VERDICT WATCH MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #35 Retrial

[less0305]

We have a lot of that here but when you look at the totality of the evidence, there was no vehicle strike. His body and the X-rays proved that.

I happen to believe he was hit by her vehicle.

 

[rescuemom]

They should NOT be able to charge her with OUI, as there was no breathalyzer/blood draw at the scene. The BAC serum conversion used to estimate the BAC at the time of the alleged incident is basically an estimation.
ETA: moo

Especially if she was not behind the wheel of a vehicle at the time of arrest. I knew of someone who had a problem with alcohol many years ago. He sought treatment for it, and the doctor told him that he did not process the alcohol like other people do. He was told that he could stop drinking at a certain time have his blood alcohol checked and three hours later have his blood alcohol checked again and it would be higher three hours later.
If she had her blood drawn when they took her to the emergency room at approximately 7 o’clock in the morning, she was 7+ hours since she had had a drink??. Unless she drank after she got home. KK testified that she did not appear at all intoxicated when she talked with her at the bar.

 

[Snoods]

I bet when AJ is getting frisky with his wife she may occasionally say to him “I’ll allow it this time,” with a huge sigh.

It may be trial lore but AJ may have told Judge Cannone “There isn’t a Dog Bite University!” about his exasperation in getting in an approved dog bite expert.

Law and Crime had a short clip of Yanetti and Alessi walking into the courthouse one morning and someone yelled “We love you Yanetti!” and Alessi good-naturedly yelled back “Everyone loves Yanetti!” It was funny.

 

[missy1974]

I wonder if her MS or Chron's could affect those results?
IMO.

I’m sure it could… especially if she is on meds that could affect her liver. MOO

So many meds do affect the liver.
I remember having to get monthly blood tests for some of mine years ago.
IMO.

I don't know if the disease itself can cause the results to be 'off', but, metabolizing alcohol and pretty much everything could be.

Crohn's, the meds, have a huge impact on the liver. If my husband took a blood test today, a doc would look at it and think he was an alcoholic. He has a drink or 2 maybe 2 times a year. That's it. It is really hard on the liver for whatever reason.

I haven't commented on her medical issues much, but I am familiar with the disease, I am familiar with an ileostomy (a bag). Even if she had a few drinks that night, it's most likely why she had an upset stomach and I could see some 'urgency' in wanting to get home. I will say JMO but... if you know anyone that has had to have a ileostomy or colostomy, you know this too.

 

[less0305]

You seem to not believe that the SUV or the tail light could cause the damage to his arm?
The CW fought hard against a dog/animal (animal could be a bear/wolf/owl/whatever), so that is interesting. They have insisted that the tail light caused those injuries, well.. kinda unless you watch Rentschler's cross exam lol

I think that was a huge mistake on the CW's part. They should have argued it could just as easily been another animal.

 

[Maat99]

Those are your opinions. There was no eyewitness or a video of a dog attacking him. There is no evidence "all happened inside the house." Do you know the specific time he died, versus when an animal attacked him? He could have still been alive for some time and in that time he laid on the lawn in the process of dying he could have been attacked by a wild animal.

Looks like the wild animals roaming the streets of Canton are raccoons, skunks, squirrels, bats and woodchucks. Hard to believe one of those ran out during a party and attacked JOK in the middle of the lawn but to each his own.
Anyhow, the one thing we can be sure of is that JOK wasn’t hit by a car. Not a single mark on him that would indicate a car strike according to both CS and defense experts. There is as much evidence for a car strike as there is for a Bigfoot attack. Jmo.

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[missy1974]

What do you mean?

How did the tail light break? What body part had to have come into contact with that tail light for it to break to the extent it did?

Reminder... a full on collision at 29mph shattered the red part of the tail light but NOT the diffusers inside (the diffusers were smashed in Karen's SUV), threw the body backwards many feet and would have caused significant injuries to any human body.

So, what broke her tail light to the extent it was broken?

 

[less0305]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>

I'm not a Dr., but it's my belief his head was struck.

 

[nightowl1975]

I Believe those to be dog injuries , so knowing the back was fenced .HE had to go inside the house.
HAD TO HAVE.

If one believes they are dog injuries, it doesn’t matter much where they happened. The story we’ve been fed isn’t true. IMO. I also believe they’re dog injuries.

 

[missy1974]

As I stated earlier - Do you know how long JO laid on the lawn before he died? How long did it take him to die? If the exact time of death came out in trial, I missed that.

the time of death was not revealed. BUT doctors for both sides testified that he would have been immediately incapacitated and would not have ended up on the grass if he was hit on the head on the road.

He may have had some involuntary movements, but no meaningful movements/fine motor skills.

 

[less0305]

I understand I am in the minority here. I'm sure you will all get your wish of a not guilty verdict. And if that's the case, then I'll settle for the fact that KR at least has had to sit in a courtroom and go through the process. And perhaps the next guy she sets her sights on will have seen or read <modsnip> and steer clear of her.

 

[nightowl1975]

I'm not a Dr., but it's my belief his head was struck.

Ok, so if the SUV tail light hit his head, we know his head had a gash on it. Head wounds bleed. A lot. The scalp is very vascular. So where the blood on the tail light pieces?

 

[missy1974]

I understand I am in the minority here. I'm sure you will all get your wish of a not guilty verdict. And if that's the case, then I'll settle for the fact that KR at least has had to sit in a courtroom and go through the process. And perhaps the next guy she sets her sights on will have seen or read <modsnip> and steer clear of her.

It's hard to be the minority. I've been there and done that haha

It seems as though it wouldn't matter what testimony you heard, you would still believe she was guilty, it is what it is

I am not so sure that 12 people can agree on guilty or not guilty, a hung jury would be a shame for all involved IMO and would be a bigger shame if the CW decided to try her for a 3rd time. IMO

 

[missy1974]

Ok, so if the SUV tail light hit his head, we know his head had a gash on it. Head wounds bleed. A lot. The scalp is very vascular. So where the blood on the tail light pieces?

Dr. Rentschler testified.. it was just not possible, I recall him turning his head on the stand haha trying to show how it just doesn't work at all. And I still don't think it would have smashed the inside of the tail light .. the diffusers.

I don't know if that was an ARCCA theory that they tested or a CW theory? but .. it wasn't even really hinted at by the CW this trial. It just wasn't posslble.

 

[jepop]

the time of death was not revealed. BUT doctors for both sides testified that he would have been immediately incapacitated and would not have ended up on the grass if he was hit on the head on the road.

He may have had some involuntary movements, but no meaningful movements/fine motor skills.

Seriously, what would the back of a human head look like after impacting with a tail light with enough force to smash it into 47 pieces and destroy the diffusers? 1) the skull would be indented, which was not the case here, we know that from all the medicos 2) massive skull trauma, crushing, blood, broken neck. IMO

 

[missy1974]

Seriously, what would the back of a human head look like after impacting with a tail light with enough force to smash it into 47 pieces and destroy the diffusers? 1) the skull would be indented, which was not the case here, we know that from all the medicos 2) massive skull trauma, crushing, blood, broken neck. IMO

I don't know how much force it would take... the full on body hit at 29mph backwards didn't do it... and the defense didn't have unlimited funds to keep going.

The diffusers not breaking is a big thing. I knew it as soon as Dr. Wolfe said it. There is a reason that Wolfe and Rentschler were 100% convinced he was not hit by a vehicle.

 

[ShadyLady]

I understand I am in the minority here. I'm sure you will all get your wish of a not guilty verdict. And if that's the case, then I'll settle for the fact that KR at least has had to sit in a courtroom and go through the process. And perhaps the next guy she sets her sights on will have seen or read <modsnip> and steer clear of her.

So you don't like her on a personal level. Like Officer Proctor?

 

[waldojabba]

I understand I am in the minority here. I'm sure you will all get your wish of a not guilty verdict. And if that's the case, then I'll settle for the fact that KR at least has had to sit in a courtroom and go through the process. And perhaps the next guy she sets her sights on will have seen or read <modsnip> and steer clear of her.

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped>

Did you watch the trial ?
Unless the jury votes contrary to the rule of law - on their emotions - thinking that she is perhaps a nutcase and probably did it - then there will be a not guilty verdict.
I am not sure how anyone can say she is legally beyond a reasonable doubt guilty.
It would be contrary to the legal standard. The prosecution admitted they had no idea when where or how she hit him. That sound like proof to you?
There may be a few jurors that cannot get by their “ intuition” or emotion so perhaps a mistrial hung jury.

JMO

 

[nightowl1975]

Dr. Rentschler testified.. it was just not possible, I recall him turning his head on the stand haha trying to show how it just doesn't work at all. And I still don't think it would have smashed the inside of the tail light .. the diffusers.

I don't know if that was an ARCCA theory that they tested or a CW theory? but .. it wasn't even really hinted at by the CW this trial. It just wasn't posslble.

I agree. There’s no way the vehicle hit him in the back of his head like that. Which leaves the arm. If not the arm, then what?

And if the diffusers are all smashed, how was there any light at all from that tail light in the videos?

 

[Izzylizzy]

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