LE Serves Warrant on Family Home #6

[cluciano63]

BBM: actually, if true, that would mean that a body that had been dead for two hours had been on the floor.

One of our experts said on the last thread that it does NOT take two hours, or even one hour to get a scent...FWIW

 

[JeannaT]

IMHO the first thing LE would do is determine if someone else had died in the home...on or near that spot.

MOO

Mel

I think a cadaver smell could be there for a number of reasons. Decaying pigs, for example, are used to train cadaver dogs because they have the same scent as decaying humans. (The internet is a wonderful resource). Did she go to a pig roast recently where she helped prepare the raw pig for the barbecue? Was she so moved at a funeral that she reached in and hugged the deceased and then tossed her funeral dress on the floor there by her bed?

I don't want to make this a really long post, but I keep coming up with other plausible explanations why there could be cadaver scent on the carpet.

I have a friend who is a hairdresser who does hair for the deceased for open casket funerals. She's been in my home innumerable times - maybe a cadaver dog would hit on my home too?

 

[belimom]

I think she passed out on top of this baby drunk in her bedroom.

That or fell.

What if she were carrying Lisa and fell?

(ETA: Dr. Fessel, while I don't think what you said it *likely*, I do think it's possible. More than anything, I wish I was as certain with what I thought happened here - my mind is all over the place...)

 

[Lera213]

What I learned so far is FBI dogs are so much more superior then a regular Police dog in that what I mean is they have more extensive training therefore their hit rate is extremely off the charts high.

Right?

 

[AlmostGone]

If she was drinking to black out. she didnt care if it was cold or not. moo

I'm kinda wondering if the trip to buy wine and baby food was staged? As if the baby was still alive so buy baby items and wine.. Drink a ton and play wasted black out... Someone stole baby from window and mommys/ daddys hands are wiped clean!? Just a thought...

 

[Geralyn]

There is no link but rather posters using common sense deductive reasoning. MOO

Why would the mother change her time line when she put the baby to bed earlier then what she first stated?

Neighbor goes over there, states to LE she never saw the child, nor DB never went inside to give the baby a bottle, change her, or kiss her goodnight the entire time she was there. Reasonable conclusion as to why DB had to change her timeline so DB can say the reason why was because she put her to bed before Neighbor came over. A BIG MOO but also based on common sense reasoning is all.

Ok so it was just poster opinion/deduction. Thank you.
Mother could have changed her timeline for any number of reasons. That could be one of them though, yes.
There are two very troubling things going on at once. The cadaver dog hit..and the 3 witnesses who saw a man carrying a baby in that vicinity. They could be connected...or not connected at all.
I will look for a thread discussing the man carrying baby.

 

[Tuffy]

:gthanks:

I am having a tough time with the "accident" theories. There is no "covering up" necessary for an accident. Period. I agree that none of us wants to believe this could be anything other than an unfortunate accident or bad decision-making because we cannot really get our heads around the alternatives. The reality though is that 10 month-olds are generally not particularly "fragile" and Lisa's photos all look healthy and normal for her age. It is highly unlikely that a child of this age and health would die from something like falling out of a crib, being dropped by an 8 year old or even having Mom roll over on her.

It is even less believable that should such an unlikely thing happen, that one or both parents would assume it was somehow a good idea to stage an elaborate and logistically difficult kidnapping scenario instead of dealing with it. There are no circumstances under which covering up the death of a child makes any sense unless it is to avoid what you know to be terrible consequences for a terrible act. It isn't a "mistake" to harm a child - it is a crime. I agree with those who are thinking we are watching the excuse-making scenario unfold for the purpose of "claiming" the accident alternative and I am LIVID that the CA case just wrote that playbook out for every child killer that comes after. stepping off of soapbox now.

:rocker::rocker::rocker: Well said, and I couldn't agree more!

 

[jjenny]

If custody is the primary concern it doesn't make much sense to cover up an accident saying you drank yourself silly while in charge of three children. Some ex's might use that as well.

It sure doesn't. She admits to being drunk and any of the exes could come forward now and say they want the kids back. So I fail to see how a custody concern could be the motive to cover something up.

 

[yllek]

I thought Sarx indicated that a dead body starts producing decomposition odor almost immediately and that can be detected even if the body is moved right away (now I see 2 hours before it can be detected).

Me confused. Help! A top-notch HRD dog could detect the odor of decomposition even if the body or decomp fluids had only been present at that location for minutes, right? TIA!

ETA: I see Sarx addressed this upthread. Thanks for confirming Sarx!!

 

[Bon]

(I took an Ativan to keep me calm. )

I took a "Zanny the Nanny" :floorlaugh:

 

[Boodles]

If custody is the primary concern it doesn't make much sense to cover up an accident saying you drank yourself silly while in charge of three children. Some ex's might use that as well.

So true, but Deborah didn't say that until she probably realized they weren't going to fall for her story. So the drunk 'possible blackout' story is a CYA effort. IMO of course.

 

[kalekona]

were for us in the Anthony trial. Your cadaver dog comments had me searching. I found this site which reports on trials and there's a page on Forgys testimony which indicates:



http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/2011/06/casey-anthony-murder-trial-day-12.html

Bones was another dog, not the one used in the Anthony case and he was trained to ALSO hit on blood. Could that have been what you were remembering? I'm trying to understand the cadaver dog reliability and this idea that live human blood causes the same alert is making me crazy ...anyway, you are guilty of making me think about this and I don't know very much about it so it's hurting my head!

I know that during Zahra's case there was discussion about blood vs death when the dogs were hitting on the wood chipper for what it is worth I think they ended up explaining the false hits that way.

Hope that helps-
and while I can't find a link I do know that it only takes minutes after death for a cadaver dog to get a hit.

 

[sorrell skye]

The neighbor reportedly brought her 4 yr old daughter with her, to play with the boys. So I am going to assume that she had to have gone inside a few times to check on the kids. No way a 4, 6 and 8 yr old just sat quietly in the room watching a 'fairy tale' video, and did not require any parental input. imoo

Even if this neighbor had gone into the house to check on her own 4-year-old, it doesn't mean that she saw Baby Lisa during that time.

 

[Lera213]

I took a "Zanny the Nanny" :floorlaugh:

OMG no you didn't! :floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[LancelotLink]

Have we heard from the neighbor who was having adult time with DB?

 

[liz b.]

Kids are terrible with time frames in that sense, they probably were told that she was kidnapped from the beginning and believed it. They probably wouldnt know Sunday from Monday. Especially with all that was going on in the house.

Agreed.But,they would distinguish days by what they did on a certain day...e.g. Sunday they went to the party, and Monday they went to school..MOO So, possibly they would have known Sunday from Monday ? Just a thought...

 

[Donjeta]

I think we are a bit confused because there are two different times involved in scent detection:

-how long the person had been deceased and decomposing
-how long the decomposition had been in contact with the surface

 

[Tuffy]

One of our experts said on the last thread that it does NOT take two hours, or even one hour to get a scent...FWIW

I didn't think so either, that's why I threw in the "if true" disqualifier. Thanks for clearing that up!

 

[Duke Fan4]

Are we talking "pigs in a blanket"?

 

[luckyme]

Have we heard from the neighbor who was having adult time with DB?

no!!!