MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #4

[I am not Sherlock H.]

I’ll acknowledge and show how little I know of this case - Is it the case the victim JOK was not wearing a jacket or sleeved-shirt at the time of his death? Is it known if anything was covering his right arm at the time it received the injuries? MOO

 

[Wishbone]

I’ll acknowledge and show how little I know of this case - Is it the case the victim JOK was not wearing a jacket or sleeved-shirt at the time of his death? Is it known if anything was covering his right arm at the time it received the injuries? MOO

I haven't seen any of that information addressed. I would have to add some items that appear to be missing. One shoe, one ball cap, and I've also heard possibly a belt, not sure. JMO

 

[Charlot123]

.

What does Brian Higgins destroying his phone prove?

Let us take "conspiracy" out of equation and discuss other possible practical reasons.

All I know about BH and that comes from his communication with KR, is that he was unmarried and seemingly unattached in January of 2022. And then he was asked to forward his cellphone. Why didn't he? JMO:

- he might have had personal communications with several people via his phone and didn't want anyone to see them
- he could have ordered something via his phone and didn't want people to see the nature of the order?
- he did not know how much could be extracted from his phone and had some apps (nothing wrong - finances, for example) and didn't want random people to get access to them or passwords.

- last to type, but first thing that came to mind when i put myself in his shoes. He may have friends living outside of Canton and totally unrelated to KR's case. Imagine these friends sharing their deeply personal information with him via texts. Sometimes we protect friends' secrets better than own.

If BH is uninvolved in any conspiracy (and I suspect he isn't), he knows that his alibi can be established. But as any human, he doesnt want all his life to be out there because he had the misfortune to be in BA's house that night.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

I haven't seen any of that information addressed. I would have to add some items that appear to be missing. One shoe, one ball cap, and I've also heard possibly a belt, not sure. JMO

Thanks wishbone…. appreciate it!

Those arm injuries…… very confusing. And also wanted to add that after working on cars etc. for over 50 years (personal hobby and repairs) those injuries sure are puzzling. And we already know what the FBI says of them, and what did not apparently contribute to them, and I concur with their assessment.

And if those other items are missing, one might surmise the victim was moved perhaps from a location of an earlier incident? Did a snowplow possibly hit or run over the victim?

I sure hope someone attempts to reconstruct how those injuries (and any others sustained by JOK) were sustained. To ‘prove’ or disprove the theory of the case. Or, illustrate what could not have done it. (I know….. not really possible to prove a negative.) MOO

 

[ch_13]

.

Let us take "conspiracy" out of equation and discuss other possible practical reasons.

All I know about BH and that comes from his communication with KR, is that he was unmarried and seemingly unattached in January of 2022. And then he was asked to forward his cellphone. Why didn't he? JMO:

- he might have had personal communications with several people via his phone and didn't want anyone to see them
- he could have ordered something via his phone and didn't want people to see the nature of the order?
- he did not know how much could be extracted from his phone and had some apps (nothing wrong - finances, for example) and didn't want random people to get access to them or passwords.

- last to type, but first thing that came to mind when i put myself in his shoes. He may have friends living outside of Canton and totally unrelated to KR's case. Imagine these friends sharing their deeply personal information with him via texts. Sometimes we protect friends' secrets better than own.

If BH is uninvolved in any conspiracy (and I suspect he isn't), he knows that his alibi can be established. But as any human, he doesnt want all his life to be out there because he had the misfortune to be in BA's house that night.

Higgins isn't just "some guy". He's a federal agent. That means that that he has a responsibility to not just avoid wrongdoing, but also the appearance of wrongdoing. He went to a military base and destroyed his phone. No matter how that's spun, it is extremely suspect behavior.

And the fact that his superiors have apparently put him on desk duty suggests that this isn't just some conspiracy theory, but they have a real concern about the actions he has taken.

edit - And let's be real. If Karen Read had destroyed her phone, the people defending Higgins would have been jumping all over this as proof she was guilty.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

.

Let us take "conspiracy" out of equation and discuss other possible practical reasons.

All I know about BH and that comes from his communication with KR, is that he was unmarried and seemingly unattached in January of 2022. And then he was asked to forward his cellphone. Why didn't he? JMO:

- he might have had personal communications with several people via his phone and didn't want anyone to see them
- he could have ordered something via his phone and didn't want people to see the nature of the order?
- he did not know how much could be extracted from his phone and had some apps (nothing wrong - finances, for example) and didn't want random people to get access to them or passwords.

- last to type, but first thing that came to mind when i put myself in his shoes. He may have friends living outside of Canton and totally unrelated to KR's case. Imagine these friends sharing their deeply personal information with him via texts. Sometimes we protect friends' secrets better than own.

If BH is uninvolved in any conspiracy (and I suspect he isn't), he knows that his alibi can be established. But as any human, he doesnt want all his life to be out there because he had the misfortune to be in BA's house that night.

Did BH perhaps have a separate phone for work use and another for personal use? Has that been clarified or entered into evidence?

If I was working a rather high profile job, including perhaps a federal or governmental role, I assuredly would use separate phones for those purposes. In fact, several of my friends and acquaintances do so for the very reason to keep certain elements separate.

And I wonder about all of the other individuals and ‘officials’ involved in the case. MOO

 

[Wishbone]

Did BH perhaps have a separate phone for work use and another for personal use? Has that been clarified or entered into evidence?

If I was working a rather high profile job, including perhaps a federal or governmental role, I assuredly would use separate phones for those purposes. In fact, several of my friends and acquaintances do so for the very reason to keep certain elements separate.

And I wonder about all of the other individuals and ‘officials’ involved in the case. MOO

BH did testify that he had a work phone and personal phone and explained where he placed them at night.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

BH did testify that he had a work phone and personal phone and explained where he placed them at night.

Interesting, and thank you! Then which one did he apparently destroy?

And was it determined if perhaps both had been altered or ‘manipulated’ (my choice of words). MOO

 

[turaj]

WHAT A DAY!!

It was overheard in a YouTube court stream that KR approached the stand at the end because AJ can’t be in court to finish cross on Tuesday, and Karen had to sign off on Yanetti taking over for the one day they’re in court next week.
Jmo

WEll that is a bummer and I am sure they are not happy about that.

 

[Wishbone]

Interesting, and thank you! Then which one did he apparently destroy?

And was it determined if perhaps both had been altered or ‘manipulated’ (my choice of words). MOO

snipped
“You’ve destroyed that phone, haven’t you?” Jackson asked.
“No, I threw the phone away,” Higgins said.
“Well, that’s destroying the phone, isn’t it?” Jackson countered.

Higgins confirmed that he received a notice on Sept. 30, 2022, preventing him from altering or destroying anything on his cellphone. Jackson noted that Higgins previously testified at another hearing that he changed phone carriers and phone numbers on the 29th, one day prior to receiving the protective order.

Karen Read trial: Defense grills Brian Higgins on the fate of his cellphone, SIM card

Believe it was his personal phone because I can't see him doing all that with a work phone.JMO

 

[Dre]

My thoughts about the judge-

She always cuts off court due to the clock, she’s showing respect for the jurors and their time, no matter which team is presenting.

She doesn’t sustain objections because she’s biased, she’s very picky about the form of the question.
I’m watching on a lawyer’s stream who’s been labeling each objection and it seems to track.
I think Lally is better at sticking with the correct form, but when he starts leading too much she sustains objections against him.

AJ is a slick lawyer who editorializes and adds lots of drama and speculation, on top of passion, which she does not prefer, with some good reason. He’s aggressive and provocative, and while I might enjoy it, the judge has to rein him in, because he won’t himself.


The part that really gets me is that she pushed this to trial amid FBI investigation… when all parties are asking for a stay? Prosecution included?!? I can’t wrap my mind around why and that leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth.

Moo!

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

snipped
“You’ve destroyed that phone, haven’t you?” Jackson asked.
“No, I threw the phone away,” Higgins said.
“Well, that’s destroying the phone, isn’t it?” Jackson countered.

Higgins confirmed that he received a notice on Sept. 30, 2022, preventing him from altering or destroying anything on his cellphone. Jackson noted that Higgins previously testified at another hearing that he changed phone carriers and phone numbers on the 29th, one day prior to receiving the protective order.

Karen Read trial: Defense grills Brian Higgins on the fate of his cellphone, SIM card

Believe it was his personal phone because I can't see him doing all that with a work phone.JMO

Thank you! Quite a revelation there IMO.

And BH apparently changed phone carriers and phone numbers one day prior to having received the order! Wow…..

And one would surmise too, all the relevant or ‘good stuff’ (my words) for this KR case and that evening in Canton likely would have been on the personal phone IMO.

Quite the cast of characters in this case it seems. MOO

Now wondering just what supposed vehicle IIRC BH was believed to have moved that morning of the incident with JOK? MOO

 

[ch_13]

My thoughts about the judge-

She always cuts off court due to the clock, she’s showing respect for the jurors and their time, no matter which team is presenting.

She doesn’t sustain objections because she’s biased, she’s very picky about the form of the question.
I’m watching on a lawyer’s stream who’s been labeling each objection and it seems to track.
I think Lally is better at sticking with the correct form, but when he starts leading too much she sustains objections against him.

AJ is a slick lawyer who editorializes and adds lots of drama and speculation, on top of passion, which she does not prefer, with some good reason. He’s aggressive and provocative, and while I might enjoy it, the judge has to rein him in, because he won’t himself.


The part that really gets me is that she pushed this to trial amid FBI investigation… when all parties are asking for a stay? Prosecution included?!? I can’t wrap my mind around why and that leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth.

Moo!

People talk about her behavior in the courtroom and the way she handles objections. Personally, I don't think that's a big deal. I think the biggest issue in this trial is allowing in all the talk of harassment, which is a totally separate issue from the charges in front of the jury. I bet that if Karen Read is convicted, that will be the first item in the motion to appeal.

IMO, her behavior in pre-trial hearings was a lot more suspect. She sat on a lot of the defense motions to compel for months and let the DA drag their feet on turning over discovery. She also denied a lot of defense motions for evidence from the witnesses, which allowed them to keep their phones from being investigated or to avoid turning over video cam footage, etc. Then as the trial deadline approached she suddenly changed tacks and started pushing both sides to try the case ASAP.

I don't know if the judge is corrupt per se, but I think she's a townie through and through and doesn't like having these carpetbagger defense lawyers show up in her cozy little world. She's likely a player in local politics, knows all the important people in Norfolk County and may have further political ambitions.

 

[shotgun09]

It is the magical and mysteriously missing Sally-port video during the arrival time and evidence collection of KR's vehicle that has me sitting on the edge of my seat. Just HOW does a Police Department's security cam suddenly become disabled at the precise time needed? And, WHO would have access to that?? It surely was suggested that Higgins was right there !

Goodness, Lally ! Bring on the Evidence !!! Show the CW of MA the proper technique of full and complete evidence collection, used by the Canton PD and staties that will convince us all. Well ??? We are waiting....

 

[Dre]

People talk about her behavior in the courtroom and the way she handles objections. Personally, I don't think that's a big deal. I think the biggest issue in this trial is allowing in all the talk of harassment, which is a totally separate issue from the charges in front of the jury. I bet that if Karen Read is convicted, that will be the first item in the motion to appeal.

IMO, her behavior in pre-trial hearings was a lot more suspect. She sat on a lot of the defense motions to compel for months and let the DA drag their feet on turning over discovery. She also denied a lot of defense motions for evidence from the witnesses, which allowed them to keep their phones from being investigated or to avoid turning over video cam footage, etc. Then as the trial deadline approached she suddenly changed tacks and started pushing both sides to try the case ASAP.

I don't know if the judge is corrupt per se, but I think she's a townie through and through and doesn't like having these carpetbagger defense lawyers show up in her cozy little world. She's likely a player in local politics, knows all the important people in Norfolk County and may have further political ambitions.

any chance that politically, for the judge, it would be best if a jury of her peers acquits KR so the whole damn thing is just out of her hands?

 

[shotgun09]

any chance that politically, for the judge, it would be best if a jury of her peers acquits KR so the whole damn thing is just out of her hands?

IMO, yes! And if so, wouldn't that be another injustice to Karen Read? The cost of securing her freedom has to be astronomical about now. And for no reason, other than protecting a politicized player in all this? Some, call this phenom " Lawfare".

MOO

 

[turaj]

any chance that politically, for the judge, it would be best if a jury of her peers acquits KR so the whole damn thing is just out of her hands?

I wondered about her obvious bias and looked up to see that judges are appointed. While it does not negate the political undertones at least she is not up for reelection soon.

 

[HarmonyE.]

If BH is uninvolved in any conspiracy (and I suspect he isn't), he knows that his alibi can be established. But as any human, he doesnt want all his life to be out there because he had the misfortune to be in BA's house that night.

As this is trial is apparently real life and not a movie, I'm not spoiler warning.

There is much more to come with BH on Tuesday with regard to the sallyport, Kenny the Canton Police Chief, and Karen's car. AJ was setting it up yesterday.

He ain't no unfortunate one.

 

[ch_13]

any chance that politically, for the judge, it would be best if a jury of her peers acquits KR so the whole damn thing is just out of her hands?

Honestly, considering how decisive this case has been within Norfolk County I think the judge blew any chance she had. If she had hoped to run for County DA to replace Morrissey, I don't think there's any way she'll win a primary now.

In fact, I think Morrissey could be in trouble himself. He's up for election in 2026 and I wouldn't be surprised to see him retire. Or if not he'll likely face a primary challenger.

 

[jepop]

As this is trial is apparently real life and not a movie, I'm not spoiler warning.

There is much more to come with BH on Tuesday with regard to the sallyport, Kenny the Canton Police Chief, and Karen's car. AJ was setting it up yesterday.

He ain't no unfortunate one.

Oh, Thank G for that. Thought BH cross was done on Friday (come back @arielilane ). In a way it might be good for defense to have the days of prep time for what's coming. Yanetti can practice 'asking in the right way'. Personally I kind of like Yanetti.