Madeleine McCann general discussion thread #28

[Captain_Khan]

I'm sorry if this has already been asked and answered somewhere - right after Madeline vanished, did the other members of the 'Tapas' group rush to check on their own (grand)children before taking any further action? What did they do with their own children once the alarm was raised and people began searching?

 

[SapphireSteel]

I'm sorry if this has already been asked and answered somewhere - right after Madeline vanished, did the other members of the 'Tapas' group rush to check on their own (grand)children before taking any further action? What did they do with their own children once the alarm was raised and people began searching?

The other children all had a parent/grandparent caring for them.

 

[haden]

[modsnip]

I've highlighted the most important part of Lowe's letter for you.

"Is there DNA from Madeline on the swab "

It would be very simple to say "yes" simply because of the number of components within the result that are also in her reference sample.

^^^^^SIMPLE. Not "wrong", or "incorrect". Simple as in, the simple explanation. They lay man's explanation, if you like.

No, you are arguing against the forensic specialist opinion.
I can only trust his opinion as I am not on his level.
[modsnip].
Just my opinion.

 

[Captain_Khan]

The other children all had a parent/grandparent caring for them.

Thank you for clarifying - I could only find things with referred to the group calling a 'meeting' of sorts (the one where they supposedly tore up a colouring book to make a timeline).

 

[CHERIE.T]

Outside the window, were any footprints found at all? tia
Did said dogs hit near the window?

 

[~n/t~]

I'm sorry if this has already been asked and answered somewhere - right after Madeline vanished, did the other members of the 'Tapas' group rush to check on their own (grand)children before taking any further action? What did they do with their own children once the alarm was raised and people began searching?

Good question. Hope someone knows the answer

 

[Little Jedi]

It was obvious it was the mccanns car. So the handler could have helped them alert. I can not take that out of the equation.

:waitasec:
Have you actually watched the video footage ?

CANINE VEHICLE SEARCHES

"Ten vehicles were screened in an underground multi storey car park at Portimao. The vehicles, *of which I did not know the owner details,* were parked on an empty floor with 20-30 feet between each."
( Martin Grime's official report from the PJ case files )

(Snip)

"Ten cars are parked in an underground parking garage. 'Eddie' and 'Keela', dogs that are trained to detect cadaver odour and human blood, respectively, are released inside this garage, and at different moments in time, they run towards a grey Renault Mégane Scenic."

Link :
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id161.html

 

[gord]

Yet again we reach a point where experts reports are being ignored. It just seems pointless in having access to police files and emails which state facts . everyone has an opinion in this case but on the DNA found in the car the FSS scientist are pretty clear .

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[~n/t~]

Outside the window, were any footprints found at all? tia
Did said dogs hit near the window?

No to both questions

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

:waitasec:
Have you actually watched the video footage ?

CANINE VEHICLE SEARCHES

"Ten vehicles were screened in an underground multi storey car park at Portimao. The vehicles, *of which I did not know the owner details,* were parked on an empty floor with 20-30 feet between each."
( Martin Grime's official report from the PJ case files )

(Snip)

"Ten cars are parked in an underground parking garage. 'Eddie' and 'Keela', dogs that are trained to detect cadaver odour and human blood, respectively, are released inside this garage, and at different moments in time, they run towards a grey Renault Mégane Scenic."

Link :
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id161.html

Yes I did. There were fliers all over the car.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Either the PJ, the dogs, the DNA and now SY are lying, or the McCanns are.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Sniffer Dogs search the McCanns Hired Car - YouTube

And if you ask me there are things in it that make me uneasy about it.

The handler gets closer to the car, stands there longer..

It bothers me.

 

[haden]

:waitasec:
Have you actually watched the video footage ?

CANINE VEHICLE SEARCHES

"Ten vehicles were screened in an underground multi storey car park at Portimao. The vehicles, *of which I did not know the owner details,* were parked on an empty floor with 20-30 feet between each."
( Martin Grime's official report from the PJ case files )

(Snip)

"Ten cars are parked in an underground parking garage. 'Eddie' and 'Keela', dogs that are trained to detect cadaver odour and human blood, respectively, are released inside this garage, and at different moments in time, they run towards a grey Renault Mégane Scenic."

Link :
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id161.html

Does the logic of it really matter now? Scotland Yard have not taken this into their conclusion, neither has the Portuguese public prosecution office when they closed the case.
Scotland Yard said many times that Madelene might be still alive.
If there is a big value in this, as these were British dogs, the Scotland Yard would not have said this.

Another thing is that Portuguese search dogs, 4 of them, have pointed out Madeleine scent out of the apartment and to a car park, this was her freshest scent and the scent that was picked on not very long after she went missing.

Why we don't discuss the Portuguese dogs findings? These are search dogs as well! So, which dogs should we trust?

 

[SapphireSteel]

Either the PJ, the dogs, Grime, Amaral, the DNA and now SY are lying, or the McCanns are.

 

[haden]

Sniffer Dogs search the McCanns Hired Car - YouTube

And if you ask me there are things in it that make me uneasy about it.

The handler gets closer to the car, stands there longer..

It bothers me.

Even the PJ officer who was there at the time asked something about this.

 

[~n/t~]

Yet again we reach a point where experts reports are being ignored. It just seems pointless in having access to police files and emails which state facts . everyone has an opinion in this case but on the DNA found in the car the FSS scientist are pretty clear .

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Personally I don't ignore them but I'm also not ignorant to the fact that we can have differing expert reports. Like I said earlier I've seen it happen at trials. Who paid this guy to run the tests?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Either the PJ, the dogs, Grime, Amaral, the DNA and now SY are lying, or the McCanns are.

Ill go with Amaral, the dogs are wrong and I don't think the DNA is conclusive.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Does the logic of it really matter now? Scotland Yard have not taken this into their conclusion, neither has the Portuguese public prosecution office when they closed the case.
Scotland Yard said many times that Madelene might be still alive.
If there is a big value in this, as these were British dogs, the Scotland Yard would not have said this.

Another thing is that Portuguese search dogs, 4 of them, have pointed out Madeleine scent out of the apartment and to a car park, this was her freshest scent and the scent that was picked on not very long after she went missing.

Why we don't discuss the Portuguese dogs findings? These are search dogs as well! So, which dogs should we trust?

I have never heard of the PJ dogs being dismissed?

I thought it was generally accepted they did pick up on Madeleine, but what was unsure was if the scent they got was from the crèche trip to the beach earlier in the day.

It would have been stronger than any scent she left if carried.

 

[Captain_Khan]

And if you ask me there are things in it that make me uneasy about it.

The handler gets closer to the car, stands there longer..

It bothers me.

I figured that's because the video has been edited. It would be a pretty dull video to watch the dog run around 17 cars without alerting. Cutting to the one he does (the McCann's) makes for a more sensible length of video.

I'm sure dog handlers/psychologists would be trained to avoid signalling to the dog to do something, as it is a fairly well-known phenomenon. Martin is extremely experienced, as I understand it.

I don't think finding the scent on the car is a sure fire sign the McCanns are guilty - maybe they moved something from the flat that carried the 'death scent' unwittingly, like towels, for example. But it seems pretty clear to me that the dog did successfully pick that car out.

 

[gord]

Personally I don't ignore them but I'm also not ignorant to the fact that we can have differing expert reports. Like I said earlier I've seen it happen at trials. Who paid this guy to run the tests?

The FSS was the government's scientific forensic lab. They were not hired by anyone but part of the same process as the dogs and the UK police investigators. They have solved many crime.

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