Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #10

[wasnt_me]

Why would you write that? That's disgusting.

It is quite possible that Meredith accidentally hit a programmed number on her phone, and later deleted the automatic message she received from the bank. That happened at 10:15. That means the attack could have started after 10:15.

Maybe I'm not understanding. I thought someone said the wrong area code had been dialed to place a call to the bank, as per below:

Dempsey:10:00 p.m. Someone makes a call on Meredith’s cellphone to her bank in the UK. It doesn’t go through because the caller didn’t punch the proper area code for London.

 

[Nova]

Thanks for being reasonable, and for some reason I picture Otto as a grouchy Germanic Professor, so love to give him these::razz::slap:
Well, when I was growing up, our grandmother would say, "Come here and put your coat on before you go running out, you Ninny!"---so I thought it meant sort of a "nincompoop"???:floorlaugh:

I don't know where otto lives and it is none of my business. But for another case, he has discussed the languages he learned as a child and he does not appear to be an ethnic German.

 

[wasnt_me]

Right, and was so upset he left DNA inside her body. Guede is so obviously guilty, and Raffaele and Amanda show no indication of being Paul and Karla. Remember, Karla as has been said hooked up with a man who was already a repeat violent sexual offender.

What IS the DNA he left inside her body? Of course, I naturally thought sperm, but this "sexual assault" and not rape think throws me off.

Oh, and SMK, remember, RG claims he got his groove on, conscenually before having to take a crap. And "just then" the bad guy rushed in to do his dasterdly deed and blamed it on "the black" before disappearing into the night.

 

[Nova]

Maybe I'm not understanding. I thought someone said the wrong area code had been dialed to place a call to the bank, as per below:

I asked this same question a few pages back. I don't understand how a pre-programmed number would be missing the area/country code.

UNLESS (it suddenly occurs to me), MK lived in the same district as the bank and didn't have to dial the code when she was home in England. Perhaps she hadn't re-programmed the number since she moved to Italy.

(This didn't occur to me before because we have so few areas left in the U.S. where one only one area code is in use and can be omitted when dialing.)

 

[wasnt_me]

Almost anything is more believable than the official theory (i.e., theories). But RG's story requires consensual sex with MK and I just don't believe she took advantage of her new boyfriend's absence to have sex with the stinky local drug dealer, do you? Nothing we know of MK suggests she would do that.

Now, how do you know he stank?

Because he was sitting on the toilet? sitting on the toilet! sitting on the toilet!

:floorlaugh:

I think AK stole his poop and was there that morning to place it in the toilet to implicate him, along with her very intrical clean up to remove traces of herself. to confuse the police, she also wiped up RG's right shoe print trail to the front door but left the left print there.

 

[wasnt_me]

Nope. Just give an example that is appropriate ... intelligent person being questioned who comes up with a whopper of a lie after 2 hours ... and who is actually innocent of the crime they are being interviewed about.

I don't understand. "Coming up with a whopper of a lie" when you don't KNOW what really happened seems logical to me, if you feel pressured into stating something. Your idea of pressure must be akin to what they did at Gitmo. Maybe AK doesn't need waterboarding to feel the pressure.

 

[wasnt_me]

Right ... and then her father said to her "imagine that Rudy didn't break in through the window, how did he then enter the cottage" ... and this is the only reason that Amanda says anything ... because someone asks her a question and she'll make up anything rather than speak the truth.

Or maybe she made up something, like PL's involvement, because no one would believe the truth.

 

[wasnt_me]

I don't think so. The problem is that it is highly inappropriate for adults to be flipping cartwheels at the police station during a murder investigation. It suggests a complete disrespect for the seriousness of the situation.

Exactly. Which is why, as I read somewhere else, and I think SMK knows this and brought it up before, that it was some destressing yoga she was doing without any flipping involved. I am not surprised those police can't figure out what a cartwheel is.

SMK, if I'm wrong, then hopefully whomever had mentioned the yoga thing will come in an state it again.

And if she's guilty, why voluntarily go to the police station in the first place?

 

[SMK]

I am very ambivalent about the disparity between what is allowed from police and what is required of private citizens.

In the U.S., our Supreme Court has ruled that police may lie almost at will (with only a few exceptions). On the other hand, private citizens commit felonies if they lie to police (ask Martha Stewart).

The only solution, really, is that none of us talk to police EVER. Ask for a lawyer and shut the hell up, if you're smart. Guilt or innocence is beside the point.

Absolutely!!! This should be taught to youth in school. And how many times on these COPS reality shows, does an officer say to a suspect, "Are you lying to me? You'd better not be lying to me." And yet it is OK for THEM to lie? NOT!!!

 

[Nova]

Now, how do you know he stank?

Because he was sitting on the toilet? sitting on the toilet! sitting on the toilet!

:floorlaugh:

I think AK stole his poop and was there that morning to place it in the toilet to implicate him, along with her very intrical clean up to remove traces of herself. to confuse the police, she also wiped up RG's right shoe print trail to the front door but left the left print there.

There have been reports that RG had a body odor problem. I don't have a link handy, but it has been linked here before.

(Don't even get me started on people who fail to flush toilets!)

 

[SMK]

Exactly. Which is why, as I read somewhere else, and I think SMK knows this and brought it up before, that it was some destressing yoga she was doing without any flipping involved. I am not surprised those police can't figure out what a cartwheel is.

SMK, if I'm wrong, then hopefully whomever had mentioned the yoga thing will come in an state it again.

I actually had not brought it up, but YES, I had heard many times that Amanda was an avid practicer of Yoga, and did all sorts of de-stressing activities which included stretching which may have been more what she was doing . In the end, though, doing a cartwheel is not against the law, and it should not factor in one way or the other. It seems there is such antipathy toward Amanda, and yet I feel LE are more worthy of antipathy, because of what has been revealed about them (NOT just the Italian, but I for one through college courses and documentaries have come to really DISTRUST law and courts. Wish it were not so. )

 

[wasnt_me]

Also, from research on the topic:

Previous research has shown that most true confessions emerge after two hours and that interrogations which lead to false confessions typically last over 6 hours, with an average of 16.3 hours.” She believes that imposing a time limit of 4 or 6 hours should help decrease the occurrence of false confessions. http://www.cgu.edu/pages/5450.asp

Well according to that, Ak's testimony must have lasted 2 hours and 1 minute because she gave a false confession about PL. She did not confess to stabbing MK ever, did she? I don't get why we are even saying she confessed at all after two hours, because she didn't. she lied and blamed someone else and lied that she was in the room.

That's not confessing to doing the crime. Where have I been misled here?

 

[SMK]

Exactly. Which is why, as I read somewhere else, and I think SMK knows this and brought it up before, that it was some destressing yoga she was doing without any flipping involved. I am not surprised those police can't figure out what a cartwheel is.

SMK, if I'm wrong, then hopefully whomever had mentioned the yoga thing will come in an state it again.

And if she's guilty, why voluntarily go to the police station in the first place?

Wasnt_Me: Look also at this:


“Amanda accompanied Raffaele to the station where he was then interrogated by Monica Napoleani, the Perugia chief of homicide. Amanda was there to support him, as he had supported her before, when she was interrogated,” said Chris Mellas. Chris Mellas is the husband of Edda Mellas, Amanda’s mother. Both live in West Seattle. “She was actually sitting alone in a separate room waiting for her boyfriend, and Napoleani said in court Friday (Feb. 27) that when she went to get some water she walked by the room where Amanda was and saw Amanda ‘doing the splits.’ She said she thought this was ‘odd behavior,’ and that Amanda should have instead appeared to be mourning the loss of Meredith. The tabloid press further sensationalized her statement by changing ‘the splits’ to ‘cartwheels,’ and the mainstream press ran with that. ” “Amanda does yoga to calm herself down and relieve stress, and she told her father and me that’s why she was doing the splits. Also, in those four days she was in mourning over Meredith, which followed her outrage. Six hours after the discovery (of the body) she was like, ‘Let’s find the who killed her.’” http://www.zimbio.com/Amanda+Knox/articles/68/Cartwheels+No+Cartwheels+Judge

 

[SMK]

Well according to that, Ak's testimony must have lasted 2 hours and 1 minute because she gave a false confession about PL. She did not confess to stabbing MK ever, did she? I don't get why we are even saying she confessed at all after two hours, because she didn't. she lied and blamed someone else and lied that she was in the room.

That's not confessing to doing the crime. Where have I been misled here?

Exactly! She quickly recanted, said it had not been reliable or true, that it had seemed "unreal like a dream" and should not be trusted. She did NOT "confess".

 

[flourish]

Thanks for being reasonable, and for some reason I picture Otto as a grouchy Germanic Professor, so love to give him these::razz::slap:
Well, when I was growing up, our grandmother would say, "Come here and put your coat on before you go running out, you Ninny!"---so I thought it meant sort of a "nincompoop"???:floorlaugh:

I appreciate the goofiness--god knows we could use some lightness around here sometimes....but let's not get into a German-bashing session here....or a Professor-bashing session, either (yeah Nova?)....I realize you probably don't mean that in a truly mean way, but...I'd prefer we avoid such generalizing statements....for all you know, Otto is in fact a Peruvian grandmother...or a Law Professor at Harvard...or a Jew whose grandparents were killed in the Holocaust....remember to attack the post, not the poster

 

[wasnt_me]

Now that I think of it, it does not make much sense. Perhaps I meant that she knew she was moving in with Raff, and was leaving on a spiteful note (but never intended to leave on a murderous note)?:waitasec:

Oh, Is that true or are you "guessing?" (guessing my new word, I think you've seen)

Because if that's you're educated guess, then it might make some sense. I would have to bring up, for better or worse, that AK has said in statements after the murder that she'd hoped to move wherever LM and FR moved. Of course, if your guess is true, she just said that to make herself look good.

 

[wasnt_me]

yes,I think the focus is way too much on AK.There's so little discussion about RS and RG for that matter.I like to read the three diaries each one of them wrote in prison .I think they are very telling and yes,point to RG as being guilty even though what he writes is most passionate but it reveals that he has a very troubled soul,I aso remember a video on his myspace or some other social network but I can't find it anymore where he says "I'm a vampire,I'm dracula,I want to suck your blood" which in hindsight is really haunting...there's so little about RS,he almost became AK's invisible shadow.His diary reveals a lot more compassion for MK than Amanda's as well and I appreciate how he repents his superficiality and actually uses being in prison as a learning experience.

I saw that youtube of him peeling his eyelids back. It was haunting.

Yes, I wonder if Otto can find some freudian slips in RG's diary.

 

[otto]

The pictures of the crime scene show her windows are closed until FR altered that, too while she was so innocently altering the crime scene. That witness heard something, alright, and said that night she heard it was Halloween.

I don't understand. You can think AK and RS are guilty without having to believe what extemperaneous, so-called witnesses have said. Some of them have just "come forward" to get media attention. You should be able to discern which ones to believe and not believe without being in danger of losing your hope that they're guilty.

Who took pictures of the cottage in the morning before the murder was discovered?

 

[otto]

Believe what you want to believe. If you believe she heard that and heard running right after that, then she didn't hear MK, because MK was being attacked and sexually assaulted. A scream and running right away means she got stabbed and then the people ran off.

Did you see a deaf woman in the video I linked and, if so, why wasn't that Ciolino guy talking a little louder?

 

[wasnt_me]

I agree that coercions happen and any coercion is one too many, but to imply that they are common I don't agree with. Percentage wise it is a rare occurrence. Same with LE lying and covering up for each other. It happens and it shouldn't happen but fortunately it is rare. For some reason, in this case coerced statements, and LE lying under oath are all seen as totally normal.

We can't know the true percentage because of situations just like AK's. If no one believes her or she's ruled against in court for something like that, then she's counted in the not coerced side. and we don't know the margin of error for incorrect rulings our judgments on false and coerced confessions. to say we know for a fact that its rare is to say that we know for certainty the true percentage of rape victims. We do not for just about the same reasons I state for the confessions. First, the person claiming it has to admit it. Then, people have to believe it. But if they say "she was asking for it" and "look at what she was wearing" etc, then they don't believe the rape.

In the same way, the defendant must asssert that the false confession or coercion or brutalty happened at the hands of trusted officials. Then they will have people who do not believe them because of things like "It took two hours..." or "She's guilty, so of course she'd say that."

Once we stop looking at things through our own special colored lenses and see them through an objective glass, we won't be able to properly classify, gather data and get accurate percentages of anything that is of a subjective matter. Seriously. You can debate the specifics if you want to, but hopefully you at least understand what I'm saying.