MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #5

[Wishbone]

If the evidence shows she did it, of course she can be sent to prison.

re: her behavior that night. I 100% agree. I just don't see an "innocent" explanation for it. She definitely knew something was up beyond "John wasn't home."

If the police officers and detectives didn’t follow proper rules of evidence and procedure during the investigation then evidence they claim to have is moot. MOO

Crime Scene Investigation

https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/178280.pdf

 

[Wellrox]

I'm fairly new in following this case so I'm hoping you guys might be able to help with a few questions I have re: JM's phone search history.

So far as I can tell, there were multiple "how long to die in cold" searches, with the history showing one at 2:27am and the next at 6:23am (when JM purports she was told to search this). JM states she used the same tab she had open from browsing previously and was looking up stuff for her daughter's basketball (or something to that effect).

1) Why was there no other browser history shared? Did she literally only search these phrases and didn't click on a single link?

2) If she is being truthful in stating she was looking at something else at 2:27a and used the same tab to perform the first search, where is the browser history of her looking at basketball stuff?

3) Have there been attempts by the prosecution or otherwise to replicate what JM is stating happened (using a stale tab to perform a search thereby creating an incorrect timestamp)?

TIA for any help or guidance! Happy to read further into something if I can be pointed in the right direction.

 

[nodamselindistress]

I do not believe we have seen any evidence of browser history yet, so really can't answer your questions. Stay tuned, the CW may provide evidence in July or August if we're lucky!

 

[Wishbone]

one thing that stuck out in some reading or testimony is that KR's parents warned her about the situation. I think she told them it was tough and that she was in this pseudo parenting role not because she wanted it but she wanted to date JO. They warned her to think about getting out if things were not going well. I can imagine things were tough in that house with KR there. Kids probably said more than once "you are not our mother" and bet it was not easy for JO either. Part of the issue per their conversations were that they were not getting help from the rest of the fam....I think about that as I watch Paul sitting there in court.

Where is this information coming from? Do you have a link? TYIA

 

[acutename]

BH wasn't an undercover agent. Everyone knew he worked for ATF. In fact, he had just come back from a police funeral. And he spent his free time hanging around in bars with his cop buddies. An undercover agent would never publicly associate with other LE.

This was his personal phone and should not have had anything secret or official on it. BH also had a separate work phone. There was no reason for him to go to a military base to destroy it and he didn't do that in any official capacity.

I'm not sure what legal issues you think are at stake. Nothing about his work is at issue. And federal agents are still subject to state laws.

maybe just a rabbit hole here but in the previous citation with which I was corrected, BH states:

"Since joining the ATF, I have participated in scores of gun trafficking investigations
as a case agent, acting in an undercover capacity, and in a subsidiary role. "

https://ia902501.us.archive.org/1/items/gov.uscourts.mad.243554/gov.uscourts.mad.243554.4.1.pdf

 

[ch_13]

maybe just a rabbit hole here but in the previous citation with which I was corrected, BH states:

"Since joining the ATF, I have participated in scores of gun trafficking investigations
as a case agent, acting in an undercover capacity, and in a subsidiary role. "

https://ia902501.us.archive.org/1/items/gov.uscourts.mad.243554/gov.uscourts.mad.243554.4.1.pdf

Interesting, but how does that square with him hanging out at the Hillside and the Waterfall with a bunch of cops?

Unless he's just talking about low-level stuff. Buying off a street dealer and then arresting them. I guess you could call that "undercover" work.

 

[turaj]

Where is this information coming from? Do you have a link? TYIA

i can't give you a quote. I believe it was maybe said in testimony or an interview watched...I can't give a source so may be my imagination....but honestly it makes sense. If she were my daughter and she told me the situation and that she and her bf not getting along I would advise to think about leaving for the sake of the children.

 

[nodamselindistress]

KR did state in her text chain with Higgy that her parents told her she would feel differently about the kids if they were her own, I remember reading that. So there must have been a convo w/her folks about the kids. That is all I've heard, though.

 

[jepop]

I'm fairly new in following this case so I'm hoping you guys might be able to help with a few questions I have re: JM's phone search history.

So far as I can tell, there were multiple "how long to die in cold" searches, with the history showing one at 2:27am and the next at 6:23am (when JM purports she was told to search this). JM states she used the same tab she had open from browsing previously and was looking up stuff for her daughter's basketball (or something to that effect).

1) Why was there no other browser history shared? Did she literally only search these phrases and didn't click on a single link?

2) If she is being truthful in stating she was looking at something else at 2:27a and used the same tab to perform the first search, where is the browser history of her looking at basketball stuff?

3) Have there been attempts by the prosecution or otherwise to replicate what JM is stating happened (using a stale tab to perform a search thereby creating an incorrect timestamp)?

TIA for any help or guidance! Happy to read further into something if I can be pointed in the right direction.

the 2.27am google search came in on defense cross of Jen Mc. Prosecution elicited a denial/the digital tech must be wrong on redirect but did not challenge the validity in a technical way at that time. Hopefully I'm recalling correctly. Am relatively new to this case too but from what I can gather both sides will be calling experts for search history but hasn't happenned yet and the P' is only now starting to bring in witnesses for digital/forensic So all you allude to in your questions is still to come imo. WElcome btw! moo

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

the 2.27am google search came in on defense cross of Jen Mc. Prosecution elicited a denial/the digital tech must be wrong on redirect but did not challenge the validity in a technical way at that time. Hopefully I'm recalling correctly. Am relatively new to this case too but from what I can gather both sides will be calling experts for search history but hasn't happenned yet and the P' is only now starting to bring in witnesses for digital/forensic So all you allude to in your questions is still to come imo. WElcome btw! moo

Can you imagine if some kind of forensic and digital data conclusively proved KR was guilty? Would her attorney's defense be "the times are wrong"? Why is that an acceptable answer from the CW?

 

[keek]

I've heard he lives in Brewster, but one other has said Centerville. Both have regular trash pick up. There's usually a fee, but maybe he just prefers to save a few dollars and dump his whiskey bottles at the military base.

I saw Sandwich!

 

[turaj]

KR did state in her text chain with Higgy that her parents told her she would feel differently about the kids if they were her own, I remember reading that. So there must have been a convo w/her folks about the kids. That is all I've heard, though.

Thank you...so many texts etc. but that is exactly where I got that idea..parents knew about the issues. It is not the the situation where father has custody of kids....it is now the uncle with custody and then you bring in gf who seems to be at home more and parenting. Anyone can figure this relationship may go bad.

 

[turaj]

the 2.27am google search came in on defense cross of Jen Mc. Prosecution elicited a denial/the digital tech must be wrong on redirect but did not challenge the validity in a technical way at that time. Hopefully I'm recalling correctly. Am relatively new to this case too but from what I can gather both sides will be calling experts for search history but hasn't happenned yet and the P' is only now starting to bring in witnesses for digital/forensic So all you allude to in your questions is still to come imo. WElcome btw! moo

I saw the explanation of leaving a window open and looking at other things which then pick up the time the window is opened. I think this is B.S. and will be refuted. If I look at my history each search has its very own time and I often don't close windows. A real battle of experts for sure. I think this search could be really really bad for state and Jen.

 

[jepop]

Interesting, but how does that square with him hanging out at the Hillside and the Waterfall with a bunch of cops?

Unless he's just talking about low-level stuff. Buying off a street dealer and then arresting them. I guess you could call that "undercover" work.

I wonder how credible jury will find BH. I suppose it will come down to whether they believe him or not if nothing solid comes up to dispute his dodgy explanation for sim card destruction?. Is he coming back at all, can D call him once they get underway?

 

[keek]

Where is this information coming from? Do you have a link? TYIA

I did read that too but don't remember where. I did think that yes, the kids come with John. It can be a deal breaker to a relationship and one should be honest with themselves and the person who has kids, adopted, or their own. You are in the kids world and their world is centered on the adults they live with and have their main and incredibly important relationship with that stays with them forever. How it effects their feelings of safety, wellbeing, love and self esteem. I did think reading that she needed to dissolve the relationship earlier on.
Something I've seen a few times in someone's testimony, reading, that she also said at the scene was I can't take care of those kids, (fine) but it's that she said, they're not even his kids. THAT was a huge tell of how she bottom line felt about the whole JO and the kids situation. I don't remember who said it or was said she said it, but it was part of the talk when finding JO and thinking he's dead..

 

[HarmonyE.]

I wonder how credible jury will find BH. I suppose it will come down to whether they believe him or not if nothing solid comes up to dispute his dodgy explanation for sim card destruction?. Is he coming back at all, can D call him once they get underway?

The defense can recall people who have concluded their testimony, but only if new info has come up through other testimony that requires that witness to return and address. Most of the witnesses we've seen will not return, which is why the defense estimated their case will take only two weeks.

 

[jepop]

Can you imagine if some kind of forensic and digital data conclusively proved KR was guilty? Would her attorney's defense be "the times are wrong"? Why is that an acceptable answer from the CW?

Right. if the reverse was happenning... wtaf. Think d is bringing in some expert to solidify it, so when exactly is cw going to contest it in any scientific way? Are they only planning to cross the d's witness and not bring in their own? Wouldn't the right time have been after JM, because surely they new the 2.27 search would come during her cross right? It's almost like some kind of hubric arrogance as in 'we don't need to contest this right now, just take our word for it and consider KR and her team fabricators and liers'. jmo

 

[turaj]

I did read that too but don't remember where. I did think that yes, the kids come with John. It can be a deal breaker to a relationship and one should be honest with themselves and the person who has kids, adopted, or their own. You are in the kids world and their world is centered on the adults they live with and have their main and incredibly important relationship with that stays with them forever. How it effects their feelings of safety, wellbeing, love and self esteem. I did think reading that she needed to dissolve the relationship earlier on.
Something I've seen a few times in someone's testimony, reading, that she also said at the scene was I can't take care of those kids, (fine) but it's that she said, they're not even his kids. THAT was a huge tell of how she bottom line felt about the whole JO and the kids situation. I don't remember who said it or was said she said it, but it was part of the talk when finding JO and thinking he's dead..

yes I remember that..could have come from Jen or Kerri that night...I guess CW will use this as the motive and while I believe there were major issues I don't think she set out that night "to do him in". It would help CW to have a motive so we will hear more about it.

 

[keek]

Thank you...so many texts etc. but that is exactly where I got that idea..parents knew about the issues. It is not the the situation where father has custody of kids....it is now the uncle with custody and then you bring in gf who seems to be at home more and parenting. Anyone can figure this relationship may go bad.

They were also very young that came to him and under such heartbreaking circumstances to their beings. Shock and loss and confusion. Not just a simple slide in of two children with the rest of their childhood onward in front of them. John was said to be very excited his niece was accepted at the Catholic High School, that is an example of how he was parenting regarding schooling. A person that close to the family has to be on board and supportive of all of them. TRICKY, unless solid and a happy and honest relationship forging ahead together. Yes, it takes a village for sure and it was said how other parents pitched in for rides/ childcare, as we do/did with our own, back and forth. It's just that JO needed to be very upfront in how he was parenting on every level and who he trusted on every level with the two kids. I'm sure he was and KR thought it would be fine and still be with JO but she said herself, did not want kids, so not an instant family, happy and wanted by her it seems. Her parents knew this and see how things are from their perspective of life and that relationship/kids.

 

[Wishbone]

i can't give you a quote. I believe it was maybe said in testimony or an interview watched...I can't give a source so may be my imagination....but honestly it makes sense. If she were my daughter and she told me the situation and that she and her bf not getting along I would advise to think about leaving for the sake of the children.

Karen Read’s parents say she and O’Keefe became serious in 2019 right before the Covid pandemic.

“They just seemed to be in a happy place, you know,” Karen’s mother Janet Read said.

The Reads shared multiple pictures of the smiling couple at family events and on vacation.

Daniel also reviewed surveillance video showing Read and O’Keefe laughing and embracing at C.F. McCarthy’s, a restaurant and bar in Canton.

Parents of Karen Read, woman charged in Boston officer’s death: ‘My daughter will be free’

The parents of a woman charged in a Boston Police officer’s death say they’re confident in their daughter’s innocence as her legal fight continues.

www.boston25news.com