ME ME - Ayla Reynolds, 20 mnths, Waterville, 17 December 2011 - # 4

[Donjeta]

Another reason I think he's being evasive about not knowing the date of Ayla's injury is because when there is serious injury people tend to know exactly how much time it's been since the injury. Time gets conceptualized in terms of n+1 days or weeks after X broke her arm, control visits get scheduled according to it etc.. It becomes important because you and the doctors all want to know if the injury is healing in schedule and how much longer you can expect the recovery to take.

 

[Donjeta]

I guess I am missing your point then? What about the accident is bothering you?

The way he says something and then says something that seems to be at odds with the first thing he said.

 

[Helenstreet]

When my daughter was 5 she broke her wrist rollerskating with her aunt. This was around 5 pm. She came home around 9pm after visiting with her aunt for the day. She did not cry, or act like it even hurt ...same as in the article. It was not until the next day that her arm swelled and became bruised. We took her to ER and it was a horrible fracture. One bone literally went into another in which pins and surgery took place. She never cried, (except when she first fell according to her aunt) and nothing appeared to be "hurt" until the next day and the obvious swelling/bruising.

I can certainly understand in your situation with a 5 year old child that you waited to have your daughter examined. However, in Ayla's case the circumstances of her injury and her young age are completely different. The injury occurred to an 18-19 month old, not to a preschooler. Not only that, I would imagine that your daughter was able to verbalize her discomfort? If my baby or toddler suffered any type of injury as a result of a grown person falling on them, I would take her/him to be examined by a doctor right away. I would not just be concerned about the arm, I would also want to rule out any internal damage. This is just my opinion.

 

[ThoughtFox]

You're no doubt an excellent parent but I don't trust JDP's account. '

"It was a dark and stormy night..." by Snoopy. There is no reason for him not to be sure of the exact date, he's been through this with the police enough to have covered when it happened. He knows when his last driving lessons were. LE have no doubt gotten the notes from the ER with the exact date of the ER visit on them and if they were thorough they asked his driving teacher for their schedule too. The exact date of the accident should be 24 hours before the ER visit and 24 hours before his last driving lesson. Not too hard to compute. That is, unless considerably longer than 24 hours elapsed between the accident and the ER visit.

I think this is an excellent point. People who have been through numerous interrogations shouldn't be vague at this point in an investigation, and if they are then it sounds like either denial or just lack of truthfulness.

(It reminds me of the recent Matt Palmgren interview the other day in which he seemed to keep waffling about the timeline and getting his facts wrong and the reporter kept having to remind him - how could he not remember?)

What exactly is burned into his brain if he doesn't know what happened?
Usually people use this expression differently, if something is burned into their brain they mean that they will always remember exactly. He probably knows exactly how it happened imo.

I took what he said a different way, maybe because I'm naturally suspicious. It's "burned into his brain" because if he hadn't fallen on his daughter and given her a broken arm, he might not have been the main suspect in this case. But because there was evidence that the child was injured, this whole thing is much more complicated. And maybe it really is that complicated, and the broken arm shouldn't be brushed off as just an accident.

There is a disconnect here imo. You don't call someone back in from the driveway just because their child is fine. Her hand was swollen, she was not fine. I understand that the money spent on the driving lessons was a priority but was there any reason his mom or whoever else was looking after Ayla while he was taking the driving lessons could not have taken Ayla to ER after noticing that the hand was swollen?

My question exactly! Why didn't someone else take her?

I don't think this is the whole truth and nothing but the truth about how Ayla broke her arm but of course it doesn't mean he knows what happened to Ayla later.

I feel the same way. :twocents:

 

[matou]

Justin should know the exact date of when he fell. His last driving class was the next day. He went to the hospital, etc. He is not releasing the date for some reason. Maybe it will trigger a memory for someone. He did get questioned extensively by police about the reason why Ayla needed a sling, etc. He said this himself. He is being evasive for some reason IMO.

My father grabbed me when I was three and sprained my arm and I had to wear a sling. It was done in anger either at me or at my mother. It hurt very much and I cried in pain when I was examined in the hospital.

 

[ThoughtFox]

I have to say that I've been having a severe case of tendonitis in my arm ever since before Thanksgiving when I cleaned out my garage, and sometimes I can't sleep if I roll over on it because of the pain. I have good days and bad days, but if someone bumps me the wrong way it hurts like heck. If I reach for something the wrong way, it takes a minute to recover.

I want to know how this little child was sleeping soundly with a broken arm? Was she on pain medication, for instance? Did someone give her too much perhaps?

I have lots of questions about that broken arm. :twocents:

 

[Helenstreet]

Yes, of course. We don't know how severe Ayla's injury was though.

Yes, they didn't know how serious Ayla's injury was because she was a 18-19 month old baby who probably cannot verbalize her discomfort in the same way that an older child or an adult can. In my opinion, that reason alone should warrant having the baby examined right away. Not only that, but a grown man fell on the child. How would they be assured that there wasn't any head trauma or internal injuries to the baby without having her checked out by a doctor? All of the anecdotal stories described on here that I have read thus far involve children and/or adults who are old enough to describe their injury; I have not read one story involving injury to a baby as the result of a grown adult falling on the child. Just my :twocents:

 

[Lera213]

Someone in that house knows where that child is. The GM could very well be covering for her son or another family member ala Cindy Anthony.

My gosh, the nation has learned a lot of how to's from the Casey case!

Fact is the Child was in that home last(BBM), the last people to see her was in that home! The child's mother's alibi has checked out, finger prints were taking in the home. I going to believe that the prints from the home matched only to those that were in that home when the child went missing.

 

[Lera213]

Yes, they didn't know how serious Ayla's injury was because she was a 18-19 month old baby who probably cannot verbalize her discomfort in the same way that an older child or an adult can. In my opinion, that reason alone should warrant having the baby examined right away. Not only that, but a grown man fell on the child. How would they be assured that there wasn't any head trauma or internal injuries to the baby without having her checked out by a doctor? All of the anecdotal stories described on here that I have read thus far involve children and/or adults who are old enough to describe their injury; I have not read one story involving injury to a baby as the result of a grown adult falling on the child. Just my :twocents:

To jump off your post,

When my son was only 14 months old he jumped and fell, broke his arm, my then teenage son was baby sitting. He picked up my 14mth old and soon as he touched his arm, the child cried. My teenager called the ambulance then us.

When your child falls in any fashion like they describe, you stand them on their feet, pick them up, hug them, say your sorry. You cannot tell me that after the break not one adult didn't nudge or touch the arm. That child would have cried out. Unless the child was drugged up on something to where it wouldn't feel the pain in the first place.

 

[Lavanda Dolce]

The way he says something and then says something that seems to be at odds with the first thing he said.

lol. Ok. Forgive me. Long day today!! But not understanding what you mean.

 

[Donjeta]

To jump off your post,

When my son was only 14 months old he jumped and fell, broke his arm, my then teenage son was baby sitting. He picked up my 14mth old and soon as he touched his arm, the child cried. My teenager called the ambulance then us.

When your child falls in any fashion like they describe, you stand them on their feet, pick them up, hug them, say your sorry. You cannot tell me that after the break not one adult didn't nudge or touch the arm. That child would have cried out. Unless the child was drugged up on something to where it wouldn't feel the pain in the first place.

I expect there was pain.
They do say Ayla cried and was scared and fussy. But she was fine and you couldn't possibly have known that there was anything wrong with her. :waitasec:

 

[Lavanda Dolce]

Yes, they didn't know how serious Ayla's injury was because she was a 18-19 month old baby who probably cannot verbalize her discomfort in the same way that an older child or an adult can. In my opinion, that reason alone should warrant having the baby examined right away. Not only that, but a grown man fell on the child. How would they be assured that there wasn't any head trauma or internal injuries to the baby without having her checked out by a doctor? All of the anecdotal stories described on here that I have read thus far involve children and/or adults who are old enough to describe their injury; I have not read one story involving injury to a baby as the result of a grown adult falling on the child. Just my :twocents:

Yes. I explained the story of my falling on my daughter at only a couple months old, slipped on ice and her head cracked into the ice. A huge egg formed and I took her to ER. I can tell you they put ice on it (as I did before we left) and I can also tell you they did not do any xrays or MRI's either. They said soft tissue damage and keep watch for excessive sleepiness.

 

[Lera213]

I expect there was pain.
They do say Ayla cried and was scared and fussy. But she was fine and you couldn't possibly have known that there was anything wrong with her. :waitasec:

Sarcasm noted and justified. I too find it hinky

 

[aksaranto]

Yes, they didn't know how serious Ayla's injury was because she was a 18-19 month old baby who probably cannot verbalize her discomfort in the same way that an older child or an adult can. In my opinion, that reason alone should warrant having the baby examined right away. Not only that, but a grown man fell on the child. How would they be assured that there wasn't any head trauma or internal injuries to the baby without having her checked out by a doctor? All of the anecdotal stories described on here that I have read thus far involve children and/or adults who are old enough to describe their injury; I have not read one story involving injury to a baby as the result of a grown adult falling on the child. Just my :twocents:

I have not seen anywhere that states that when they fell, that Justin landed on top of Ayla. I have only seen that they tripped up the stairs and he fell with her. Her arm could have been outstretched and barely jarred, which could have caused a hairline fracture. Sometimes, fractures are asymptomatic because they are so miniscule. I am a RN & office manager of a busy walk-in-clinic. We see injuries that are completely obvious to everyone that they are fractures based on symptoms & clinical exam, but when we xray them, they are not. We also see injuries where everyone thinks it is a soft-tissue injury based on clinical circumstance and symptoms and then everyone is surprised when the xray shows a fracture.

It seems that everyone has their own picture in their head about this fall & how they landed, but I have not seen it completely described. It is quite possible that Ayla only cried a little bit when it happened and they thought maybe it just scared her. I have not seen it described anywhere that they had any reason to suspect that she had a head injury, based on the fall.

My own opinions, of course.

 

[Lavanda Dolce]

I expect there was pain.
They do say Ayla cried and was scared and fussy. But she was fine and you couldn't possibly have known that there was anything wrong with her. :waitasec:

Yes...if the child would have obviously fallen in a fashion that it was noticeable that the arm was twisted, etc. But from what I gather, if Ayla is like other toddlers she cried because of the fall...not necessarily due to any injuries made from the fall...especially if no blood, etc. We are not talking about a compound fracture here...they put an ace bandage and splint on it. No surgery required, no snapping of bones. Truth be told...it could have been such a hairline fracture that it might even have happened earlier in the day just playing. I'm not minimizing the injury...but I am certainly not making this sound like such a horrendous break that "anyone would have noticed and rushed her straight to ER." ...fact is, most people look first for blood, tooth through the lip, etc...I think each of us here who recounted our stories were all actually surprised a break occurred with each of our children and some of the breaks explained were far more serious than Ayla's.

 

[Lera213]

Well if you knew there might be a custody battle down the road and there might be claims that the child returned from one parent with bruises in the past, a parent will be hesitate to seek medical attention for that child so that there will be no documentation.

 

[Lavanda Dolce]

Let's not forget the ol' saying "with hindsight".........we all know we would do things differently. I think JD even said something to that effect himself.

 

[matou]

Is there a link yet for the Today show from this morning?

 

[Lavanda Dolce]

Well if you knew there might be a custody battle down the road and there might be claims that the child returned from one parent with bruises in the past, a parent will be hesitate to seek medical attention for that child so that there will be no documentation.

There was documentation. Plenty of it. He took her to ER and they ruled it was not due to any abuse or fault of the parent or family. A mere accident.

 

[Donjeta]

I have not seen anywhere that states that when they fell, that Justin landed on top of Ayla. I have only seen that they tripped up the stairs and he fell with her. Her arm could have been outstretched and barely jarred, which could have caused a hairline fracture. Sometimes, fractures are asymptomatic because they are so miniscule. I am a RN & office manager of a busy walk-in-clinic. We see injuries that are completely obvious to everyone that they are fractures based on symptoms & clinical exam, but when we xray them, they are not. We also see injuries where everyone thinks it is a soft-tissue injury based on clinical circumstance and symptoms and then everyone is surprised when the xray shows a fracture.

It seems that everyone has their own picture in their head about this fall & how they landed, but I have not seen it completely described. It is quite possible that Ayla only cried a little bit when it happened and they thought maybe it just scared her. I have not seen it described anywhere that they had any reason to suspect that she had a head injury, based on the fall.

My own opinions, of course.

"I came up the stairs and slipped. It happened so fast, I don't know exactly how I fell on her, but I fell on her," he said. "It's burned into my brain."

http://www.pressherald.com/news/ayl...s-broken_2012-01-07.html?pageType=mobile&id=1