Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #22

[vermisstekindersuche]

Both men had connections to Portugal, facilities for the youth, hiding data carriers and discussing peado-topics on the web. May they ever had met each other?


Again, without any resentment!

The prosecuters in Braunschweig had been instructed by the BKA to investigate against CB around end of 2017/beginning of 2018 for murdering MM, because his last known whereabout has been in lower saxony. That's conmon german law!

So HCW is in charge, but not the offspring of the investigation!

The reason of that instruction is debatable, of course!

Ok, I'm aware of that so I did refer as HCW "team" or so but my point still remains the same, if someone investigating the Darkweb were to discover MM "material" there that "data" would be "shared" to all of the team dealing with that sort of crime including interpol/europol so that the "new data" is "included" on the international database of known child / victims.

I don't know of "many" cases where a child went missing like MM and later child abuse material for that child was found on darkweb (or any other place for that matter). Maybe Rui Pedro and it's not confirmed, maybe Denise, and just one or two more cases, as a general rule "data" of child abuse on the darkweb is produced by "producers" that are directly linked to the child like family (father, mother, etc) and even if they are "strangers" they are neighbours or people linked to the family of the victims, or even a "ring" of parents that "share" they "victims".

Kidnapp to produce child is not something that I'm aware of... It maybe happen, but MM is so popular that it would be found right away.

And people on the Darkweb might not be as well exactly as we are assuming/imagining.

I bet you that you would even have trouble getting "fakes" of MM even on darkweb (like photoshoped images), meaning that i doubt that even "fakes" are circulating on the darkweb. More likely that you will find "trolls" on forums making fun of MM that you would find "pedos" on the darkWeb all happy about what happen to her.

Just a very few minority of scumm would "desire" for a child to have been kidnapped/abused/killed. Even on Darkweb.

And Darkweb was NOT created for pedophilia to start with, DarkWeb like TOR onion router was created for freedom to allow information to be accessible even in countries like China with huge degree of censorship. It's just that twisted people did decide to create a bunch of "pedo" forums just because they could and the tech would be there to prevent identification of IPs, but even so there are ways to ID people and pedos do get busted so at the end of the day it's just a question of "exploiting" the mistakes of those pedos to catch them up and place them on jail for good.

 

[redplanet]

In addition to the clothes the suspect was wearing during the alleged crime, if he had other items with him and if he cached them, they too IMO might even be alertable today? A possible example: mask.

 

[vermisstekindersuche]

Is it possible that the suspect kept and later hid in a cache as mementos some items which he had with him at the alleged crime? Kust one example: whatever clothing he wore during the crime. If the crime was as alleged by BKA, that clothing would be probably be detectable now by german specialist dogs IMO.

Yes, for example for me that is 100 % possible. I'm not saying that they do have that as i think they have only declarations of people and nothing that solid but if they have something more solid it might be that sort of thing, i don't know but sounds way more likely than pictures/video...

 

[SuperdadV8]

Ok, I'm aware of that so I did refer as HCW "team" or so but my point still remains the same, if someone investigating the Darkweb were to discover MM "material" there that "data" would be "shared" to all of the team dealing with that sort of crime including interpol/europol so that the "new data" is "included" on the international database of known child / victims.

I don't know of "many" cases where a child went missing like MM and later child abuse material for that child was found on darkweb (or any other place for that matter). Maybe Rui Pedro and it's not confirmed, maybe Denise, and just one or two more cases, as a general rule "data" of child abuse on the darkweb is produced by "producers" that are directly linked to the child like family (father, mother, etc) and even if they are "strangers" they are neighbours or people linked to the family of the victims, or even a "ring" of parents that "share" they "victims".

Kidnapp to produce child is not something that I'm aware of... It maybe happen, but MM is so popular that it would be found right away.

And people on the Darkweb might not be as well exactly as we are assuming/imagining.

I bet you that you would even have trouble getting "fakes" of MM even on darkweb (like photoshoped images), meaning that i doubt that even "fakes" are circulating on the darkweb. More likely that you will find "trolls" on forums making fun of MM that you would find "pedos" on the darkWeb all happy about what happen to her.

Just a very few minority of scumm would "desire" for a child to have been kidnapped/abused/killed. Even on Darkweb.

And Darkweb was NOT created for pedophilia to start with, DarkWeb like TOR onion router was created for freedom to allow information to be accessible even in countries like China with huge degree of censorship. It's just that twisted people did decide to create a bunch of "pedo" forums just because they could and the tech would be there to prevent identification of IPs, but even so there are ways to ID people and pedos do get busted so at the end of the day it's just a question of "exploiting" the mistakes of those pedos to catch them up and place them on jail for good.

Sometimes, life get's get easier if somebody starts to listen.

If you would like to tell something about the case, i will do.....

 

[Trivento]

Yes, for example for me that is 100 % possible. I'm not saying that they do have that as i think they have only declarations of people and nothing that solid but if they have something more solid it might be that sort of thing, i don't know but sounds way more likely than pictures/video...

I guess if BKA do have images/videos there’s a chance they have recovered something that wasn’t released to the web so Interpol etc not so much involved ...it might be something the BKA found themselves and so far only they know the details about it.

 

[vermisstekindersuche]

(...)

If you would like to tell something about the case, i will do.....

CB was "under survailance" and BKA did "capture" conversations of him like skype/darkweb/whatever and they did capture that text about wanting to abuse for days something small, if you were BKA what would you do, would you STOP survailance on him ? Of course not.

Maybe (most likely) they did continue to track him over the net, even if remotely and they might have more stuff that he did post or chat about.

Let's say for example that he did chat with someone over skype and did say that he did kill MM, or a thing like that, would that be something ? Yes it would but later he could claim that it was just fantasy. A physical photo/video couldn't be denied. It's "plausible deniability", BKA needs to present something that offer no doubt that CB did make the crimes.

I don't believe that BKA that was already "targeting" CB would stop checking what he was doing over the net even more after knowing that he was prime suspect at least on the prostitute case.

For other cases evel like Tristan even if the e-fit / drawing of the suspect is "close" CB was not considered a prime suspect, but on that young prostitute case I did read that CB was one of the main suspects. If we are to beleive that and if we are to believe that BKA was already investigating him for a while it's quite possible that from the point where they know he wants to abduct and abuse someone for days the survailance on him would continue.

Now those messages back from 2013 might have been capured way later.

It doesn't mean that BKA was logging him back on 2013. What it CAN mean is that way later they did found a Computer or something like that and checked the saved history and did catch that conversation.

At any rate nothing tells us that there aren't more.

Maybe he did comment with someone else over the net something, but maybe it's just text.

I don't have a clue. I don't know more than you guys ON THAT REGARD.

Whatever HCW have I don't know what it is the same way you guys don't know, it's just that my experience tells me what most likely he doesn't have for sure but i don't have idea about what he does have, if he is hidding it from Met, operation grange, PJ and even the other departments of BKA how would I be able to know what it is ? Of course that I don't know and just like you guys i'm trying to guess as well.

 

[vermisstekindersuche]

I guess if BKA do have images/videos there’s a chance they have recovered something that wasn’t released to the web so Interpol etc not so much involved ...it might be something the BKA found themselves and so far only they know the details about it.

Yes, that is the only chance for HCW to have images/photos - in case for example that they recover a pen/memory card of CB with thos images but even so by international agreement they would have to share with europol/interpol and the team that specializes in dealing with child over the web. This is mandatory as international law enforcment needs to know exactly what is "public available" regarding to child and what is "new material" so they can catch "producers".

That content would be "hashed" and uploaded to specialized servers for imaging/video matching when other international LEA team find content for example on other sites of the Darkweb.

Goes without saying parents would need to be informed right away. This is mandatory as well as long of course as they are not the ones doing the abuse.

 

[SuperdadV8]

Possible yes!

But according to a 2-year-imvestigation, rather wishful thinking.

 

[peanutJelly]

For example there was a case in Dartmoor where a man murdered a victim in countryside, left the victim there temporarily, then later returned and relocated the evidence to 15 miles away. Another case, Bristol area, indoors, the murderer temporarily leaves body in-situ, returns later and relocates to some miles away. I simplified, but those cases each consist of two stages.

Makes me think again as previously posted that possibility CB accidentally killed MM, left, but then returned to dispose/collect her either for disposal, further personal satisfaction or both

 

[redplanet]

What is that thing hanging around neck in Malaga?

 

[redplanet]

Makes me think again as previously posted that possibility CB accidentally killed MM, left, but then returned to dispose/collect her either for disposal, further personal satisfaction or both

Starting with an indication IMO the intruder may have concealed something inside the apartment, the panic-leave-return theory is an attempt to make sense of it.

 

[Okapi]

What is that thing hanging around neck in Malaga?

As the AWOL @Betty_Boop88 suggested to me, hippy tat/trinkets, probably from the markets.

 

[Ausgrlz]

For those interested in items of clothing:

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/472668/FOUND-Shirt-worn-by-Madeleine-McCann-suspect/amp

 

[redplanet]

If BKA hypothetically did find an actual camera which the suspect possessed in 2007, this might (even without images) potentially be an extremely valuable source of intelligence.

 

[Sharkbite]

DBM

 

[redplanet]

If BKA hypothetically did find an actual camera which the suspect possessed in 2007, this might (even without images) potentially be an extremely valuable source of intelligence.

... If german police hypothetically found objects like mask, leotard, steel ruler, or camera, hidden at Neuwegersleben or one of the allotments, IMO it likely that they would use a german police cadaver dog to inspect every such item, in case the perp had used them at crime scene(s).

 

[Trivento]

... If german police hypothetically found objects like mask, leotard, steel ruler, or camera, hidden at Neuwegersleben or one of the allotments, IMO it likely that they would use a german police cadaver dog to inspect every such item, in case the perp had used them at crime scene(s).

Would they be able to take any alerts to court though ?
Could defence not argue that the dog alert came from some other unconnected crime or contamination..?

 

[redplanet]

Would they be able to take any alerts to court though ?
Could defence not argue that the dog alert came from some other unconnected crime or contamination..?

Precisely, it would not be enough. And BKA have stated that what they have is not enough - they need more.

 

[vermisstekindersuche]

What about if what they did find (MM related) is some sort of text ?

Just guessing here but something like a CB journal/diary where he did wrote about killing MM ?

What if the text is some sort of interception of chat/skype over the internet where CB did talk to someone else about killing MM, like a "continuation" or follow up of that conversation where he stated he wanted to abuse something small ? Maybe BKA have more of those chat interceptions either on skype or even pedo forum/chats on Darkweb or whatever and there aree text from CB saying he did kill MM ?

And also there are many pedophile forums over the DarkWeb and even on the clearnet that are about text only as those are "legal" on most of the countries. Those "forums" or sistes are dedicated to share/collecting pedophile "stories" and make-up or false/untrue/imagination stories or child abuse. Same way for example on Japan there are a huge amount of "lolicon" and many mangas/animes of "Hentai" content with underage children that sometimes are even baby/toddler and are considered "legal" in most countries as those are "not real", meaning that CB could even have posted somewhere a "story" about killing MM and maybe it's something like that ? Not very likely I know, but it's a possibility.

If BKA does indeed have "something" solid I would be more inclined to think that it's either something like an old friend/s statement as i told here before or it's some kind of comunication interception.

Finaly it might be audio instead of text as well, maybe CB did phone/skype someone and told that person about killing MM ? Problem is that if that were to be the case the other person would be involved as well and HCW is stating CB did act alone. Of course HCW might be "lying" in an attempt to get the other person as well but there are another option, maybe CB did "confess" to a priest or someone like that ? What about if CB told a "priest" in confession that he did kill MM ?

Just leaving some ideas, don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to change the opinion of you guys regarding what HCW "might" have. The truth is that he did hid that info so well that all that we can do is guessing.

I trully think that we will be running in circles with this unless HCW provide us more details or at least some more "hints" about what kind of "evidence" he does have regarding CB/MM.

The only thing that i trully hope is that he end up telling us something when the investigation is over even if it's not enough for charging so that we can make our own judjment about CB/MM. Meaning that even if what HCW have is not enough to charge CB with the crime if that "something" is something "solid" like a text interception where CB does confess MM killing for me it's enough to make up my mind about his guilt, because for me even if the law itself can't put him on jail i will be more convinced that he is guilty, like the Ulvi guy and the Manuel guy on the PK case, thart even if they were "aquitted" by justice fail and bad conducted investigation for me there is no doubt that they are guilty even if the system did fail on that case.

Now if HCW doesn't have anything "solid" and if all of what they have is something like a "speculation" or oppinion of an old friend that "thinks" that CB "MIGHT" have killed MM that will not be very satisfying and people that are investigating and following this specific case like all of you guys will need to start looking for other possible suspects once again ... Let's hope in some ways that this time BKA does have the correct guy so that this case can finaly be put to rest and MM family might have their closure knowing what did happen to MM.

 

[Sharkbite]

A little snippet of info to add to @Chiatos post from thread page 18

"Helge described the first time that he visited CB's house in Portimao.
The white house had a red roof. (Ziegeldach)"
Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #18

PJ went looking for an Opel Corsa at 2 addresses in Portimao on the 16th May 07. This is the same make of vehicle that MS said HB took when they robbed the farmhouse in PDL.

"I bring to your attention that today at about 00.10 a phone call was received by this station from Portimao DIC, from Chief Inspector Tavares de Almeida, requesting this police station to go to two addresses, with the aim of locating a vehicle of make 'Opel', model 'Corsa', with number plate 18-63-AF, which could be related to the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, in accordance with information received from PSP Calvario, attached in annex."

Not much detail why they went looking and they didn't locate the vehicle.
P.J. POLICE FILES: PJ SERVICE INFORMATION 13 SEP 2007

Probably just a coincidence with Corsas being so common, but still an interesting one I think.