Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #2

[zwiebel]

Noah Sneider is resident reporter in Donetsk. Tweets in English. He confirms evacuations.

https://mobile.twitter.com/NoahSneider/tweets

 

[ZaZara]

NIEUWSUUR interview with Alexander Borodai
http://nieuwsuur.nl/onderwerp/677540

Borodai "wil experts beschermen"

De Nederlandse experts die de stoffelijke resten inspecteren in de treinen bij Torez, kunnen rekenen op de bescherming van de pro-Russische strijders. Dat zegt de leider van de separatisten Alexander Borodai in een gesprek met Nieuwsuur. Borodai, de zelfbenoemde premier van de 'volksrepubliek' Donetsk, zegt hun veiligheid te kunnen garanderen.
Gesprek

Borodai is bereid tot een gesprek met de Nederlandse autoriteiten over de vliegramp, maar hij zegt tot nu toe niet door Nederland te zijn benaderd. Borodai verwacht dat vanmiddag besprekingen beginnen met de Oekraïense regering in aanwezigheid van vertegenwoordigers van de Organisatie voor Veiligheid en Samenwerking in Europa, de OVSE.


Borodai is bereid de treinen met lichamen "naar elke gewenste bestemming" te sturen, maar alleen onder toezicht van internationale waarnemers "zodat Kiev geen bewijsmateriaal verdoezelt". De rebellenleider zegt sinds gisteren in bezit te zijn van de zwarte dozen en is bereid deze over te dragen aan internationale luchtvaartexperts.

Translation:

Borodai willing to protect experts

The Dutch experts who inspect the remains in the trains at Torez, can count on the protection of the pro-Russian fighters. So says the leader of the separatists Alexander Borodai in an interview with Nieuwsuur. Borodai, the self-styled Prime Minister of the ' people's Republic ' Donetsk, says he can guarantee their safety.

Borodai is willing to have talks with the Dutch authorities about the air disaster, but he says he has not been approached by The Netherlands so far. Borodai expects that this afternoon consultations will start with the Ukrainian Government in the presence of representatives of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, the OSCE.

Borodai is willing to send the trains with bodies "to any destination", but only under the supervision of international observers "so that Kiev cannot obscure evidence ". According to the rebel leader, he is in possession of the black boxes since yesterday and is prepared to transfer them to international aviation experts.

 

[SouthAussie]

"The government in Kiev denied sending the regular army into the centre of Donetsk, which the separatists captured in April, but said small "self-organised" pro-Ukrainian groups were fighting the pro-Russian rebels in the city."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/07/21/ukraine-crisis-donetsk-idUSL6N0PW1H620140721


Funny that, pro-Russian rebels (not Russian army) are holding the crash zone and victims .. pro-Ukranian groups (not Ukraine army) are attacking Donetsz. :waitasec:

Tit for tat.

 

[BJsleuth]

An Austria news website is reporting that Dutch investigators just checked the train with the bodies and came to the conclusion it was not refrigerated at all...

sorry, link is in german language only
http://www.tt.com/politik/8669882-91/mh-17-experten-in-donezk-eklat-durch-tv-reporter.csp

I saw it on the TV news earlier and I thought "That's not a refridgerated carriage!"

 

[ZaZara]

Harriet Salem ‏@HarrietSalem 37 sec.

At #MH17 crash site Dutch forensic expert "impressed" with recovery operation & workers given the size, weather & circumstances #Ukraine

BBM

 

[zwiebel]

The Govt Finance Minister of Ukraine has decided this is a good time to appeal for funding to help with the $130m monthly costs of its 'anti-terror' campaign. It sounds like he's exploiting the dead passengers rich nations want back.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28399670

 

[Elley Mae]

“All efforts are focused on getting this train onto territory controlled by Ukrainian authorities,” Mr. Rutte said in Amsterdam, according to Reuters.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/21/world/europe/malaysia-airlines-jet-ukraine.html


I dunno ... did we/they know this was going to happen? :waitasec: Or am I reading between the lines far too much?

Thanks for the link SouthAussie

from link

Two days after the crash, potentially decisive evidence was lying, seemingly undiscovered, in a recently harvested field about five miles from the central crash site: a large curled sheet of metal, apparently part of the outside of the plane, that had multiple, even holes torn into it. A weapons expert who reviewed photographs said the holes were consistent with a blast from a missile of the type American officials believe brought down the plane.

 

[zwiebel]

The latest:

'13:49: Speaking from the crash site, OSCE spokesman Michael Bociurkiw says damage to the railway system in and around Donetsk today could affect the arrival of international experts and where the train carrying bodies of MH17 victims can go. He says the decision about where the train will go is "yet to be made." '

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28399670

 

[ZaZara]

Olaf Koens ‏@obk 6 min.

Hoofd van het forensische team laat weten dat hij onder de indruk was van het werk van de plaatselijke reddingsdiensten

Translation:

Head of the forensic team announces that he is impressed by the work of the local rescue services

 

[SouthAussie]

Harriet Salem ‏@HarrietSalem 37 sec.

At #MH17 crash site Dutch forensic expert "impressed" with recovery operation & workers given the size, weather & circumstances #Ukraine

BBM

Just jumping off your post ...

I think that the coal miners probably did do the best job they could in doing what they were told to do, recover the bodies, load them onto the trucks ... but I doubt the people there would say anything negative right now, with so many of our humanitarian workers right there, wanting access to the crash zone and victims ... right under the noses of the rebels.

All of a sudden it has gone from being appalled at the dragging and dumping, to being impressed.

 

[zwiebel]

Residents of Donetsk leaving en masse.

https://mobile.twitter.com/ChristopherJM

 

[Elley Mae]

UN to Vote on Crash Resolution; Russia Has Doubts

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/vote-crash-resolution-russia-doubts-24644715

"Given the almost certain culpability of the Russian-backed rebels in the downing of the aircraft, having these people in control of the site is a little like leaving criminals in control of a crime scene," Abbott added.

Russia has the power to veto the resolution as a permanent council member.

bbm

 

[zwiebel]

The train won't be going anywhere today. Or tomorrow. Possibly ever. In my opinion.

 

[zwiebel]

Six soccer players have been 'warned' by their club because they've refused to return to Donetsk from France, where they've just played.

http://www.foxsports.com/soccer/sto...-failure-to-return-to-troubled-donetsk-072114

 

[kimi_SFC]

he lists his work as "ABC news"... so i doubt the poster you refer to was trying to incorrectly associate this reporter w/ the US namesake.

https://twitter.com/Simon_Cullen

My mistake - :tyou: for correcting it.

I wasn't able to deduce this via a quick run through his twitter bio as I was bringing tweets over to the thread.

:blushing:


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ZaZara]

Just jumping off your post ...

I think that the coal miners probably did do the best job they could in doing what they were told, recover the bodies, load them onto the trucks ... but I doubt the people there would say anything negative right now, with so many of our humanitarian workers right there, wanting access to the crash zone and victims ... right under the noses of the rebels.

All of a sudden it has gone from being appalled at the dragging and dumping, to being impressed.

The Dutch have the reputation of being blunt. Whatever happened ... ?

IMHO "given the size, weather an circumstances" sums it up neatly. There's a lot of criticism about, but one can hardly blame the persons who actually lifted the bodies and put them into bags.
I don't know who is goig to say "thank you " to them, so it is good that this has been mentioned and heard worldwide.

 

[SouthAussie]

The train won't be going anywhere today. Or tomorrow. Possibly ever. In my opinion.

Maybe it won't need to, zwiebel. Maybe there is another plan to rescue the victims' remains. There may be a method behind their madness.

 

[kimi_SFC]

The situation appears to be deteriorating, according to the media on location:


Tweet from @GavinLeeBBC - 30m

#MH17 RT @fergalkeane47 #Donetsk to all media thinking of approaching fighting - extreme caution.Shelling+snipers #ukrainecrash

http://twitter.com/GavinLeeBBC/status/491135324190679040



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Isabelle]

Who are the Russian rebel separatists? 10 questions answered about the history of Ukraine and the tragedy of MH17

WE’VE all read about the horror of the crash site in Ukraine, but who are the people who shot down Malaysia Airlines flight MH17?

Here are 10 points to help you get your head around the origins of the tragedy.

http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...-tragedy-of-mh17/story-fnizu68q-1226996215883

Watching Sky News .. discussion about resolution going towards UN ..

Great article. Thanks. Would like to know who is bankrolling the pro-Russian rebels? Certainly they are not a group of independently wealthy persons that are able to self-finance their militia.

 

[zwiebel]

Power on the train was out overnight. Supposedly back on today but I'm guessing it won't last long with the situation.

'AP journalists at the site said the smell of decay was overwhelming Monday and many with the inspectors wore masks or pressed cloths to the faces on the warm summer day. A train engineer told The Associated Press that a power outage had hit the cars' refrigeration system overnight and it was not immediately clear why. The cooling system was back up and running early Monday, he said.'

http://www.usnews.com/news/world/ar...s-from-downed-jet-piled-in-boxcars-in-ukraine