[Sillybilly]

I just rethought my previous post. Given MS is NOT charged with forcible confinement, then the only other thing that could justify the 1st degree murder charge against him is premeditation. Did MS do all the planning, and DM went along with the plan?

 

[ArianeEmory]

I just rethought my previous post. Given MS is NOT charged with forcible confinement, then the only other thing that could justify the 1st degree murder charge against him is premeditation. Did MS do all the planning, and DM went along with the plan?

For all three charged murders?

 

[Snoofo]

I guess you feel he's just a humble philosopher?

No humble philosopher. Maybe Innocent Dupe. When I piece together his history from what we've all read and heard I get quite a different profile than the majority and the person I think he might be could be taken advantage of and duped easily.


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[Sillybilly]

For all three charged murders?

No, I meant MS is not charged with FC in Tim's case (the only case where a FC charge has been laid solely against DM). IOW, what special circumstance would constitute the laying of the 1st degree murder charge against MS in Tim's case (if not premeditation)?

 

[MsSherlock]

No, I meant MS is not charged with FC in Tim's case (the only case where a FC charge has been laid solely against DM). IOW, what special circumstance would constitute the laying of the 1st degree murder charge against MS in Tim's case (if not premeditation)?

Sillybilly, IMHO, that charge may come about by DM being the person who drove off with TB in the truck-may even support the theory that MS jumped out at the end of the driveway and got into the Yukon. And, really thinking about it, perhaps MS never even got into the truck-perhaps he walked to the end of the driveway and got into the Yukon. I don't know if SB actually saw them drive off. If MS wasn't in the truck with TB, IMO, perhaps they can't charge him with FC. MOO

Since there's a possibility that TB was shot, DM wouldn't have needed any help from MS if all he had to do is pull his revolver out of his nifty holster and quickly murder TB. MOO

 

[Alethea Dice]

I just rethought my previous post. Given MS is NOT charged with forcible confinement, then the only other thing that could justify the 1st degree murder charge against him is premeditation. Did MS do all the planning, and DM went along with the plan?

I think it could be as simple as this. When DM was charged with the theft and forcible confinement, he was allegedly the one driving. Neither the truck nor TB came back, so there's the theft and FC. But at that point, there was no body, no evidence of whether TB was still alive or dead. It's really all they had to charge him with at that point. Later, when MS was charged, it was already a murder and if he was involved, it's an automatic 1st degree because it was committed during a forcible confinement, regardless of who did the confining.

However, I do find it hard to believe that MS is the "beta" personality in this relationship. He's only charged with two of the murders at this point, but it appears he was, at the very least, in the vicinity for all three.

JMO

 

[Alethea Dice]

Sillybilly, IMHO, that charge may come about by DM being the person who drove off with TB in the truck-may even support the theory that MS jumped out at the end of the driveway and got into the Yukon. And, really thinking about it, perhaps MS never even got into the truck-perhaps he walked to the end of the driveway and got into the Yukon. I don't know if SB actually saw them drive off. If MS wasn't in the truck with TB, IMO, perhaps they can't charge him with FC. MOO

Since there's a possibility that TB was shot, DM wouldn't have needed any help from MS if all he had to do is pull his revolver out of his nifty holster and quickly murder TB. MOO

All of the early reports say that he went on a test drive with two men and the Yukon followed them as they drove away. And SB's statement says she watched him drive away.

"As you know, I watched my husband drive away just after 9 o'clock on Monday night," she said. "He smiled at me and said he'd be right back. And I have not seen him since."

snip

Meanwhile, Tim was already dead. Police believe he was killed by Millard and Smich soon after they got in his truck.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/4462499-clairmont-as-bosma-s-wife-pleas-for-his-return-millard-was-allegedly-escaping/

Bosma last saw her husband when he left on a test drive with two men who had contacted him about the pickup truck he had posted for sale online.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/05/15/tim-bosma-wife-_n_3281322.html

He said Bosma and the two men who went out with him for the test drive were followed by another vehicle when they left his Ancaster home Monday night.

http://www.lfpress.com/2013/05/14/police-update-tim-bosma-case

May 6, 2013: Bosma, 32, leaves his Ancaster, Ont. home in his Dodge Ram 3500 truck at around 9:30 p.m. in the company of two men who responded to an ad Bosma placed online.

http://globalnews.ca/news/560553/tim-bosma-a-timeline-of-the-police-investigation/

The grisly discovery is the latest in a case that has captured the attention of people far beyond the Ontario region since the disappearance of Mr. Bosma, who was last seen on May 6 driving away from his rural home with two men who claimed to be interested in buying the 2007 Dodge Ram he’d posted for sale online.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/millard-to-be-charged-with-first-degree-murder-of-tim-bosma/article11907415/

 

[Alethea Dice]

In a way this is OT but Id like to ask a couple of things & I believe by now you would know the answers to, ( I havnt been able to access the forum much lately, just come in & read when I can) 1./ how do we access our own previous posts, and 2./ which year was it VS disappeared/ was murdered?
/08 or /09? I Believe /08.. anyhow Brantford area had a big part to play I thought in all that went on but was kept quiet for some reason, is there a casino there? And more so a reserve? We have both in Tbay. I would like to know who owned that property in 2008 where Bosmas remains were found, if not the man who said he sold the property to him. There is ALOT of real estate business surrounding all of this DMs stuff & another case, and a connection to a dance school of some sort but its down the chain. Thanks if anyone can help:seeya:

2009 and yes to the casino and yes to the reserve.

 

[Miranda]

Very interesting article with a lot of new information about Laura in today's Toronto Star

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...ck_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

 

[newone]

Very interesting article with a lot of new information about Laura in today's Toronto Star

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...ck_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

very good article - thank you.

Here's a question......it states that the new fella was charged w/sexual assault of her friend (((begs the question who was the friend and was she the one who filed the complaint with regard to the sexual assault)))


from your link

"But the night deteriorated into a screaming match between Austerweil and Babcock. A month later, Babcock went to police. In March 2012, Austerweil was charged with assaulting her, theft under $5,000 (what he owed for the vet bill) and sexually assaulting her friend.

Court records show all the charges were withdrawn that September — after Babcock disappeared.

Austerweil denies all of the now dismissed allegations."

I really feel sad for her family having to wait for the trial to find out the proof of LB's death.

 

[Miranda]

This article raises SO MANY questions for me.

Sleeping in a park in June to SL putting her up in a hotel June 26 then leaving behind a "shoebox full of cash" on June 30th?

 

[newone]

This article raises SO MANY questions for me.

couldn't agree more......:scared:

 

[jash]

Yes about that box full of cash... where did the $ come from? Did someone try to pay her off to keep quiet or go away? Did she steal it from someone who sought revenge? Or did she sell some stuff (her body, the borrowed iPad) in an effort to provide for the dog she was leaving behind?

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[Snoofo]

IMO leaving the dog seems simple - it was a deterrent for finding a place to crash; leaving money would mean you are either hiding money or you are walking away from life. My gut says she stole the cash and was found out.

JMO.

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[Snoofo]

Who can withdraw charges after the complainant has gone missing? Is that the one thing LE DID do?

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[SnooperDuper]

Who can withdraw charges after the complainant has gone missing? Is that the one thing LE DID do?

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You are assuming the charges were valid. They could have been a revenge ploy over the $4k and the livestock gift gone wrong.

A husky is a high energy pet that need a lot of exercise and eats a lot of food. It's not the same as LB's maltese, that would eat tablespoons of food a day and gets enough exercise running at your feet in the house. It's not a great gift for an unemployed druggie that has no money or motivation.

Then the dog gets sick, there is a $4k vet bill, and the giftee has to pay for this? Nice gift!

<modsnip>

If there was a sex assault of LB's friend, LB's friend should have been the person to press those charges, not LB.

It's suspicious that LB waited a month after the incident to press charges (after the credit card bill came in?)

It's possible it was all revenge, without grounds, and LB was not taking accountability for her actions.

 

[Snoofo]

I really feel sad for her family having to wait for the trial to find out the proof of LB's death.

It's terrible. My heart goes out to the Babcock family and SL.

I wonder why in the case of TB, his family was in close contact with LE all along, always informed first, yet the poor Babcocks do not get the same regard and respect?



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[Juballee]

It's terrible. My heart goes out to the Babcock family and SL.

I wonder why in the case of TB, his family was in close contact with LE all along, always informed first, yet the poor Babcocks do not get the same regard and respect?



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Isn't SB's brother in LE? That might explain why TB got much more intense immediate LE manhunt and more media attention than LB's case. It might also explain why she seems to have been kept better informed and has received far more all around support, in my opinion.

In contrast, I can't believe Laura's family still hasn't even been told what the proof of her death is. Not having remains is one thing, but not being told how they know, just to trust them, to me that is worse. As a parent, how could you ever give up hope until you had absolute certain proof? I personally think that it is cruel not to tell the parents what their proof of her death is, are LE afraid the they will tell the public and then the accused will get advanced knowledge of the proof? Because from what I recall, the crown will have to disclose to the accused any proof that they have that a murder took place before trial at least, if not as soon as possible. So how is it fair that the accused and their attorneys will get to see the proof of death before her own parents? Again, to me that seems unnecessarily cruel to parents who have already suffered enough.

 

[newone]

It really irritates me that so frequently the justice process can be so cruel and unsupportive of the victims and/or family survivors. The case of LB is one of those situations that is clearly a ''no win'' for all concerned.

In this case, rights to a fair trial and the need for the prosecution to keep evidence close to the vest seems to trump the need for some closure for LB's family.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Isn't SB's brother in LE? That might explain why TB got much more intense immediate LE manhunt and more media attention than LB's case.

No no no, think of the circumstances of each person's disappearance.

TB set out on a test drive. How long does that take? Overnight? Days? No, SB gave him one hour and then called LE. LE immediately called the circumstances suspicious: At the May 8 presser, they said:

And, use more common sense, as far as you know to give these people your home address, possibly meet them somewhere in the middle of the day, and not in a rural location. Just for their own safety.

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OTOH, LE knew of LB from the incident with DA in mid March. Cocaine, ecstacy, pot, booze, shoplifting, assault, online sex trysts, prostitution, sleeping in parks. LE can't force anyone to do rehab. Often, the more people force someone to clean up, the more ties they break, until they sever ties with everyone they used to know in their sober life. The individual has to realize that this is a bad life and elect to seek rehab for themselves. From LE's perspective, LB was making the common descent into drugs, and as an adult, there was nothing they could do for her.

If LB had been able to make contact with social services, there might have been some help for her. But shelters have early curfews and demand that you don't bring in drugs or alcohol. LB found the park more appealing. Welfare will accept addiction as a disability and give you $1k a month towards food, shelter and drugs. However, you have to admit you are an addict, and the system will try and encourage you towards rehab if you admit that's what brought you to it.

It is not LE's job to be social services. They don't rehab people. Being an addict is not illegal. And that's what seems to have happened here: LB became an addict and dropped off the grid.

So when did LB become missing? Within an hour? The next morning? No, it was almost 2 weeks before anyone was concerned enough to call police.

Within 1 hour, SB was absolutely certain something had gone terribly wrong.

After about 2 weeks, SL asked LE to find LB, still assuming that she was still alive.

That is why TB's case gained immediate, massive attention, and LB's case remained a vague mystery.