Laura Babcock Murder Trial 12.08.17 - Charge to the Jury - Day 2

[Jealoushe]

How was DM able to say they were burning a deer, without testifying? Would it not be hearsay?

 

[JuneBug67]

How was DM able to say they were burning a deer, without testifying? Would it not be hearsay?

His expert did testify the bones appeared to be more consistent with deer bones than human. And there was the supporting "another dead deer at the farm" text.

 

[Kamille]

Why was Telus keeping those messages on its servers? That I think a real breach of privacy. Unless it was documented somewhere somehow in the contract

Way back in the beginning of cell phone use and service providers, all text and picture messages were saved on the servers for a period of 24-48 hours. It's almost impossible for a service provider to do that these days with the shear volume of text and picture messages being sent. Not sure how old that case is.

MOO

 

[Kamille]

We're in the courtroom now, still waiting on Justice Code.
by Adam Carter 2:35 PM

Justice Code is now in court. The jury is being brought in.
by Adam Carter 2:37 PM

We're now up to page 137 of Code's charge. We're moving away from concepts of law, and into a review of evidence we've heard. "From here on, it's easy," Code says.
by Adam Carter 2:39 PM


Code says this section is long, but he wants to go through it fairly quickly if possible.
by Adam Carter 2:40 PM


"My review will only be a summary of the evidence that seems to me to be important," Code says. " Remember that the evidence and the findings of fact are your province, not mine, and it is your recall of the evidence and what you think is important that matters."
by Adam Carter 2:42 PM


Code is starting with an overview of when Babcock was born, where she grew up, and where she went to school.
by Adam Carter 2:43 PM

 

[Kamille]

Of note in this evidence, "As her father put it, 'There is no way that girl could stay away from a phone.' Her phone records tend to confirm this," Code says.
by Adam Carter 2:44 PM

Code describing some of the relationships between people in this trial. Talking about Andrew Michalski: "Mr. Michalski was Millard's best friend, and they did a lot of conventional male activities together, like off-roading and video gaming."
by Adam Carter 2:47 PM


Code has now said a couple of times that Babcock was always on her phone and on Facebook. This is a key issue in the trial, as she's had zero social media activity in over five years, which the Crown says shows she's dead.
by Adam Carter 2:48 PM

Code is now moving to Babcock's mental health that we've heard: "That she repeatedly reported feelings of extreme anxiety related to a fear of death, that she sometimes described being 'very close to her parents and sometimes 'did not want to live with her parents anymore,' that she sometimes expressed thoughts of self-harm and suicidal thoughts and sometimes 'did not have any suicidal thoughts because she loved live,' that she reported smoking one marijuana joint a day, and that sometimes there were 'conflicts with her parents and sometimes 'her parents had been more understanding.'"
by Adam Carter 2:55 PM


Code is now moving through evidence called "Ms. Babcock's deterioration." This is based on evidence we have heard about Babcock's drug use, and her father saying he noticed a change in his daughter towards the end of 2011 and into early 2012.
by Adam Carter 2:58 PM

 

[Kamille]

Code is now moving into the "catty text messages" between Babcock and Christina Noudga. Noudga had sent a text to Noudga saying "Happy Birthday, it was a year ago today that I slept with Dellen." Babcock replied "That's fine, I slept with him a couple of weeks ago."
by Adam Carter 3:01 PM

 

[FastLikeLight]

Way back in the beginning of cell phone use and service providers, all text and picture messages were saved on the servers for a period of 24-48 hours. It's almost impossible for a service provider to do that these days with the shear volume of text and picture messages being sent. Not sure how old that case is.

MOO

They do this until the message is delivered like to those deep in the woods without a connection. In the mentioned case it looked that messages were kept even after being delivered.

 

[Kamille]

Code is now outlining the earlier stages of the alleged feud between Noudga and Babcock. This is a key point in the Crown's case, as they say it points to motive for Millard, which could factor into intent when it comes to first degree murder.
by Adam Carter 3:03 PM

 

[beedais]

I will try my best to come over to court on Monday morning to deliver a sympathy card and a small gift package....not sure how we can arrange for others to contribute but I am open to any ideas - perhaps meet over the week-end somewhere in downtown Toronto or Toronto West end...just let me know....

Although this is very thoughtful and comes from the best intentions I would be careful. I recall an interview with SB where she stated how hard it was to go out in public and have people share their sympathies with her. Appreciated but led to her having harder breakdowns once she was home and alone where she "didn't have to hold it together."

I know if I were in their position I would appreciate the thought but not (what I as a very private person would see as) the invasion of privacy when my life is already all out for these various forums to pick a part. SB was very vocal and public the Babcock's have not been.

Megan Orr and uncles of Laura's have been active on facebook groups. Perhaps message them first to see if it would be appropriate?

 

[Kamille]

Code also reading out a quote from Noudga to Babcock: "Did you miss your medication today, you're a crazy psycho *****, you're just trying to get with my boyfriend, you had him, you lost him, give it up."
by Adam Carter 3:05 PM

 

[Kamille]

They do this until the message is delivered like to those deep in the woods without a connection. In the mentioned case it looked that messages were kept even after being delivered.

Well yes, they have to keep all information until it is delivered. In the early days, some providers did keep the messages after delivery for anywhere from 24 hours up to 5 days.

ETA: Saw this most often in US cases. Not sure if Canadian providers ever did keep any information after delivery.

ETA2: Looks like Telus was doing this back in 2013 at least. https://www.davidlam.ca/blog/2013/03/telus-records-all-your-texts/

 

[Kamille]

Code now talking about Andrew Michalski's testimony. "Mr. Michalski testified in chief that Mr. Millard would hook up, that is, have sex, with Ms. Babcock during the time period after Mr. Millard was already in a relationship with Ms. Noudga." In his cross examination, Michalski said neither Millard nor Noudga gave an express admission to that effect -- he assumed it.
by Adam Carter 3:07 PM

 

[Kamille]

Code says the "best evidence of the alleged friction between Ms. Noudga, Ms. Babcock and Mr. Millard, and whether or not it was serious, is arguably found in their own text messages to each other."
by Adam Carter 3:12 PM

 

[Kamille]

Code is now summarizing the final time Babcock's parents heard from their daughter, on June 30, 2012. They spoke to her on the phone, before they went out. They then came home to find evidence that she had been there (like dirty dishes), but they never saw her again.
by Adam Carter 3:17 PM

 

[Kamille]

Code also says that Babcock's VISA card records show no purchases or cash advances and bank records show no withdrawals, purchases, or cash advances from June 26 on.
by Adam Carter 3:19 PM

 

[MrsThreadgoode]

I think that what you have stated is likely what the jury will come back with as well.

You will need to carefully read Justice Code's instructions on reasonable doubt when he gets there. I suggest to you that "the most reasonable logical conclusion" does not meet the test for proof beyond a reasonable doubt.

Thank you for your response. I realize that my wording does not meet the test of proof beyond reasonable doubt. I should have worded it much better than I did. [emoji4]

This might be better (or perhaps not): I have no frivolous, speculative, non-evidence based doubt that MS is guilty of M1 based upon the totality of the evidence presented in this trial.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Kamille]

Code is now running through evidence from different witnesses from a few weeks back (former high school friends, etc) who talked about the last time they saw, or heard from, Babcock.
by Adam Carter 3:29 PM

 

[Kamille]

Code is also mentioning that friends of Babcock previously testified that Babcock was using pot and cocaine, and had begun working in the escort business.
by Adam Carter 3:34 PM

 

[Ashley96]

seems like such long pauses between tweets...

Maybe Justice Code should just write his instructions in tweet format...would take much less time to present

 

[billandrew]

[video=youtube;k30ZlQyVvhw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k30ZlQyVvhw[/video]