MISTRIAL MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #19

[Leilei]

It was from a neighbor. The neighbor is also a Canton police officer.

Of course they are.
But, nothing to see here!
Deplorable.
IMO.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Peters live-streaming now.

 

[keek]

It was from a neighbor. The neighbor is also a Canton police officer. He testified along with the other first responders that they improvised as had no proper containers for any evidence. They also found no red plastic light covers, just the drops of blood, which were frozen so scooped up into the cups and placed in a vehicle. He is the one that used his leaf blower to look for evidence before more snow covered anything. I do not believe he is the officer that had the ring camera.

 

[ch_13]

About the phone, my understanding is Higgins disposed of it only after the court ruled in his favour over the protective order. There may of course be many other reasons why he did not want investigators or the D to get hold of it.

Anyway - i only note this because the idea he destroyed evidence is a bit overstated IMO.

I never said destroying his phone was illegal. However, he specifically went to a military base, broke the SIM card and destroyed the phone. You got to admit it’s pretty odd behavior, especially when coupled with everything else. It really suggests there was something on there he didn’t want anyone to ever be able to access.

And while the state order to preserve his phone was denied, there almost certainly would have been a federal subpoena once the FBI started looking into the case. They subpoenaed everyone else’s phone. Could he have been tipped off by one of his pals in the FBI?

 

[keek]

I never said destroying his phone was illegal. However, he specifically went to a military base, broke the SIM card and destroyed the phone. You got to admit it’s pretty odd behavior, especially when coupled with everything else. It really suggests there was something on there he didn’t want anyone to ever be able to access.

And while the state order to preserve his phone was denied, there almost certainly would have been a federal subpoena once the FBI started looking into the case. They subpoenaed everyone else’s phone. Could he have been tipped off by one of his pals in the FBI?

It was the day before the order to preserve was served. He brought his own defense attorney to be with him ON the stand. No innocence anywhere with any of their responses and I don't remembers with the big eyes.

 

[Spectrix]

Seven Jurors now seated

Karen Read trial now has 7 jurors seated after second day

Jury selection continued on Wednesday in Karen Read's high-profile Massachusetts trial, with seven jurors seated so far after two days.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[Leilei]

Seven Jurors now seated

Karen Read trial now has 7 jurors seated after second day

Jury selection continued on Wednesday in Karen Read's high-profile Massachusetts trial, with seven jurors seated so far after two days.

www.cbsnews.com

Going faster than I thought it would.
IMO.

 

[KSwizzle]

so when the crown loses again are they going to waste even more taxpayer mone and go for the threepeat?

 

[keek]

so when the crown loses again are they going to waste even more taxpayer mone and go for the threepeat?

Hope is for justice and evidence of J.O'K was not hit by any vehicle regardless of that timely unfortunate comment used. No DNA of J.O' body on or under the car for one. No matter how hard the judge herself is trying to upend. CW people that were called in had wild explanations of J spinning around many feet without any body injuries, just the terrible and incapacitating head wound in the back of his head primarily, face. Clearly need to watch and listen to everything all say in this upcoming trial, intense. listening and watching factual evidence brought.

 

[Forest_Wood]

What happened in the Karen Read case? A timeline of events

Karen Read's second trial begins April 1.

www.masslive.com

Timeline of events. Very interesting to see it laid out this way. Around Sept 22, 2022, we can see what transpired with BA's and BH's phones.

 

[cocomod]

Again my understanding is when he knew the litigation was coming (motion 15 September), he got a new phone. But he only disposed of his old phone in late October after the motion was denied on 5 October 2022.

Source:

Higgins confirmed that he never received anything in writing canceling or lifting the preservation order for his phone, nor did he consult anyone before disposing of the device.

Karen Read trial: Brian Higgins confirms he threw phone away at military base

Seven witnesses took the stand Tuesday after Higgins's multi-day testimony concluded, including John O'Keefe's adolescent niece and nephew.

www.boston.com

 

[mrjitty]

I never said destroying his phone was illegal. However, he specifically went to a military base, broke the SIM card and destroyed the phone. You got to admit it’s pretty odd behavior, especially when coupled with everything else. It really suggests there was something on there he didn’t want anyone to ever be able to access.

BIB. Right but that is the issue. What? I'd do the same thing he did probably. And I did not murder anyone. Who in their right mind would want the federal government up in their phone for example?

And while the state order to preserve his phone was denied, there almost certainly would have been a federal subpoena once the FBI started looking into the case. They subpoenaed everyone else’s phone. Could he have been tipped off by one of his pals in the FBI?

Why would he need to be tipped off? I realise this will sound contrarian but the defence just tried to get his phone in a court proceeding. If I were his lawyer, I'd be telling him to get rid, if there were anything at all on there. Which could be stuff totally unconnected.

IMO

 

[mrjitty]

It was the day before the order to preserve was served. He brought his own defense attorney to be with him ON the stand. No innocence anywhere with any of their responses and I don't remembers with the big eyes.

I posted the complete timeline.

He got a new phone days after the motion was filed, and a day before he was served with the preservation order. He still had the phone at the time of the 5 october hearing and only disposed of it weeks later in late october.

Of course you would get a new phone when this motion was filed? Otherwise your phone could be seized and you'd have no phone. And you can't change any of the data on the target phone.

I am not defending Higgins but it is important we use the correct info. And if I were advising a client, I'd tell them to get a new phone when this motion was filed - if only because they would not be able to use the target phone for practical purposes.

IMO

 

[mrjitty]

Higgins confirmed that he never received anything in writing canceling or lifting the preservation order for his phone, nor did he consult anyone before disposing of the device.

Karen Read trial: Brian Higgins confirms he threw phone away at military base

Seven witnesses took the stand Tuesday after Higgins's multi-day testimony concluded, including John O'Keefe's adolescent niece and nephew.

www.boston.com

OK but he does say this

Higgins testified that he learned the defense motion had been denied in October and got rid of his old phone “about two months after that,” because it was “beaten” and he’d already gotten a new one.

So he did in fact consult with somebody. In any event my main point was that he did not destroy his phone the day before or the day after the preservation order. It was in fact weeks after the D lost their motion in relation to his phone.


IMO

 

[Tortoise]

The saliva returned with pig DNA as in from dog treats or chews

Do you have a link for saliva?

 

[mrjitty]

It may have been legal but I find it shady. If BH or Procotor were investigating a suspect that did this exact thing, I’d bet they would find it shady as well.

Sure.

I guess where I am headed with it, is what is it proof of?

Heading in to trial, one of my issues with the Defence theories of the case is that they apply one overarching motivation to all the players, when it's quite possible they are just acting in self interested ways. Having rewatched Proctor, that is where I lean with him. I don't think he was involved in a coverup - i think it more likely he's a bad cop who drinks on the job and did a shoddy job because that's the culture of the department so why do more.

That of course is bad enough in it's own right. So we don't actually need to claim BH is a killer. The issue was 7 months later, the CW had never bothered to pursue his phone. But the fact that he still had his phone is exculpatory in my view.

This is why I think the case of a deficient investigation is actually a far stronger argument than the fight theory.

 

[mrjitty]

I would think they've misjudged it, just like a lot of jurors in the first jury thought.

IMO

Yeah - i'd be worried about that if I were the defence as well. We know HB won't put on such a poor case as Lally.

 

[Tortoise]

Yeah - i'd be worried about that if I were the defence as well. We know HB won't put on such a poor case as Lally.

Yes, they've recruited a new accident reconstruction expert and dropped Trooper Paul, I believe.

edited to add link -

Additionally, Dr. Judson Welcher, who has a masters degree and more than a quarter century of experience in accident reconstruction, has been cleared to testify in the new trial for the commonwealth.

The defense wanted Dr. Welcher out, and asked Cannone to bar him from taking the stand.

Cannone denied that request, finding, “Dr. Welcher has the requisite education, training, experience, and familiarity with the subject matter to qualify him as an expert.”

Welcher will replace Trooper Joseph Paul, who filled this role in the first trial and drove Read’s Lexus SUV to recreate sudden acceleration in reverse.

Judge rules accident reconstruction expert can testify in Read retrial, 5 more jurors seated - Boston News, Weather, Sports | WHDH 7News

DEDHAM, MASS. (WHDH) - More progress was made Wednesday in the Karen Read retrial jury selection process. Read is charged with second-degree murder in the<a class="excerpt-read-more"...

whdh.com

 

[Lorenathered]

I'm curious about so much weight being put on the witnesses wouldn't commit perjury. In Chad Daybells trial, his daughter lied on the stand, and was proven right then by body cam that she was lying. Never charged or even fined for it. Can anyone show me a time when someone was actually charged with perjury and got anything more than a fine or a slap on the wrists?

 

[nodamselindistress]

Seriously, witnesses lie on the stand all the time.