MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #20 Retrial

[cocomod]

There are many cases that ring camera has helped police catch the suspect in a lie or shown suspicious activity. Why didn’t they ask door to door for footage? Karen’s PI asked and footage had been deleted, but no forensic team was able to view it first. LE did ask for footage from 1-2am, obviously the wrong time frame. A lot of cases seal the suspect to jail. Think Chris Watts, Kaitlin Armstrong, just to name two. If there was ring camera, it would have shown something that could have helped. Another fail for the non-existent investigation in to his death.

 

[Forest_Wood]

So far no one here has been able to provide proof of this claim.

Care should be exercised not to turn this into a fact, IMO.

Proof of the missing library portion was discussed in an open courtroom by Yannetti and Lally in front of a judge in the above video.

 

[Forest_Wood]

I would think it was a motion-sensor camera, if there were gaps.

That hearing clip is pre-trial. Do you have a clip of the defense raising it at trial? I don't think they did. It wasn't touched on in the defense closing, which was a thorough argument of all the failings and accusations.

IMO

Did you watch the video? Karen's vehicle was captured on the same video system from the library at a different time.

 

[mrjitty]

So far no one here has been able to provide proof of this claim.

Care should be exercised not to turn this into a fact, IMO.

The problem with the Yanetti video is in this version, he says Karen did not arrive home until 12:41, and would have been driving past the library between 12:37 and 12:39 which is the supposedly missing video

But of course the defence will now say she connected to JOKs router at 12:36 - fully 5 mins earlier - so I think this explains why the defence didn't mention this in closing

It's my view there is no missing library footage because she did not drive by between 12:37 and 12:39. Its a zombie that won't die.

MOO

 

[Spectrix]

MA vs Karen Read Trial #2 - Opening Statements expected this Tuesday 22nd April

Soon we will meet again, old friend...

 

[cocomod]

I think this old article sums up a lot of the problems with the investigation from the perspective of a former prosecutor.

Karen Read murder trial: Messy investigation in exposes problems with police work that public rarely sees, experts say

“If there are missteps and sloppiness in a murder investigation involving the death of a police officer, what does that suggest about the process in a more run-of-the-mill case?” one law professor asked.

www.nbcnews.com

Medwed said the revelations about Proctor’s investigation showed what he’s often seen in wrongful convictions — a tendency among investigators to develop “tunnel vision,” or a resistance to pursuing possible evidence or information that doesn’t fit their theory of what happened.

“The way that we see the evidence is tinged by our expectations and our theory of the case,” he said. “It seems as if the police did develop a theory pretty early that Karen Read committed the crime. As the case evolved, there might have been other avenues of investigation that they didn’t pursue.”

 

[Tortoise]

Proof of which claim?

That the video was deleted.

 

[Tortoise]

Proof of the missing library portion was discussed in an open courtroom by Yannetti and Lally in front of a judge in the above video.

But that was pre-trial. If it wasn't raised at trial it was no longer an issue.

 

[Tortoise]

The problem with the Yanetti video is in this version, he says Karen did not arrive home until 12:41, and would have been driving past the library between 12:37 and 12:39 which is the supposedly missing video

But of course the defence will now say she connected to JOKs router at 12:36 - fully 5 mins earlier - so I think this explains why the defence didn't mention this in closing

It's my view there is no missing library footage because she did not drive by between 12:37 and 12:39. Its a zombie that won't die.

MOO

So maybe she didn't go past the library then, because she would have been in an earlier portion they haven't claimed to be missing?

 

[mrjitty]

So maybe she didn't go past the library then, because she would have been in an earlier portion they haven't claimed to be missing?

Yes it's self evident IMO. The two mins were the perfect window for the 12.41 arrival. But at trial it became clear that 12.36 is the arrival, so you can't maintain the argument.

This illustrates Yanetti's skill to attempt to exploit the "missing video" in this way. But of course the alternative is she never drove past the library. And lucky for the defendant, testimony by counsel is not admissible trial evidence - even though he point blank claimed it as a fact!

For me the much more interesting question is what the defendant was doing between 12.36 and 12.41

 

[Forest_Wood]

For me the much more interesting question is what the defendant was doing between 12.36 and 12.41

I'd say the same things we all might do when we arrive home in our cars, like possibly sitting in her vehicle checking her phone, texting JOK (again), shutting off the vehicle, collecting her belongings to bring inside, getting out of her vehicle, closing the door, walking through the garage, unlocking the access door to enter the home, and so on. Some say she was drunk at that time, which would make her even slower at doing any of the above but 5 minutes isn't a very long time to enter a home after arriving and parking your car, etc.
What did the trial claim she was doing during those 5 minutes?

 

[jepop]

MA vs Karen Read Trial #2 - Opening Statements expected this Tuesday 22nd April

Soon we will meet again, old friend...
View attachment 580475

@Spectrix, what's the forecast for April/May in Massachusetts? Hot enough to crank her up? I didn't watch the pre-trial hearing last week. Anyone notice if the old girl was running ? Maybe she's always on for circulation because I understand this court room is pretty small. Like you I spent a lot if time eyeballing those blades during trial X 1.

 

[jepop]

Yes it's self evident IMO. The two mins were the perfect window for the 12.41 arrival. But at trial it became clear that 12.36 is the arrival, so you can't maintain the argument.

This illustrates Yanetti's skill to attempt to exploit the "missing video" in this way. But of course the alternative is she never drove past the library. And lucky for the defendant, testimony by counsel is not admissible trial evidence - even though he point blank claimed it as a fact!

For me the much more interesting question is what the defendant was doing between 12.36 and 12.41

Why? I think if you look at the call records she was probably dialing John?. She connected with wifi at 12.36 but she may still have been driving at that minute and pulling into the driveway, waiting for the garage to open, dialing on her phone. Wifi usually has a small range and Karen needn't have been in the driveway necessarily when her phone connected. Moo

 

[Spectrix]

@Spectrix, what's the forecast for April/May in Massachusetts? Hot enough to crank her up? I didn't watch the pre-trial hearing last week. Anyone notice if the old girl was running ? Maybe she's always on for circulation because I understand this court room is pretty small. Like you I spent a lot if time eyeballing those blades during trial X 1.

Forecast for April/May in Canton MA seems to be daytime max of around 70*f (21*c).

I think they'll have the fan for circulation as you say. No need for the noisy AC which apparently is not agreeable with audio recordings.

Trial #1 was in summer (June July).

 

[nodamselindistress]

Great news re: weather forecast!

 

[Forest_Wood]

I think this old article sums up a lot of the problems with the investigation from the perspective of a former prosecutor.

Karen Read murder trial: Messy investigation in exposes problems with police work that public rarely sees, experts say

“If there are missteps and sloppiness in a murder investigation involving the death of a police officer, what does that suggest about the process in a more run-of-the-mill case?” one law professor asked.

www.nbcnews.com

Medwed said the revelations about Proctor’s investigation showed what he’s often seen in wrongful convictions — a tendency among investigators to develop “tunnel vision,” or a resistance to pursuing possible evidence or information that doesn’t fit their theory of what happened.

“The way that we see the evidence is tinged by our expectations and our theory of the case,” he said. “It seems as if the police did develop a theory pretty early that Karen Read committed the crime. As the case evolved, there might have been other avenues of investigation that they didn’t pursue.”

"Proctor presents a serious problem for the state’s case, said Roemer, the former prosecutor turned defense attorney in Dallas.

“Everything about Trooper Proctor was a problem,” she said. “He shouldn’t have been involved in this case. He should have taken himself out because he knew people that were witnesses in this case.”

To avoid a potential conflict of interest, state police led the investigation into O’Keefe’s death. But Proctor damaged that effort by sharing details about the case with others, Roemer said.

“When you have somebody like Trooper Proctor going around telling everybody in town intimate details of the investigation, you’re compromising it,” Roemer said. “Even if there’s not a conspiracy, you’re compromising it. He does not know who these people are talking to. But what he does know is that the people that he’s talking to know the people that live inside of the house where this happened.”

I just don't see how the CW is going to get around Proctor's incompetence in Trial 2. Some don't recognize how detrimental Proctor's conduct was to this case. He caused so much harm, not only to this case and KR's right to a fair trial and JOK's right to justice, but to the image of the MSP, his co-workers, and others. Proctor will never ever work as a police officer again. He was in his prime career years with an excellent income and with some prestige/status. He's now a has-been. What kind of job will he get now? He is a disgrace, particularly since he apparently doesn't recognize the damage he's caused here.

MOO

 

[iusedtofloat]

The man was fired for having instincts. He pegged Karen Read for exactly who she is and what she did, sharing his opinion with, out of state friends.

Standing up for blatant sexism and misogyny as a woman is... definitely an interesting choice, Linda

 

[mrjitty]

Why? I think if you look at the call records she was probably dialing John?. She connected with wifi at 12.36 but she may still have been driving at that minute and pulling into the driveway, waiting for the garage to open, dialing on her phone. Wifi usually has a small range and Karen needn't have been in the driveway necessarily when her phone connected. Moo

I doubt it is very relevant to the trial but I do find it curious

If we accept 12.24 as arrival at Fairview and 12.36 (connection to the Wifi) as approx arrival at JOK's there is a lot less fairview waiting time available than the defendant claims in "Body in the Snow". Especially she says she called him before she left - but that first call was at 12.33 so she was already on the way home by that time.

So i find it interesting that she must have left sooner than in BitS version and there is 5 mins between arrival, and the voice mail with car in the garage

 

[Derph]

The lack of evidence from cameras across from and beside BA's home is being questioned due to frustration and disbelief that it doesn't appear LE canvassed the neighbors to discover evidence.
I find it hard to believe that not one of those neighbors was able to provide any video evidence and harder to believe that the Alberts had no video camera installed and even left their doors unlocked frequently according to BA and NA testimony. I guess they simply had no fear, given their status in their society over the years. "Nothing to see here folks."

There's a video posted on Youtube done by TB (can be searched using 'views from 31 and 33 Fairview' since I don't think I'm allowed to post here). He goes out and sees cameras at both 31 and 33 Fairview, so it looks like there were indeed cameras around that could have caught activity. But like others have said, it seems nothing of consequence was picked up by their cameras, otherwise it should have been presented at trial 1.

The question for me is, in 2025, where Big Brother is watching everything and everybody everywhere, where is all the relevant video evidence of timelines showing what actually occurred that night?!? KR has been accused of deleting parts of JOK's video which I might believe if the library video wasn't also deleted, and the sally port video wasn't also inverted, and if that neighborhood had been canvassed adequately.

MOO

If it was just the camera not picking up anything from across the street, it's no big deal. But very early on in this case someone leaked to the press and the press reported that there was indisputable evidence on camera of the incident. That never materialized, but the damage in the public eye had been done. That alone was enough for people to believe Karen hit John.

Then we come to find out that other video or cam footage from key places around Canton mysteriously disappeared, was recorded over, didn't work, was manipulated, was never looked for or was turned off. Furthermore why were interviews with the key players who were at 34 Fairview that night NOT RECORDED??? Why was KR's car not photographed before it was hauled off to the Canton PD ( which in and of itself BS as there was a very blatant conflict of interests because of the Albert's connections there!)

So in a vacuum, no it's not that big a deal that the Ring Cam across the street perhaps didn't pick up anything. But when looked at in conjunction with all video evidence above, it becomes a problem. What are the odds of all those things happening to so many different cameras in all the exact places where so much pertaining to this case happened? It doesn't pass the smell test for me and 1000's of other people who believe something just isn't right here.

 

[Spectrix]

“The way that we see the evidence is tinged by our expectations and our theory of the case,” he said. “It seems as if the police did develop a theory pretty early that Karen Read committed the crime. As the case evolved, there might have been other avenues of investigation that they didn’t pursue.”

They failed to pursue what actually happened to Officer O'Keefe, and as such, justice is very unlikely to ever see the light of day. The corruption and conduct of the criminal justice system in this case is completely obscene.