Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #1

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  • #261
seriously?

I have had a long stressful day, so please forgive if this response is snarky.

Firstly, it could have been any plane - how you can blame Malaysia Airlines for this is beyond me. They didn't 'lose' the plane, it was shot down using a long range surface to air missile, Until this tragedy, I do not believe this airspace at that altitude had been closed, so why would they fly anywhere else?

Secondly, I think you need to revise km and feet. The plane was flying at 10km which is 33,000 ft -a perfectly normal passenger airline cruising altitude. Your suggestion that they should have been flying at 30,000km would actually be a cruising altitude of 98,425,197ft - not even in the earth's atmosphere which is 480km deep.

In April, international aviation agencies such as the European Aviation Safety Agency and ICAO, a United Nations civil aviation agency, warned that airlines faced "serious risks" in the area and advised them to take alternate routes.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101845738

Malaysia choose to fly OVER and not go around. If they didn't know not to fly OVER Ukraine, they probably shouldn't be flying. jmo idk I would never step a foot on one of their planes.
 
  • #262
I was listening/watching a local news/talk program on WDIV when news of the airline disaster broke. NBC news special report interrupted local programming, and my first thought was, WTF!?! :eek: A second Malaysian Airline disaster in just a few months? How strange is that? :waitasec: I don't want to speculate about a connection between the two incidents, but that was among my initial considerations. Hopefully, we'll learn much more in the coming days to help us understand what happened and whether or not the two Malaysian airline disasters are connected.

IMO, neither airline disaster are connected.
Until we find out more details about this one anyways.
If there are any similarities, than obviously I will reconsider.
 
  • #263
Due to all the military activity in the area, I would assume there was pretty good radar coverage. Radar tapes should clearly indicate where the missile came from. I don't think there will be much mystery for long as to who shot it down.
 
  • #264
seriously?

I have had a long stressful day, so please forgive if this response is snarky.

Firstly, it could have been any plane - how you can blame Malaysia Airlines for this is beyond me. They didn't 'lose' the plane, it was shot down using a long range surface to air missile, Until this tragedy, I do not believe this airspace at that altitude had been closed, so why would they fly anywhere else?

Secondly, I think you need to revise km and feet. The plane was flying at 10km which is 33,000 ft -a perfectly normal passenger airline cruising altitude. Your suggestion that they should have been flying at 30,000km would actually be a cruising altitude of 98,425,197ft - not even in the earth's atmosphere which is 480km deep.

Firstly, I did not outright blame them in the post so please dont put words that are not there. And you can fly on their planes if you want to. I will choose to avoid them.

Secondly, They do have a bad track record lately, and like I said no matter what the reason.

Thirdly, other countries did have air restrictions in that "War Zone" area. Common sense would dictate to avoid it.

Fourthly, I totally admit I mistakenly thought KM was about the same as feet in this early post I made much earlier as the news was first breaking, which contributed to why I thought there were way too low. This I agree was a total mistake and it appears they were at cruising altitude.

Fifthly, I hope the rest of your day is better.
 
  • #265
In April, international aviation agencies such as the European Aviation Safety Agency and ICAO, a United Nations civil aviation agency, warned that airlines faced "serious risks" in the area and advised them to take alternate routes.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101845738

Malaysia choose to fly OVER and not go around. If they didn't know not to fly OVER Ukraine, they probably shouldn't be flying. jmo idk I would never step a foot on one of their planes.

The FAA told U.S. airlines in April to avoid flying in that region because of political unrest.
The warning is in effect until next April.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101845738

I have to agree... I think they flew over Ukraine to save gas and time.
If they had just flown around the area "just to be safe" then this wouldn't have happened.

Assuming you are high enough to not be shot down... Well that is just asking for trouble.
Especially when the weaponry can go twice as high as your airplane...

After MH370 I would think Malaysia Air would take EVERY precaution possible. :twocents:
 
  • #266
Reuters Top News @Reuters · 7m

#BREAKING: Ukrainian security chief bases his allegation on phone intercepts between two Russian military intelligence officers



Reuters Top News @Reuters · 9m

#BREAKING: Ukrainian security chief accuses two Russian intelligence officers of involvement in crash

https://twitter.com/Reuters
 
  • #267
Geez! The most graphic pics on Huffpost mobil.
This is just awful.
 
  • #268
When you fly over someone else's country, you fly where they tell you. This isn't Malaysian Airlines' fault. But it their problem now. Combined with the missing plane, this could wipe out Malaysian Airlines. That is sad.
 
  • #269
I dont think I would fly Malaysia airlines if i could avoid it. They just have a bad track record lately. No matter what the reasons. Its horrible. Who loses 2 planes in such a short time.They should have been more like 30000 KM over a war zone.....not 10000 KM

I don't think I put words in your mouth, but thank you for hoping my day gets better.:truce:
 
  • #270
BREAKING: U.S. intelligence confirms surface-to-air missile fired at Malaysian jet but are divided over origin, reports @WSJ
https://twitter.com/BuzzFeedNews
 
  • #271
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  • #273
“This creates the potential for conflicting air traffic control instructions from Ukrainian and Russian authorities and for the related potential misidentification of civil aircraft in this airspace,” read the statement.

The International Civil Aviation Organization, a United Nations agency, issued a similar warning. However, that warning was for a different region of the country and advised “air operators of a potentially unsafe situation arising of presence arising from more than one air traffic services provider” in the Simferopol region of the Ukraine. An ICAO spokesperson confirmed the warning was due to both Ukraine and Russia claiming the same airspace in the region.

An ICAO spokesperson told ABC News today that Malaysia Airlines Flight MH-17, appeared to be outside of the Simferopol region when it crashed.

http://abcnews.go.com/International...-flying-contested-ukrainian/story?id=24604229
...........................
At least two Russian news outlets reported at the end of June that pro-Russian rebels had seized a Ukrainian airbase in the Donestk region where Buk missile systems were located. It wasn't clear how long the rebels maintained control of the "A-1402 military base," or whether any Buk systems had been removed from it.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/malaysia-airlines-flight-17-crashes-in-ukraine/

.................................

KT McFarland, a former deputy assistant secretary of defense under President Ronald Reagan, and a Fox News national security analyst said the attack was most likely the work of Russian separatists, not the Russian or Ukrainian armies.

“I think it’s far more likely it was rebel forces in eastern Ukraine trying to get the Russian back involved," McFarland said.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/07/17/malaysia-airlines-passenger-jet-shot-down-over-ukraine/

But retired Army Lt. Col Ralph Peters, also a Fox News contributor, said it is unlikely the Russian military would have put missile batteries capable of knocking a plane out of the sky at such an altitude in the hands of rebels.

"It wasn't the separatists, although Russia will try to blame them, or blame the Ukrainians," Peters said. "The Russians have not given the separatists complex, high-altitude air-defense systems. If this airliner was flying at 34,000 feet or any altitude close to that, it was shot down by Russian military air-defense systems perched on the Ukrainian border."

Peters said the Russian military has been shooting down Ukrainian military aircraft in recent weeks, and most likely mistook the airliner for a Ukrainian military aircraft.
 
  • #274
Christopher Pyne investigating number of Australians on board :(
 
  • #275
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  • #277
The Washington Post reports that the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) was in touch with U.S. carriers on Thursday to instruct them not to fly over the Ukraine-Russia border. Although the FAA banned carriers in April from flying over the Crimean region by the Black Sea, the ban did not apply to the Donetsk region where the Malaysian aircraft crashed. However, according to NBC News, American Airlines and Delta said "they don’t operate in Ukraine and don’t have to reroute flights."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...irspace/#377a97eb-ba87-4024-a395-c1ec44359584

BBM
 
  • #278
  • #279
That will be real useful. The boxes are probably already at KGB headquarters.
 
  • #280
#BREAKING: Ukrainian security chief accuses two Russian intelligence officers of involvement in crash
https://twitter.com/Reuters

Love how they are using this situation to elevate the conflict between them .. way to go Ukrainian security chief for making a statement you can in no way back up with evidence or even sound judgement at this early stage.

We need to drop both these countries like a stone and leave them to it IMO .. involvement in their childish conflict is doing nobody any good .. JMO.
 
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