Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #22

[misty48]

[QUOTE="Dlk79, post: 16546689, member: 268113]

"Yes, he said it in the sexta9 interview when he was asked about NF being a possible accomplice. He said:

“She is not a suspect for us. We are only investigating Christian B, nobody else.

“At this stage we believe he acted alone in this case.”
'Everything points to Maddie being dead' says prosecutor investigating suspect

However... he was then asked a similar question on the Australian podcast interview and gives a confusing response given what he'd already said previously. He is asked by the interviewer "Do you believe the suspect acted alone?". HCW answers "I cannot comment on this at the moment."

Seems strange when he has 'seemingly' already answered that previously, unless his meaning in the sexta9 interview was actually something slightly different to what he's been asked here.
'Madeleine is Dead' - They've Taken Her - Omny.fm[/QUOTE]

“She is not a suspect for us. We are only investigating Christian B, nobody else."
Possibly over-analysing but -
Is that because BKA are only investigating CB for murder?
Abduction does not fall within BKA's jurisdiction - it would be up to PJ to investigate NF for any role in that crime.
BKA have said they've no evidence CB sexually abused Madeleine.

CB acted alone in the crime of murder

 

[snowpea666]

He'd only need a passport to go outside Schengen area, like you say. He had whole of Europe to hide in.
So I wonder where he was planning to go?

Maybe somewhere near Italy that were not at the time EU and would not extradite him back ?

 

[peanutJelly]

Yes, he said it in the sexta9 interview when he was asked about NF being a possible accomplice. He said:

“She is not a suspect for us. We are only investigating Christian B, nobody else.

“At this stage we believe he acted alone in this case.”
'Everything points to Maddie being dead' says prosecutor investigating suspect

However... he was then asked a similar question on the Australian podcast interview and gives a confusing response given what he'd already said previously. He is asked by the interviewer "Do you believe the suspect acted alone?". HCW answers "I cannot comment on this at the moment."

Seems strange when he has 'seemingly' already answered that previously, unless his meaning in the sexta9 interview was actually something slightly different to what he's been asked here.
'Madeleine is Dead' - They've Taken Her - Omny.fm

He said acted alone ‘in this case’, but maybe not in others?!

 

[Dlk79]

He said acted alone ‘in this case’, but maybe not in others?!

Possibly. A few good theories put forward.

One off-the-wall theory that had also crossed my mind was that they do know there was some kind of accomplice and they have already spoken to them. And perhaps this person has already admitted their part in MM's disappearance and told them what part CB played. It would make some of the other things HCW has said and done make a lot more sense. As well as explain why he would not want to reveal his evidence to anyone. Just a possibility.

 

[redplanet]

Yes, he said it in the sexta9 interview when he was asked about NF being a possible accomplice. He said:

“She is not a suspect for us. We are only investigating Christian B, nobody else.

“At this stage we believe he acted alone in this case.”
'Everything points to Maddie being dead' says prosecutor investigating suspect

However... he was then asked a similar question on the Australian podcast interview and gives a confusing response given what he'd already said previously. He is asked by the interviewer "Do you believe the suspect acted alone?". HCW answers "I cannot comment on this at the moment."

Seems strange when he has 'seemingly' already answered that previously, unless his meaning in the sexta9 interview was actually something slightly different to what he's been asked here.
'Madeleine is Dead' - They've Taken Her - Omny.fm

Also BKA - Fahndung nach Personen - ENGLISH VERSION
"Furthermore, there is reason to assume that there are other persons, apart from the suspect, who have concrete knowledge of the course of the crime and maybe also of the place where the body was left. We explicitly ask these persons to contact us and provide information."

 

[redplanet]

Yes, he said it in the sexta9 interview when he was asked about NF being a possible accomplice. He said:

“She is not a suspect for us. We are only investigating Christian B, nobody else.

“At this stage we believe he acted alone in this case.”
'Everything points to Maddie being dead' says prosecutor investigating suspect

However... he was then asked a similar question on the Australian podcast interview and gives a confusing response given what he'd already said previously. He is asked by the interviewer "Do you believe the suspect acted alone?". HCW answers "I cannot comment on this at the moment."

Seems strange when he has 'seemingly' already answered that previously, unless his meaning in the sexta9 interview was actually something slightly different to what he's been asked here.
'Madeleine is Dead' - They've Taken Her - Omny.fm

"At this stage we believe he acted alone"
If this means: "Today we think that he acted alone, however maybe tomorrow we will decide he did not act alone.", it implies IMO that the "alone" conclusion is not definite. However there is an alternative, very different way to interpret the "at this stage" words IMO.

 

[Dlk79]

"At this stage we believe he acted alone"
If this means: "Today we think that he acted alone, however maybe tomorrow we will decide he did not act alone.", it implies IMO that the "alone" conclusion is not definite. However there is an alternative, very different way to interpret the "at this stage" words IMO.

Another possible meaning when he said CB "acted alone" during the Sexta9 interview is that he simply meant, not with NF. If I recall correctly, the interviewer had previously discussed how they had uncovered evidence of CB and NF carrying out crimes together and then puts this across to HCW, i.e. do you think NF might be involved in this case as well?

It's difficult as English is not his native tongue, but might he have just meant he believes CB did not act with NF in the MM case? Rather than the "figurative" 'alone' which means without anyone at all? I recall early on in the investigation they mentioned that the call to CB may have been to tell him when to break in to 5A. Well if that was the case, doesn't really count as acting alone either. Or as others have pointed out, maybe he thinks CB acted alone in the "murder" part, which is what they are pursuing.

As well as the point you raised, HCW made comments early on about keeping stuff secret so that they can verify accounts of other people who may come forward.

 

[redplanet]

Another possible meaning when he said CB "acted alone" during the Sexta9 interview is that he simply meant, not with NF. If I recall correctly, the interviewer had previously discussed how they had uncovered evidence of CB and NF carrying out crimes together and then puts this across to HCW, i.e. do you think NF might be involved in this case as well?

It's difficult as English is not his native tongue, but might he have just meant he believes CB did not act with NF in the MM case? Rather than the "figurative" 'alone' which means without anyone at all? I recall early on in the investigation they mentioned that the call to CB may have been to tell him when to break in to 5A. Well if that was the case, doesn't really count as acting alone either. Or as others have pointed out, maybe he thinks CB acted alone in the "murder" part, which is what they are pursuing.

As well as the point you raised, HCW made comments early on about keeping stuff secret so that they can verify accounts of other people who may come forward.

For example there was a case in Dartmoor where a man murdered a victim in countryside, left the victim there temporarily, then later returned and relocated the evidence to 15 miles away. Another case, Bristol area, indoors, the murderer temporarily leaves body in-situ, returns later and relocates to some miles away. I simplified, but those cases each consist of two stages.

 

[Anxala]

Thanks, Trivento & Dlk, and everyone else who's theorised on what HCW meant.

 

[Anxala]

Also BKA - Fahndung nach Personen - ENGLISH VERSION
"Furthermore, there is reason to assume that there are other persons, apart from the suspect, who have concrete knowledge of the course of the crime and maybe also of the place where the body was left. We explicitly ask these persons to contact us and provide information."

I wonder what he means by that? Does he mean people who know what happened (via the grapevine) but they themselves had nothing to do with any of it, or people who actively participated in the chain of events that led to MM ending up in the hands of CB?

The likelihood of the former coming forward 13+ years later seems on the very slender side to me. And obviously not even wafer-thin with regard to the latter.

Or, alternatively, could it be a shot across the bow to specific 'persons' known to HCW? That he's sending them a message, telling them he 'knows' and urging them to come forward voluntarily?

I agree on the whole with earlier musings/conclusions that the 'work in progress' nature of the investigation accounts for both HCW's different answers at different times, and the 'fuzziness' at times of those answers.

 

[redplanet]

I wonder what he means by that? Does he mean people who know what happened (via the grapevine) but they themselves had nothing to do with any of it, or people who actively participated in the chain of events that led to MM ending up in the hands of CB?

The likelihood of the former coming forward 13+ years later seems on the very slender side to me. And obviously not even wafer-thin with regard to the latter.

Or, alternatively, could it be a shot across the bow to specific 'persons' known to HCW? That he's sending them a message, telling them he 'knows' and urging them to come forward voluntarily?

I agree on the whole with earlier musings/conclusions that the 'work in progress' nature of the investigation accounts for both HCW's different answers at different times, and the 'fuzziness' at times of those answers.

In every interview HCW has two difficult tasks, one is to keep secret from the listener a significant portion of the evidence, and the other is to try to suppress all signs of strong emotion when being asked about what the concrete evidence is, which is near impossible to achieve, IMO.

 

[redplanet]

If the crime can be divided into two distinct stages, then it is possible the suspect did act alone in stage A, but not in stage B.

 

[Trivento]

German police refuse to reveal what was found in Madeleine McCann search | Daily Mail Online

Just remembered about another property/allotment connected to CB which is in Braunschweig.
They dug up the the area in Hannover... it was all over the news , and I think many expected to hear about this other area being searched also.As mentioned in above article the lady living there even asked police to do so.
However as far as I’m aware there are no reports of the Braunschweig plot as having been searched.
Which makes me curious considering the police say they are still needing more evidence etc.
Or perhaps they already have all they need and see no need to search this other place.
Unless it has been searched...anybody know..?

 

[redplanet]

I wonder what he means by that? Does he mean people who know what happened (via the grapevine) but they themselves had nothing to do with any of it, or people who actively participated in the chain of events that led to MM ending up in the hands of CB?

The likelihood of the former coming forward 13+ years later seems on the very slender side to me. And obviously not even wafer-thin with regard to the latter.

Or, alternatively, could it be a shot across the bow to specific 'persons' known to HCW? That he's sending them a message, telling them he 'knows' and urging them to come forward voluntarily?

I agree on the whole with earlier musings/conclusions that the 'work in progress' nature of the investigation accounts for both HCW's different answers at different times, and the 'fuzziness' at times of those answers.

"knowledge ... maybe also of the place where the body was left."
This indicates IMO that the "other persons" (if they do exist) played no part in the first stage of this crime, but did play a part only in the very last stage.

 

[redplanet]

Has BKA ever actually stated that CB was responsible for final concealment?

 

[Sharkbite]

German police refuse to reveal what was found in Madeleine McCann search | Daily Mail Online

Just remembered about another property/allotment connected to CB which is in Braunschweig.
They dug up the the area in Hannover... it was all over the news , and I think many expected to hear about this other area being searched also.As mentioned in above article the lady living there even asked police to do so.
However as far as I’m aware there are no reports of the Braunschweig plot as having been searched.
Which makes me curious considering the police say they are still needing more evidence etc.
Or perhaps they already have all they need and see no need to search this other place.
Unless it has been searched...anybody know..?

According to this 2016 Bild article the apartment and Braunshweig garden plot were searched in connection with the Neuwegersleben box factory search.

"Since the man also has an adjoining apartment in Braunschweig, the premises and a garden plot there were also searched. Only after evaluating the computer data does the public prosecutor want to determine how to proceed against the accused."

Großeinsatz in der Börde:Kinderporno-Razzia auf vermülltem Fabrikgelände

I assume that the article refers to the allotment Am Fullerkamp as this where CB is reported to have been living at the time.

Also worth noting from this article is that mobile phones and computers were also found, this fact seems mostly forgotten in recent articles regarding the box factory search.

 

[Okapi]

If the crime can be divided into two distinct stages, then it is possible the suspect did act alone in stage A, but not in stage B.

Excuse my stupidity @redplanet do you mean this?

stage 1: the removal of MM, abuse and murder (not necessarily a linear sequence), and stage 2: the disposal of the body or knowledge of the disposal.

I'm just wondering if other persons witnessed images or footage of the abuse or desecration of MM, but were not directly involved in taking or abusing her, would they fall into either or both these stages? CB may have acted alone on stage 1, but I would think anyone who saw vision is also criminal. Not sure if I'm explaining myself properly. Might post more once my head is working!

 

[Okapi]

For example there was a case in Dartmoor where a man murdered a victim in countryside, left the victim there temporarily, then later returned and relocated the evidence to 15 miles away. Another case, Bristol area, indoors, the murderer temporarily leaves body in-situ, returns later and relocates to some miles away. I simplified, but those cases each consist of two stages.

Ah, that clarifies it for me! I suppose the issue of anyone else witnessing a record of the abuse is separate to the taking/murdering and the disposal of the body. Such horrible stuff I'm typing when I stop thinking about it intellectually

 

[Trivento]

According to this 2016 Bild article the apartment and Braunshweig garden plot were searched in connection with the Neuwegersleben box factory search.

"Since the man also has an adjoining apartment in Braunschweig, the premises and a garden plot there were also searched. Only after evaluating the computer data does the public prosecutor want to determine how to proceed against the accused."

Großeinsatz in der Börde:Kinderporno-Razzia auf vermülltem Fabrikgelände

I assume that the article refers to the allotment Am Fullerkamp as this where CB is reported to have been living at the time.

Also worth noting from this article is that mobile phones and computers were also found, this fact seems mostly forgotten in recent articles regarding the box factory search.

Thanks for finding this...!
It would otherwise seem incredulous that the Braunschweig plot has not been probed seeing as CB dug a large hole there ....and as HCW has said generally in interviews...”no body ..or parts of MM body have been found”.
Strange how the Braunschweig plot search mentioned in the 2016 Bild article is not more known about though.

 

[Lilly b]

German police refuse to reveal what was found in Madeleine McCann search | Daily Mail Online

Just remembered about another property/allotment connected to CB which is in Braunschweig.
They dug up the the area in Hannover... it was all over the news , and I think many expected to hear about this other area being searched also.As mentioned in above article the lady living there even asked police to do so.
However as far as I’m aware there are no reports of the Braunschweig plot as having been searched.
Which makes me curious considering the police say they are still needing more evidence etc.
Or perhaps they already have all they need and see no need to search this other place.
Unless it has been searched...anybody know..?

In the interview for the Kripo Live magazine of the MDR, the lawyer Khubaib Ali Mohammed says that Mr. B. had direct contact with the employee of the Wilhelmshof, Mr. A., who was at the Wilhelmshof at the time of the crime.

Found this, more to do with IG, but obviously to do with CB, its from a German site, and you can't use the links anymore, but I've never seen this in British press, so there's defo more going on than meets the eye