Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #11

[jjenny]

Well if they are totally innocent, they also must have had the world's worst luck-standing up there (with a mop) when postal police arrive and the dead body is inside. I still don't buy the mop story. Who waits until the next day to mop up a spill? And then goes to borrow a mop from another house? If they truly did not have a mop at RS why not use a towel or something else to mop it up?

 

[miley]

Thank you, miley
So if all this is true (not referring to you, miley, but the information), then they were able to test it enough to know it was semen, but couldn't test it enough to get the dna???? And if there were two stains that may have compromised each other, then how do they know the one they tested wasn't in fact, compromised by the other stain?? I'm the farthest thing from a scientist, but that all just sounds....hinky. :waitasec:

the whole thing is confusing... the way I understand it, Vinci was working for the defense (RS) and while inspecting the p.case discovered the semen stain. He didn't have the authority to do dna testing and then when the defense asked for testing, the judge denied it.

Barbie N. isn't the only one reporting it as a semen stain though, I found more references:

Candace dempsey
And not for the first time in this infamous case. Investigators have also refused to test the semen found on a pillow in the victim's room.
http://www.startherup.com/dempsey/index.asp?page=2

Nick Pisa
Defence lawyers had also wanted Sollecito's computers looked at again, the time of death double checked and a sperm stain on Meredith's pillow.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ll-confident-in-spite-of-evidence-review.html​

Even if the stain was compromised by the other (print) testing, I still think the courts should allow confirmatory testing - what could it possibly hurt...

ETA: actually it's a no-brainer in my opinion

 

[wasnt_me]

Too drugged to call, I can believe (particularly of AK, who may have never used the 112 emergency number). But too drugged to scream and wake the neighbors? How did they manage to walk?

If the scream heard stories are correct, I'd say it was AK's scream, not MK, because MK was already drowning in her own blood. My guess.

 

[wasnt_me]

So am I right in understanding that a broken-down car was outside the cottage from 10:30 to 11:15?

Because that means the break-in, scream, murder et al., had to be over before 10:30 (which is consistent with the phones being dumped by 10:15), or couldn't even begin until after 11:15. No wonder Mignini wants the TOD at 11:30! (But of course that TOD requires MK to "fiddle" with her phone and keep her jacket on inside (but not try her mother again) for more than 2 hours.)

I don't know how it works in Italy. But in the U.S., most tow-truck drivers have to keep a log, so their times estimates tend to be reliable.

I 100% agree with this. It's like the car breaking down adds a whole new layer that really does narrow the TOD. In the Mov. report, they try to find a way to work it all in. I guess with that TOD elongated. But yes, if RS and AK stayed to watch a cartoon that ended about 946pm, then given the time it takes to leave ones house to go anywhere (and pot heads aren't swift movers) I'd say they wouldn't even have left the house at 946pm directly. So if they DID go to the cottage after that, I see them arriving between 1015 amd 1030pm. By this time, I strongly suspect MK has been mortally wounded by someone else.

I'd also strongly suspect that if the guy whose car it was just stood by it until a truck came for him, he would have seen something. We have no mention of that yet, so maybe he didn't stick around OR he saw nothing going on in that time period. To me, it's reasonable that RG would have already been gone and dumped the phones by 1030pm.

 

[jjenny]

I 100% agree with this. It's like the car breaking down adds a whole new layer that really does narrow the TOD. In the Mov. report, they try to find a way to work it all in. I guess with that TOD elongated. But yes, if RS and AK stayed to watch a cartoon that ended about 946pm, then given the time it takes to leave ones house to go anywhere (and pot heads aren't swift movers) I'd say they wouldn't even have left the house at 946pm directly. So if they DID go to the cottage after that, I see them arriving between 1015 amd 1030pm. By this time, I strongly suspect MK has been mortally wounded by someone else.

How do we know they actually finished watching this cartoon and simply did not leave the computer on?

 

[miley]

How does one ascertain that it was digital versus penial? I'm confused.

According to Rudy, it was oral -

 

[wasnt_me]

Also, Arturo de Felice made an interesting statement which states that she "buckled". This was PLANNED

.” He explained:”Initially the American gave a version of events which we knew was not correct. “She buckled and made an admission of facts that we knew were correct and from that we were able to bring them in."

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...+in&cd=12&hl=en&ct=clnk&source=www.google.com

Well, that shows are stupid they are if they knew the PL story was correct before it was even told to them.

 

[wasnt_me]

According to Rudy, it was oral -

Now that's a Whole--nother--level.

 

[wasnt_me]

But I thought AK and RS were still having pizza at 10:30, no? I ask because that's what has been posted here countless times.

It's also been posted here countless times that she went back at 11:45pm and took two hours to crack. Now, it seems that we might be able to add an hour to that. Maybe the pizza was an hour earlier still.

I understand why you ask, because these times always seem so mixed up. reports mix up times, witnesses mix of the DATE. It's confusing.

 

[miley]

I don't know that one can unless seminal fluid is found as well. As far as I know, skin cells are skin cells.

I was merely speculating that if semen were found on the pillow, that might indicate the penetration was digital. But there could have been penile penetration that was withdrawn before ejaculation.

Good point.

I'm pretty sure Rudy's dna was found on her tampon - maybe fluid and cells?

 

[wasnt_me]

I really would have to look at that computer to be able to answer that with 100% surety in my mind as there is so much that is recorded with respect to various things. Even my IT guys would never answer that question unless they had examined it themselves. The fact that their experts are stating there was activity tells me much. What I dont know exactly is what activity they found

This is the computer that they broke? Somehow the defense was able to rebuild it, you're saying? And in doing so, they found that the investigators had accessed this file--the same file RS must have accessed at 9:26pm.

Am I correct?

Then, was it a misprint that he opened the file at 9:10pm or was he opening something different at 9:10pm? I think that 9:46 time came from that perugiashock.com website. I'll have to go over there and revisit.

 

[wasnt_me]

I'm pretty sure Rudy's dna was found on her tampon - maybe fluid and cells?

OMG please tell me that on top of all this MK did not have to die while on her period. Seriously? How humiliating to be sexually assaulted AND have it done while on your period.

 

[jjenny]

Now that's a Whole--nother--level.

I don't think Rudy's stories are exactly believable. If they were, I presume he wouldn't be sitting in prison right now.

 

[wasnt_me]

I didn't say that I believed it. I just said it was a whole nother level.

 

[miley]

If they just innocently happen upon a murder, again, why not call police?
If any of you happen upon a murder, would not the first thing you do is to call police? I sure as **** know what I would do, and it would not be taking a shower at the place someone was just murdered in, with visible blood around.

I agree with what you're saying here - I'm just curious, do you still lean towards A&R's guilt or were you always on the fence, I can't remember.

 

[jjenny]

I agree with what you're saying here - I'm just curious, do you still lean towards A&R's guilt or were you always on the fence, I can't remember.

My theory is that they were involved in something, but not just in stumbling upon the murder. Not exactly as prosecution claims, because that story does not make much sense to me either. But basically nothing really makes much sense to me in this case.

 

[wasnt_me]

I am confused about PL firing AK.

While looking for the witness testimony I'd mentioned earlier, I found this testimony by PL. It'w written in 3rd person, the "he" being PL:

For four weeks he had quietly tolerated her wild mood swings, crass sexual innuendo and complete unwillingness to do any work so terminating her employment was, on the face of it, a wise decision.
It was also, tragically, one that Patrick believes came close to costing him his family, his business and his freedom.

For just a week later, he believes, 20-year-old Amanda took her revenge by framing the 38-year-old Perugian club owner for the murder of her British friend, Meredith Kercher, whose half-naked body was discovered in a pool of blood by police on November 2.

So was the texting between AK and PL that night an actual firing? He fired her via text messaging? Just trying to be clear. She was headed into work, but he texted and said don't bother--ever. Am I correct?

Weirdly enough, he additionally skips texting AK on Nov 1st in his testimony.

"She smiled sweetly and said she couldn't wait, and she'd bring all her friends back to my club for me." That was the last he heard of either girl, until 6pm on Saturday November 3, when a couple of friends walked into his club.

"They asked me if I'd heard that Amanda's English friend had been murdered. And when they said she was the dark-skinned girl, my heart stopped." He called Amanda, who quietly confirmed that Meredith was dead.

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=80

I don't know if this recount of his testimony is true, but I find it odd. Cell records indicate that he did contact AK, yes?

In AK's testimony, she sites that AFTER the murder, she encountered PL in the plaza. she told PL that she didn't feel like going to work.

AK: So, I was on my way to Raffaele's house, and I crossed Piazza Grimana and
he was standing outside of the Universita per Stranieri. He joined me, and
asked me "How are you, what's going on, where have you been?" and all that.
"Do you want to talk to journalists?" I said no, I wasn't doing well, I
couldn't really talk to them, the police told me not to talk to them.
Then he asked me about the police, for example. I told him they were
interrogating me and I couldn't talk. Then I asked him, I told him I didn't
feel like going out at night, I didn't feel like going to work. He said that
was okay. That's all. Then I went to Raffaele's house. http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=165

So I'm really confused on whether or not she was fired.

 

[miley]

Indeed, he does. And since all of the fantastic theories of this case require enormous leaps of faith, I rather think Hendry's simple account is the most probable.

I do too - at the same time though, I can't get passed the 19 samples of genetic evidence found in Meredith's room that were never identified.

 

[wasnt_me]

Wow, I got caught up reading AK's testimony, and I don't mean an inch of disrespect, but that court sounded like a big circus. From the way the trial is conducted, it sounds more like an inquistion than a criminal trial.

I could not understand why the lawyer kept asking questions that I consider "asked and answered." There was even more crazy stuff. If you haven't read it, read for yourself here: http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=165

 

[miley]

wasnt me,

PL did text amanda that night and told her she didn't have to come in to work, after sending a reply back, amanda said she turned her phone off... a) she didn't want PL to call her back in to work and b) she wanted to conserve her battery for the following day trip.

Patrick says he didn't say those things in the article and the newspaper made a public or personal (or whatever) apology - he doesn't like Amanda (at all)... Frank S. interviewed him:
http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/2008/03/when-truth-comes-out.html