Media Links ONLY - No Discussion

in Diario Digital this morning:

http://diariodigital.sapo.pt/news.asp?id_news=295381

Copied from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com/index.cgi?board=latest&action=display&thread=1182386581&page=30 post #437

Maddie: Judge wants to make the process public

The Superior Magistrature Counsel should pronounce itself this Tuesday about the request that was made by judge Pedro Frias, who wants to publicly explain the process about the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.

According to Correio da Manha today, the counsel that directs the judges should meet this morning, and one of the items that are to be solved is the request from the criminal instruction judge from Portimao.

Pedro Frias believes that the judicial proceedings in the criminal investigation of the Brirtish girl should be explained to the media, given the exposure of the case.

The journalists have also requested a public statement about the process, and this document was attached to the request that was sent by the judge to the Superior Counsel, the only instance that can allow to make public statements.
 
from LUSA just now:

http://noticias.sapo.pt/lusa/artigo/sko71LAwsYj8ohrd7ztC6w.html

Copied from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com/index.cgi?board=latest&action=display&thread=1182386581&page=30 post #438

Madeleine: CSM [Judges Counsel] assumes clarifications about the case, but says they are not justified for now

18 de Setembro de 2007, 12:07

Lisboa, 18 Set (Lusa) - The Conselho Superior de Magistratura (CSM) [Judges Superior Counsel] announced today it will assume any statements about the "Madeleine case" in collaboration with the instruction judge from Portimao, stressing that at the moment no public information is justified.

The Instruction JUdge in Portimao, Pedro Frias, asked the CSM for authorization to explain to the media what the judicial procedures of the case are, considering the proportions this criminal investigation has grown into within public opinion.

In a statement that was released today, the CSM explains that the case of the missing English girl is still in the investigation phase, and the Ministerio Publico is in charge of releasing information ans clarifications about its development.

The CSM, the body that manages and disciplines the judges, also refers that during this phase, the intervention of the instruction judge "is momentary and is aimed at safeguarding the rights, the freedoms and the guarantees, therefore authorizing or denying the execution of diligences", like for example forensic tests, searches and apprehensions.

On the 11th of this month, the Policia Judiciaria delivered its preliminary report to the Ministerio Publico (MP), in Portimao, which then sent it to the criminal instruction judge.

(...)
 
http://www.correiodamanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=255793&idselect=181&idCanal=181&p=0

http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com... 86581&page=20

Suspicions: Gerry says the twins have deep sleep
Syringe in apartment is investigated

The twins Sean and Amelie never woke up with the turmoil on the night of the crime, before and after their sister was taken from the apartment, but Gerry McCann guarantees it’s normal and says his children usually sleep without interruptions. But Judiciaria found a syringe with tranquilizers in the dresser inside the medic couple’s bedroom, a source that is connected with the investigation told CM – and that is also being taken in account by the inspectors.

The father has been showing himself rather irritated about the investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine, his 4-year old daughter who was taken from the apartment where they were spending their holidays at Praia da Luz, on May 3. He exploded as soon as journalists confronted him with the blood that was found on the walls, and tore off the microphone, leaving his wife alone in front of the cameras, in an interview for a program of Spanish channel Telecinco, which was broadcast on Saturday evening.

Gerry does not comment on the fact that he was the last person to see his daughter alive, when he visited her in the bedroom around 9 p.m. – but both he and his wife think it’s “normal” that their twin children kept sleeping on the night of the crime. “It’s very difficult for us, all this speculation, but what is certain is that our children were very tired, they’re very small and we can’t find out if they heard anything…”.

“We usually put them to sleep between 7 and 8 p.m. and they sleep all night without interruptions. It’s a routine we follow in the UK and which we’ve kept here”, the children’s father justified, thus dismissing the possibility that the twins, 2, were put asleep with the injectable tranquilizers that the inspectors found in a dresser in the parents’ bedroom.

Criticism and nervousness

At a time when the Judiciaria’s team is closing in and the investigation is advancing “increasingly in a circle”, as one of the inspectors told CM, Gerry throws critics at the PJ. “We want to reach the bottom of things and find Madeleine, but obviously there are no signs of any breakthrough – the Portuguese police does things in a very, very discrete way so people don’t know, and that is difficult for us, too”, the father says.

The doctor, who has stopped being called for weekly meetings with the PJ as long as the results of the analyses don’t arrive from England, also says that “the way the investigation is being handled is very different from that in the UK, where police likes to give information…

http://www.tvi.iol.pt/informacao/noticia.php?id=847961

PJ investigates syringe with tranquilizers
 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/29/wmaddy129.xml
Madeleine McCann's father's desperate plea

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2005320001-2007400633,00.html
Sighting of Madeleine in France; School prayer tribute for missing classmate
-------------------------------------

http://www.correiodamanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=255990&idCanal=10
Kate and Gerry Mccann want to leave the Algarve

PJ confident in the results of the analyses

All the analyses of the samples collected by the PJ in the apartment where Madeleine spent her holidays with her parents at the Praia da Luz, and the samples from the cars used by the McCanns and friends “will be done in the Birmingham Laboratory, without any transference to another country’, as indicated to the CM by a PJ source. And “the results will appear”.

“There are dozens of analyses,” an inspector confirmed, “ and therefore there was never any final date for the results”. The laboratory work continues in England, contrary to what has been recently reported – and “the scientists cannot be pressured because of the complexity of the analyses,” said the same source.

“Everything will be done”, and the results will be out, the PJ believes, while they continue the investigation “ with more discreet activities”.

Meanwhile, Maddies parents are preparing to leave the Algarve in the next two weeks, and a spokesperson for the couple, Justine McGuiness, only has a reservation until the 9th.

At the same time, relations between the British press and Justine are increasingly tense, with the latter being accused of favouring “those that give favourable reports regarding Kate and Gerry” according to what English reporters have told CM.

Some journalists who have asked “uncomfortable questions” have been given “discriminatory treatment regarding updates,” about the McCanns by the spokesperson.

In England, the school authorities where Maddie studied have decided to maintain a place for her at the school.
--------------------------------

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...article_id=478885&in_page_id=1770&ito=newsnow
McCanns are not suspects

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/31/nmaddy231.xml
McCanns to sue newspaper to defend reputations
--------------------------------

http://www.rtp.pt/index.php?article=296379&visual=16

The director of Tal&Qual weekly newspaper guaranteed to Lusa that he never accused the McCanns of killing their daughter, clarifying that last week’s headline only transmits what the police believe.

The parents of Madeleine McCann have announced today, through BBC News, that they are going to sue Tal&Qual after this paper reported on news that indicate that the Policia Judiciaria (PJ) believed the couple killed Maddie accidentally.

“I keep the story, I won’t change a comma”, director Emidio Fernando told Lusa, clarifying that the newspaper “never accused anyone, just says what the police believes”.

Saying he is “absolutely tranquil” concerning a possible lawsuit, the weekly’s director said the McCanns’ intentions are “based on the articles that were published in English newspapers, which say that Tal&Qual accuses the family of a crime”.

“If we published the story, it’s because we are certain of it”, Emidio Fernando said, adding that “what the newspaper assumes is that the police believe” the possibility that the parents killed the English girl accidentally.

“I trust our sources and please note that I say sources in plural, because they are more than three”, the director said, who guarantees that the weekly he directs “never wrote anything that has not been confirmed, since this process [of Maddie’s disappearance] started”.

Although they have not received any notification about a possible defamation lawsuit that the McCanns have announced to be filing, the complaint is, according to BBC News, against the newspaper and the director.
 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/05/nmaddy105.xml
Significant forensic evidence handed to police

http://gazetadigitalpraiadaluz.blogspot.com/2007/09/some-advice-to-penny-wark-correspondent.html
Questions and answers about the first days after Maddie's disappearance

http://www.correiomanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=256823&idselect=21&idCanal=21&p=200

The translation is by Ozzy of the Mirror forums:

Biological fluids of Maddie were found by the Birmingham lab in the samples sent by the PJ to England

The newspaper CM knows that these traces – residues of blood not visible to the naked eye which were found in the Ocean Club and the rented car of the McCanns – already in the possession of the PJ should determine immediate developments of the case. Most important of all will be a new interrogation of Madeleines parents and some friends of the couple who were on holiday in the Algarve when the child disappeared.

These developments based on the results of the biological samples were also highlighted in various English newspapers who indicate there will be arrests in the next 48 hours. The most important samples, of the dozens sent to England, are the ones collected in the apartment of the McCanns at the Praia da Luz, especially samples from the floor and the cupboard in the house where the family lived afterwards and in the car which they rented after the child disappeared. These samples were collected after the specially trained dogs from England signalled biological traces of blood and the odor of a cadaver on the clothes of Kate McCann.
 
http://www.correiodamanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=256813&idselect=181&idCanal=181&p=0

Correio de Manhã for 9/06

Tests: There are partial results
Cadaver odor on Kate’s clothes

The English dog that is specially trained to detect the odor of cadavers found a trace of death on Kate McCann’s clothes, as well as on the soft toy that the mother of Madeleine has carried since the first hour, which she took to the Vatican and presents as one of the child’s favorite toys. The dog’s work has been recorded on video and can be presented as evidence by the Policia Judiciaria.

The dog was extremely nervous when he smelled a pair of jeans that was often used by Kate, and a shirt. These clues were collected in July – as CM could discover – at the same time that the animal detected the smell of death in the Ocean Club apartment where the child disappeared from.

A second dog that was used by the police, who specializes in finding biological residues like blood, sweat or saliva, also reinforced the signs of the first animal, as he detected what is presumed to be blood in the trunk of the car that was used by the McCanns – which was rented after the child’s disappearance, on May 3.

Meanwhile, CM knows that some of the tests that were performed on the collected residues are already in the investigators’ hands. The lab in Birmingham, England, has sent some elements, but not all the results are known yet. It is also not known when they started to arrive at the PJ, although several sources that were contacted by our newspaper guaranteed that only started happening this week.

The results’ arrival in Portimao may consolidate the investigators’ beliefs, which have been pointing for over two months at a scenario of the child’s death inside the apartment of Praia da Luz. The coming days will be decisive.

http://www.correiodamanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=256813&idselect=181&idCanal=181&p=0

Moita Flores, criminalista

CM: The analyses have arrived at PJ. What could happen now?

MF: If they have arrived, they could create the conditions to proceed to new questioning and possibly arrests.

CM: These results could, then, be decisive and orient the investigation in a specific direction?

MF: They could come to confirm some of the hypotheses that are on the table. They orient, decisively, by action or by omision.

CM: Was the delay in the results arriving reasonable?

MF: No... if they have arrived already. They should have been here a long time ago.

CM: Do you continue to believe that the English could have intervened with the intent to delay the results and the investigation?

MF: I have no douts that there was a power play from the government and the media such that this case would have had no other solution apart from an abduction.

CM: Is there any chance that the resulls were inconclusive?

MF: After so many days and so many weeks I can not believe that the results are inconclusive. It is easy and quick to arrive at a conclusion that is inconclusive, but not the opposite.

CM: With the results in the PJ's hands, do you believe that the case will be resolved in the next few days or the short term?

MF: I will not say that it is going to be resolved definitively because the case is only resolved when it is handed to the judge. But it can have great strides (towards the front=.

CM: According to the British press, the police are not saying anything to Madeleine's parents. Is this normal?

MF: The British press in this case has not been trustworthy. I have no doubts that they have done everything possible to deny the case with each piece of evidence presented.

CM_ Do you believe that Britains were involved in Madeleine's disappearance?

MF: I believe that the hypothesis that is most trustworthy, coherent, sensible and compatible is a homicide.

CM: By the Britians?

MF: By someone who had access to that house.
 
http://ukpress.google.com/article/ALeqM5jIFoi_xzFo0VqZN2wg1Mp4m9ndEw
McCanns fear being named suspects

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2007/09/06/madeleine-interviews.html
Police re-interview Madeleine's parents

http://gazetadigitalmadeleinecase.blogspot.com/
McCann couple granted the statute of “assistentes” in the crime investigation

"Gerry and Kate McCann have requested the statute of “assistentes” in the crime investigation of Madeleine disappearance. From a legal point of view, they still are both witnesses, until now, and the statute of “assistentes” does not change that situation, because both statutes coexist without conflict.
It means that, as witnesses, Gerry and Kate still must tell the truth, the all truth and only the truth, when questioned by police. Not doing that will be a breach of the law, with consequences. They may require the presence of a lawyer, when questioned, a right that any witness has."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/06/nmaddy306.xml
Madeleine McCann's mother fears rumours

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1283122,00.html
Kate McCann questioned as witness, fears being named suspect
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/video_and_audio/default.stm
Video interview by KM's attorney

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article2402981.ece
Parents fear they will become suspects

http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/maddies-mother-quizzed-for-11-hours/2007/09/07/1188783451031.html
Madeleine's mum to be named suspect

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=294159
Madeleine's mother fears she's being 'framed'

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6982969.stm
Madeleine's mother named suspect

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=294069
Marathon interrogation of Madeleine's mother
----------------------

And that concludes all the links to old news articles about Madeleine.
 
DNA IN HIRE CAR CAN BE EXPLAINED.......................:rolleyes:

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1284729,00.html

SNIPPET============================

The vehicle had also been used by a number of people, including several family members, before it was examined.
Sky News Crime Correspondent Martin Brunt said up to 30 people are believed to have had access to the Renault in the 10 weeks after the car was hired.
Commenting on reports that Madeleine's bodily fluids had been found in the car, he said it was quite possible one of the twins might have urinated in the car.=====================================
 
in Correio da Manha today:

http://www.correiodamanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=258515&idselect=181&idCanal=181&p=0

Copied from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com/index.cgi?board=latest&action=display&thread=1182386581&page=30 post #446

Investigation: Preparing interrogations
Judiciaria requests searches at McCanns’ house


PJ required for the house of Kate and Gerry in Rothley to be searched. The purpose would be, among other diligences, to apprehend the diary of Maddie’s mother, as well as to look for new clues that may explain the disappearance of the British child. The request for the search was made to the instruction judge, and has apparently been granted. It is part of a large set of diligences that were requested by Portuguese authorities, and which are included in the request letter that will be sent to England, where the PJ will have to travel in order to carry out some diligences that are related to the investigation.

Beside the new interrogation of the McCanns, the authorities have also requested that all their friends would be inquired in order to tell, once again, the events of the evening of May 3. Some of the contradictions in their depositions still stand, and the goal is to clarify these once and for all.

Concerning the diary, with its apprehension already authorized by judge Pedro Frias, the PJ believes it may contain elements that allow to define Maddie’s mother’s psychological profile. In her writings, Kate complains about Madeleine’s hyperactivity and calls the twins “hysterical”, thus showing psychological fatigue.

At the time of the disappearance, the diary was not confiscated because the authorities didn’t presume the McCann couple to be suspects. Therefore, it is only now, one and a half months after the searches, that PJ asked for it to be attached to the process.

Because it is a piece of evidence that “invades” the arguidos’ personal sphere, the request had to be made to the judge, after the Ministerio Publico agreed to it. It was immediately granted and will now be included in the request letters that are going to be sent to the British authorities.

Meanwhile, the authorities are acting with doubled care. The legal offensive that is expected from the McCanns, who have hired some of the world’s most expensive lawyers, is already expected, and a clear sign of it was given by nominating a new aide: Clarence Mitchell, an ex-director of the media monitoring unit with the British government.

The attitude has changed, and Gerry and Kate have appeared in public again, beside their new spokesman, who reaffirmed both their innocence in a clear speech, guaranteeing that he accepted to leave a public job in favour of what he considered to be the defense of truth.

Clarence asked for the process to refocus on the search for Maddie, setting the tone for the campaign that can be foreseen. Several personalities have announced to be willing to finance the McCanns’ legal expenses.

(article continues)
 
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/19634/MADDY-NOW-THE-MYSTERY-DEEPENS


snip
Thursday September 20,2007

By Martin Evans and David Pilditch in Praia da Luz



THE fate of Madeleine McCann remained shrouded in mystery last night after a judge ruled that her parents would not have to be questioned again.

Kate and Gerry McCann were said to be “relieved and encouraged” after detectives were forced to admit they had no new evidence against them.


Legal sources in Portugal said a statement from the public prosecutor’s office late yesterday meant the case was again wide open and all lines of inquiry were being investigated.
 
Don't know if this has been posted yet, but I found it encouraging because it reinforces my own thoughts as to how all this stuff is coming together.

http://www.gulfnews.com/world/United_Kingdom/10154877.html

Salem


Samples from resort town being tested

Evening Standard
Published: September 19, 2007, 23:21

London: Crucial new DNA tests that could hold the key to the Madeleine McCann investigation are being carried out in Britain.
The tests are looking for traces of the toddler's DNA from material gathered around the resort town of Praia da Luz in Portugal, including alleged blood samples found in an apartment close to the one from where she disappeared on May 3.
Results of the tests taking place at the Forensic Science Service laboratory in Birmingham could be sent to Portugal within days. Reports on Tuesday cast doubt on DNA evidence found in the family hire car that caused Portuguese police to officially name Kate and Gerry McCann as suspects.


But British sources close to the investigation insisted yesterday that "very few people" know exactly what forensic material has been gathered and point out that many of those criticising the investigation are basing their arguments on false assumptions about the facts.
As an example, a claim by the McCanns' supporters that toxicology tests could not have been carried out on hair samples found in the couple's hire car because the root was missing is said to be factually incorrect.
Instead, those involved directly in the investigation are said to remain confident about the forensic material that has been gathered.
Sources stress that despite the failure of Portuguese police to seal off the McCanns' apartment or to secure the couple's hire car - in which vital evidence is believed to have been found - the British forensic scientists working on the case have taken the risks of contamination into account. They are also said to be fully aware of the similarities in the DNA of Madeleine and her siblings and to have taken these into account when submitting their findings to Portugal.
"The work that has gone on is very thorough and involves a very painstaking process of testing, checking and re-checking," said an official involved in the investigation. "These people are some of the world's leading forensic scientists and they do not reach their conclusions lightly or without being aware of the possible problems with the material they are testing."
Madeleine was six days short of her fourth birthday when she disappeared. The current forensic testing follows the submission of a first batch of results to Portugal two weeks ago by the British experts.







 

McCanns welcome police decision

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7004081.stm

The parents of Madeleine McCann are "very encouraged" that Portuguese police are not currently seeking to reinterview them, their spokesman said.
Kate and Gerry McCann have also learned that other lines of inquiry are not being ruled out by detectives.

The attorney general office's disclosure came after a judge examined a 1,000-page police dossier, including evidence involving Madeleine's parents.
 
in Correio da Manha today:

http://www.correiodamanha.pt/noticia.asp?id=258662&idselect=9&idCanal=9&p=200

Copied from: http://helpmadeleine.proboards79.com/index.cgi?board=latest&action=display&thread=1182386581&page=31 post #455

Madeleine McCann case
Scientist contradicts parents’ explanations


Antonio Amorim, the vice director of the Pathology and Immunology Institute at Oporto University, defends that DNA transference from a piece of clothing or from a sandal into the boot of a car is “virtually impossible”. The scientist guaranteed to CM that the hypothesis is merely academic and that he does not believe it could happen.

The issue was now raised by English newspapers which, citing from sources close to the McCann family, guarantee there are “innocent” explanations for the presence of DNA from Maddie in the car that was rented by the couple. One of them is the fact that the family moved houses (they left the Ocean Club and rented a villa in Praia da Luz), and ferried all the family’s belongings in the car boot. Madeleine’s sandals would have been inside the vehicle, and her biological residues would have transferred into the car.

“Theoretically, there can be contamination. But the hypothesis is virtually impossible, as the quality of the residue would have to be acceptable. There would also have to be perfect moisture conditions for the transference to occur, which is only possible in academical terms”, the scientist assures, also refuting the other explanation that was advanced by the child’s parents yesterday, that some of the collected residues could come from their twin children.

“When one tries to reconstruct DNA, one searches for target areas. A person’s DNA has a large interindividual diversity, something that is completely different, even among siblings. There is a kind of tombola among that which is transmitted to us from our parents, and it would be a gross mistake from the laboratory to mistake the DNA from the other children. It is again virtually impossible, as we are dealing with one of the world’s more prestigious labs.”

Antonio Amorim also stresses that he understands the delay from the English specialists in obtaining results. “They can, and they should take a lot of time. That is precisely what guarantees us there are high levels of reliability”, the specialist says, assuring he understands why the authorities have asked London to perform the tests. “It was an excellent option. Because it is a reference lab, and it is almost impossible to contest the results.”

PGR says there will be new diligences

The district general prosecutor of Evora, Luis Bilro Verao, released a statement yesterday about the Maddie case, guaranteeing that “no new interrogations were determined” from Maddie’s parents, because no new evidence has been collected. That diligence would have to be made in Portugal, and the prosecutor said nothing about the requests for clarification and evidence collection that will be made by a request letter to England. The prosecutor added, in a short note that clarifies very little, that the authorities “do not exclude any investigation line”.

“Diligences within the inquiry will proceed […] which will be developed according to the plan that has been established between both entities”, the prosecutor adds, confirming that, as the presupposition of the application of ‘termo de identidade e residencia’ have not changed, “the alteration of the coercion measure has not been promoted, as it has been considered the adequate measure according to the elements that have been collected”.

Couple fears having their cellphones under surveillance in England

Kate and Gerry fear that their cellphones may be under surveillance. This was the most recent of a new wave of news in the English press, which have been focusing more on the investigation than on the drama of the disappearance of the McCann couple’s daughter.

The re-entrance on scene by aide Clarence Mitchell, the day before yesterday, coincides with the new pattern. ‘The Sun’ publishes the alleged dismissal of DNA evidence that was collected by Portuguese police. The ‘Daily Mail’ published an article about rumours against the McCanns that would have started “hours after” the disappearance of Madeleine. It concludes that “the defamation campaign has failed and the McCanns’ friends question whether the police really searched for a kidnapper”. In the afternoon, the same newspaper revealed that the couple feared that their cellphones were under surveillance, and that their lawyers assumed that all conversations by electronic means were not safe. The couple even believes that this surveillance started in Portugal and continues in England.

A listing of the main titles makes the English press’ tone over the last few days clear: “We can explain DNA in our car”, “Police cannot prove Madeleine’s death”, or “Immediate mistakes may have compromised the inquiry”.

The ‘Daily Mirror’ revealed that Gerry has regained contact with the British prime minister through an aide. The next step is the campaign to refocus on the search of Madeleine’s kidnapper.

DETAILS

The explanations that are now advanced by “close sources” of the McCanns in order to justify the DNA matches that were found inside the car are new to the Portuguese investigators. This had never been said during the interrogations, and Kate did not answer those questions.

The McCanns’ lawyers are building their defense against DNA evidence and cadaver odour, based on other judicial cases. The couple’s defense team will meet with the lawyers of the alleged Omagh bomber, who has not been convicted yet because of controversy over DNA evidence.

Madeleine’s disappearance will originate a movie. There are not concrete details about the movie yet, but actors Russell Crowe and Kate Blanchett are being named for the roles of Gerry and Kate. Two major movie production companies are fighting for the movie.

(…)

The elements of Policia Judiciaria did not travel to London the day before yesterday, as was reported by several newspapers.

The process is still in Portimao’s courthouse. It has not been returned to Policia Judiciaria yet, which awaits its reception in order to resume diligences.

The Policia Judiciaria has not written the request letter yet, which will ask for new interrogations and searches at the McCanns’ house.

Clarence Mitchell, the new McCann aide, abandoned a salary that is equivalent to one hundred thousand euros per year, in order to assure the family’s defense.
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
264
Guests online
608
Total visitors
872

Forum statistics

Threads
625,845
Messages
18,511,767
Members
240,857
Latest member
Moo's Clues
Back
Top