Laura Babcock Murder Trial 12.07.17 - Charge to the Jury - Day 1

[Bluepopsicle]

Sadly, it doesn't show up on mobile.

I’m so glad you pointed that out! I saw today and felt like a dope wondering how on earth I missed that all this time, but unlike today, I’m usually on my phone. Thanks!

 

[Tilly23]

WHAT THE JURY SAW: Tracking and mapping the cellphones https://youtu.be/tKcUv24D4vo

Just wanted to highlight this post from Alban. This is the information about the cell phone pings that was presented on November 2 and that we have all been wanting to see!
:drumroll:

MOO

 

[FrannieQ]

Just generally reacting to the Judge's introductory directives to the jury. I'm no apologist for the evil DM or his odious pals, but I do wish the Crown had been able to provide fuller confirmation of a detailed investigation into LB's disappearance from when it occurred during the years up to the arrests. I haven't followed the thread every day so maybe I missed police witnesses? If so, apologies for my being a fuss budget.

What do you think? Is it possible that she could have been entrapped in a web like young people those described in the article. She was described as lovely but often desperately needy girl - fitting the description of victims. (I must say I never before thought of this as being a problem in Canada.) Quite an eye opener.

 

[Shaz14]

This was a phenomenal project done by The Star, that I actually was consulted on. Some of those girls were my clients. I work with survivors of human trafficking, sex workers, and victims of gender based violence. What are your thoughts and questions on how it relates to this case? I'm all ears

I haven't read the article yet but I will! I always wondered if she ended up being trafficked. The evidence against DM and MS, along with their prior convictions in the TB trial, is pretty damning though. Sadly (or maybe luckily....in a very sad and hard to explain way) it appears that she is dead and was not trafficked

 

[Jasper52]

The Honourable Mr. Justice Michael Code

Source; 2015 Distinguished Alumnus: Michael Code ’67, Real-World Problem Solver

 

[meterclicks]

Excuse the long post but catching up...


We're back in court now, just waiting on the judge/jury.
by Adam Carter 2:50 PM

"You tired of me yet?" Code jokes as the jury comes back in. "You better not be, because we've got a ways to go."
by Adam Carter 3:00 PM

Code is now moving on to talk about after the fact conduct. That's another piece of circumstantial evidence, code says.
by Adam Carter 3:03 PM

This is what Millard and Smich did after July 3-4, when the Crown alleges Babcock died.
by Adam Carter 3:03 PM

There are two main examples of this in this case, Code says -- the use of the Eliminator and statements made to Noudga, Lerner and Michalski by Millard, that the Crown alleges were false.
by Adam Carter 3:05 PM

That second example is only admissible against Millard, Code says.
by Adam Carter 3:06 PM

The use of the incinerator is potentially admissible against both, Code says, but the alleged "false statements" are only admissible against Millard.
by Adam Carter 3:08 PM

Evidence of what a person did or said after an offence was allegedly committed, may be consistent with someone "who has done something wrong." "In other words, is the person acting in a way that indicates an involvement in an offence?"
by Adam Carter 3:09 PM

Code says the evidence considering the acquisition of the Eliminator, and the building and testing of its predecessor, mainly happened before the alleged event, so it's not post offence conduct at all.
by Adam Carter 3:11 PM

The delivery, preparing and testing, and use of the Eliminator on July 23 and 24, is in the post offence time period, Code says.
by Adam Carter 3:12 PM

Code says that the Crown says Millard's statements about Babcock to Shawn Lerner, Noudga and Michalski are all false.
by Adam Carter 3:13 PM
Basically, we're looking at post-July 3 evidence here, in this section of the charge.
by Adam Carter 3:14 PM

The judge says they have to be cautious here, as it could be susceptible to "faulty inferences ... the basic instruction here is be careful with this body of evidence."
by Adam Carter 3:15 PM

The first thing the jury needs to do here, Code says, is decide what Millard and Smich did and said. He says the two don't dispute disposing of something in the incinerator -- but they say they were burning a deer carcass. "There's no doubt they were burning something there."
by Adam Carter 3:16 PM

Code is saying the jury needs to consider the evidence of the two bone experts alongside all the other evidence in the trial.
by Adam Carter 3:18 PM

"Don't look at Dr. Rogers and Dr. Rufalo's evidence in isolation," Code tells them. "Decide this issue of what was being burned that night in the Eliminator on an assessment of the entire evidence."
by Adam Carter 3:19 PM

Once the jury decides what Millard and Smich did, the jury must decide if they seemed to be acting unlawfully after her alleged death, Code says.
by Adam Carter 3:20 PM

 

[meterclicks]

Code is talking about different inference stages of the process here, but it's not clear what it is he's talking about to me.
by Adam Carter 3:23 PM

Code says the jury must not use after the fact conduct in decided whether they were acting unlawfully and knew it, unless the reject any potentially innocent explanations.
by Adam Carter 3:24 PM

Basically, the crux of all this is that the jury has to remove any innocent explanations for conduct before moving to drawing inferences about post offence conduct.
by Adam Carter 3:26 PM

Code now says he's going to give a "particularly complex instruction" in the realm of post offence conduct.
by Adam Carter 3:27 PM

Code says tomorrow he's going to instruct the jury on levels of culpability. They are: first-degree murder, second-degree murder and manslaughter.
by Adam Carter 3:28 PM

The key thing that separates manslaughter from 2nd degree is intent to kill, he says. And the difference of 2nd degree to 1st degree is planning and deliberation.
by Adam Carter 3:29 PM

The only part of the evidence of Millard and Smich's post offence conduct that can be user for higher levels of culpability is the potential relationship between the prior acquisition and the subsequent use of the Eliminator, Code says.
by Adam Carter 3:30 PM

Code is talking about the attempt at building an incinerator, and then ordering one. This straddles pre-offence and post-offence time periods. He says this "may have" some connection with planning and culpability, and intent to kill.
by Adam Carter 3:31 PM

Basically, Code is telling them to look at the Eliminator, and its purchase, to examine if if was planned to be used for a deliberate killing.
by Adam Carter 3:33 PM

The issue here is -- did Millard and Smich get the Eliminator to carry out an exact plan to kill Babcock or not? That's relevant to planning.
by Adam Carter 3:35 PM

If there wasn't a plan there, the use of the Eliminator is only relevant to manslaughter, Code says.
by Adam Carter 3:35 PM

 

[FrannieQ]

This was a phenomenal project done by The Star, that I actually was consulted on. Some of those girls were my clients. I work with survivors of human trafficking, sex workers, and victims of gender based violence. What are your thoughts and questions on how it relates to this case? I'm all ears

Just generally reacting to the Judge's introductory directives to the jury. I'm no apologist for the evil DM or his odious pals, but I do wish the Crown had been able to provide fuller confirmation of a detailed investigation into LB's disappearance from when it occurred during the years up to the arrests. I haven't followed the thread every day so maybe I missed police witnesses? If so, apologies for my being a fuss budget.

What do you think? Is it possible that she could have been entrapped in a web like young people those described in the article. She was described as lovely but often desperately needy girl - fitting the description of victims. (I must say I never before thought of this as being a problem in Canada.) Quite an eye opener.

 

[mimimic]

This was a phenomenal project done by The Star, that I actually was consulted on. Some of those girls were my clients. I work with survivors of human trafficking, sex workers, and victims of gender based violence. What are your thoughts and questions on how it relates to this case? I'm all ears

Oh thank you for being a person who does this work. So good! Is there any type of education done in high schools to educate the "broken", so they know what to look for?

 

[meterclicks]

And once more, Code goes back to his "basic mantra" -- to look at all this in context with the totality of the evidence.
by Adam Carter 3:38 PM

Code says suggestions were put to witnesses by counsel -- the questions on their own cannot be considered evidence, unless the suggestion was adopted by a witness. This is when a lawyer says "I'm going to suggest ...". If the witness doesn't agree, it's not evidence.
by Adam Carter 3:39 PM

Code also says the open and closing addresses aren't, on their own, evidence. They are outlooks and summaries of evidence.
by Adam Carter 3:40 PM

Code says if something in an opening or a closing was contradicted by evidence in the witness box, the jury should go with the evidence itself.
by Adam Carter 3:41 PM

 

[FrannieQ]

Sorry for the double post to Grey-St. Just trying to figure out how to post. DUH. :shame:

 

[Grey-St]

I haven't read the article yet but I will! I always wondered if she ended up being trafficked. The evidence against DM and MS, along with their prior convictions in the TB trial, is pretty damning though. Sadly (or maybe luckily....in a very sad and hard to explain way) it appears that she is dead and was not trafficked

I would agree with you, Shaz14

 

[Nosey Parker]

Thank you for picking up the tweets, meterclicks.

 

[meterclicks]

Code now talking about the agreed statements of facts in the case. He says there were some key ones.
by Adam Carter 3:42 PM

They were:

1. The iPad that Lerner gave to Babcock, had a number and a serial number, and they match the iPad that was found at Smich's home.
2. Babcock has not applied for any name change.
3. Stephan Blazia gave his phone to police, and they searched it. They extracted conversations he had with her, along with a video he shot of Babcock on July 1.
4. The contents of Babcock's medical records related to her mental health were admitted.
5. One of Smich's phone numbers 4168299372. The account was opened by Millard.
6. On May 22, 2013, the police seized an iPad from Smich's home. It had the same serial number as the one Babcock had.
by Adam Carter 3:46 PM

 

[Tealgrove]

Just generally reacting to the Judge's introductory directives to the jury. I'm no apologist for the evil DM or his odious pals, but I do wish the Crown had been able to provide fuller confirmation of a detailed investigation into LB's disappearance from when it occurred during the years up to the arrests. I haven't followed the thread every day so maybe I missed police witnesses? If so, apologies for my being a fuss budget.

What do you think? Is it possible that she could have been entrapped in a web like young people those described in the article. She was described as lovely but often desperately needy girl - fitting the description of victims. (I must say I never before thought of this as being a problem in Canada.) Quite an eye opener.

MOO

They did not call many, if any, TPS Officers to testify and I believe that could be that they would not have been good witnesses for the Crown. TPS did very little, if nothing, when LB was reported missing. Shawn Lerner had to beg them to look into Dellen Millard as LB's final phone calls/texts were to him. They did not look into Dellen Millard.

TPS, I wholeheartedly believe, did nothing because LB was a sex trade worker, had a history of drug use and mental illness. IMHO they figured she lived a risky lifestyle and those types of people go missing all the time, so why bother.

The only LE type witnesses were analysts and forensic types. Most of them came from Hamilton as most of the evidence was collected at the time of the murder of Tim Bosma. TPS didn't investigate anything about Laura until Tim Bosma was murdered and Dellen Millard's name came up and Shawn Lerner went back to TPS to make them aware.

Pretty sad actually.

Again, MOO

 

[Jealoushe]

Just generally reacting to the Judge's introductory directives to the jury. I'm no apologist for the evil DM or his odious pals, but I do wish the Crown had been able to provide fuller confirmation of a detailed investigation into LB's disappearance from when it occurred during the years up to the arrests. I haven't followed the thread every day so maybe I missed police witnesses? If so, apologies for my being a fuss budget.
.

It's a bit difficult, since they didn't really look into her disappearance. It was the search warrant at CNs house, that found the letters, that lead them to investigate. They can't mention that though, because the search warrant was in relation to TB case.

 

[Grey-St]

Just generally reacting to the Judge's introductory directives to the jury. I'm no apologist for the evil DM or his odious pals, but I do wish the Crown had been able to provide fuller confirmation of a detailed investigation into LB's disappearance from when it occurred during the years up to the arrests. I haven't followed the thread every day so maybe I missed police witnesses? If so, apologies for my being a fuss budget.

What do you think? Is it possible that she could have been entrapped in a web like young people those described in the article. She was described as lovely but often desperately needy girl - fitting the description of victims. (I must say I never before thought of this as being a problem in Canada.) Quite an eye opener.

I think it's really interesting and intuitive of you to try and link human trafficking to the LB case. I would agree that she had some of the red flags we look for in my work. However, as someone who has followed this case for years, followed this trial from day one, and who works with those involved in HT, I would conclude that LB is deceased and wasn't involved in HT.

If you want to follow up on the police investigation into LB's disappearance, I would definitely recommend doing so! Some police officers testified at this trial also.

 

[DeaconBrodie]

I'm not sure if the alternates are sent to a separate room until deliberations are complete, thereby available if a juror fails ill. Maybe DeaconBrodie (sp?) can chime in.

Sorry I've been away for a bit and I'm just getting caught up.

My experience is that alternates are usually let go before the deliberations begin. It would be improper to bring an alternate into jury deliberations that had already been going on since they might have missed important discussions.

If a jury member gets sick or has to leave, then there would only be 11 jurors which is fine.

 

[Grey-St]

Oh thank you for being a person who does this work. So good! Is there any type of education done in high schools to educate the "broken", so they know what to look for?

Thank you for the kind words, mimimic! Yes, lots of education is finally being done. I've trained service providers, law enforcement, social workers, teachers, and also spoken in many classrooms and youth groups.

 

[meterclicks]

7. In the spring and summer of 2012, Smich went by the nickname SAY10.
8. A man purchased a home where Mr. Millard's former fiancee had resided. The man took possession of the home a month before the events took place in July. He moved in on June 30. He did not receive an unexplained delivery of a mattress.
9. When searching the Eliminator in May 2013, metal grommets are found inside.
10. When Millard was stopped by police in Spring of 2013 and the vehicle was searched, the police found 3 documents related to the shipment of the Eliminator.
by Adam Carter 3:50 PM

11. The police found a revolver at Millard's home. It had Millard's DNA on it.
12. That same gun was sold on June 24. It had no ammo in it when it was sold.
13. The letters found by police were written by Millard.
14. The police arrested Millard and Smich on April 10, 2014, and charged them with Babcock's murder.
by Adam Carter 3:54 PM