Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #12

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  • #321
Well that one got me out of my lurking. The accused has the right to lie and say false things, but the fact that he is lying cannot be used as proof against him? WTF?

Yes, on the stand defendents are allowed to lie. It is not used as proof against them but it is probably taken into consideration at some point.
Their system is more of the lawyers presenting the evidence, and the judges/jurors 'weighing' the value of that evidence. It is not an adversarial system like in the US.
 
  • #322
The defense was not 'denied' anything... and you most likely know that.
we all know the prosecutors withheld information and the defense is still waiting. (for something)
Retesting of the evidence was supposed to conclude by May 9 so the results could be presented on May 21 to a jury of two judges and six citizens. However, the report has been pushed back until June, a representative of the Knox family told CNN Thursday, while forensic experts are still waiting for more information from Italian police, the representative said.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/05/06/amanda.knox.profile/?hpt=tv

The case IMO does not completely revolve around the knife or bra-clasp evidence anyway... as there is other proof of their guilt.
the knife/ bra-clasp were key for the prosecution - without it they have no case, in my opinion...

out of curiosity, what do you think about the bra clasp being stored in water?
 
  • #323
we all know the prosecutors withheld information and the defense is still waiting. (for something)
Retesting of the evidence was supposed to conclude by May 9 so the results could be presented on May 21 to a jury of two judges and six citizens. However, the report has been pushed back until June, a representative of the Knox family told CNN Thursday, while forensic experts are still waiting for more information from Italian police, the representative said.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/05/06/amanda.knox.profile/?hpt=tv

the knife/ bra-clasp were key for the prosecution - without it they have no case, in my opinion...

out of curiosity, what do you think about the bra clasp being stored in water?

'a representative of the Knox family told CNN' :floorlaugh:

I have not seen a valid link or report saying the bra clasp was 'stored in water'. What was wrong with the first testing?
 
  • #324
So it was Mignini's fault that AK admitted being at the crime scene and accused Patrick EVEN THOUGH the police dept was the one doing the interrogation? How did he 'abuse' his power in THIS case?

It is true that Perugia LE first coerced a false statement from AK implicating PL. Mignini was then called and helped to produce a second statement also implicating PL. At that point, Mignini shared responsibility.

When, within a couple of weeks, forensic testing and alibi evidence showed that PL was not involved, Mignini should have stepped back and reevaluated the entire case. Instead he simply substituted Rudy Guede for Patrick Lumumba.

That his HIS fault, nobody else's. The continued assertion of a "sex game gone wrong" or "satanic ritual" when there is absolutely no evidence of either is also Mignini's fault. There have been further hints that he used his office to strong-arm witnesses such as the homeless heroin addict.

In fact, the CNN program handled Mignini with kid gloves and allowed him to deny in full the few areas in which they challenged him.

Sorry that particular program didn't fit your theory of the case, but then that really isn't CNN's job.

*Very interesting that he will submit himself to these interviews with people that obviously don't agree with his point of view. Wonder why this is not reciprocated by the 'other' side???

That can be explained by arrogance.

That entire 'show' was just a propaganda piece, and anyone with even background knowledge of the case SHOULD be able to see thru it. If the position of someone is that it is/was a valid, honest, and balanced reporting of the case... then it is very telling on their personal reasoning/view of the case....

Oh, nonsense. If they had wanted to do so, they could have made Mignini and ILE in general look much worse. AK and RS have already been convicted; it's only a "story" now if there is some suggestion those convictions were in error. So that was the focus of the hour. But every suggestion of a problem in the prosecution's case was followed by a denial from Mignini or someone else.
 
  • #325
Oh yeah, I see 'nonsense':

'Perugia LE first coerced a false statement' So did she get RE-COERCED???

'used his office to strong-arm witnesses such as the homeless heroin addict'
I suppose you have proof of this?

'CNN handled Mignini with kid-gloves' That's rich... at least he had the nads to take on the nonsense and the PR campaign.

Also noted nonsense:
'didn't fit your theory of the case' :floorlaugh: Nothing you think about this case fits my theory, because it is like explaining something to a deaf man.
 
  • #326
'a representative of the Knox family told CNN' :floorlaugh:

I have not seen a valid link or report saying the bra clasp was 'stored in water'. What was wrong with the first testing?

Not quite so much to laugh about in the experts eyes

"In March leaked details of their initial findings appeared to give fresh hope to Knox - jailed for the murder of student Meredith Kercher in Italy - after the new experts said the evidence was "insufficient to convict her".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...xperts-another-40-days-to-complete-tests.html
 
  • #327
What part(s) do you consider 'stretching'?

What part(s) 'affirmed' you belief in innocence?

Where shall I start

hhhhhhhhhhmmmmm this is tough it truly is so lets go with this part

The bench ruled that he and Michele Giuttari, a detective-turned-thriller writer, had used their powers to persecute people they regarded as their enemies: tapping their phones, interrogating them, putting them under investigation without any evidence against them and even getting them jailed, for personal reasons

the court said, were guilty of "almost unheard of" criminal activity, carrying out investigations "in no way related ... to their proper competence", launching criminal cases with no evidence, ordering phone taps with "quite different ends" from those cited when the taps were authorised, taps that were made "for reasons of retaliation ... against people towards whom they had reasons for hostility".

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...e-1992485.html


Even though all the Monster's victims were shot with the same gun, Mignini told a court that it wasn't the work of a single serial killer. Rather, Mignini described an elaborate conspiracy of 20 people, including government officials and law enforcement officers, who made up a secret society behind the Monster killings.

Mignini indicted the 20 people and charged them with the concealment of Narducci's murder, and laid out a hard-to-follow plot that included body doubles and featured Narducci's body being swapped - not once, but twice!

If all of this sounds hard to believe, it is. Tuesday, in a preliminary hearing, Perugia Judge Paolo Micheli threw out the case against the 20. The judge found there was no solid evidence to back up Mignini's claim that Narducci was murdered, let alone the victim of a satanic sect

Late Tuesday evening, when the 20 defendants were freed of all charges, they celebrated in front of the courthouse, opening bottles of champagne
a court in Florence said Mignini was guilty of abusing the considerable powers of his office

According to the Italian newsmagazine Panorama, investigators discovered that Mignini maintained computer lists entitled "Attacks to Remember" and "Orgy of Attacks." The lists contained names of journalists, government officials, and members of the Italian Parliament.

Mignini was convicted of launching investigations into his critics in the media, the police, and the government. The prosecutor illegally wiretapped phones and cell phones in his ambition to end the "orgy of attacks."

Because he violated the public trust, the Florence court banned Mignini from holding public office for the rest of his life. But, during his appeal, the prosecutor gets to remain in office. Mignini has not been called on to resign either

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_1...ag=mncol;lst;4

He was convicted of:

1.) Illegally investigating journalists who had criticized him with the "intent to harass or deter them from pursuing their legitimate profession". Specifically the court found that Mignini had targeted Italian journalists Vincenzo Tessandori, Gennaro De Stefano, and Roberto Fiasconaro, because they had criticized his investigations into the death of Narducci.

2.) Ordering an illegal investigation of the Florentine ex police chief Giuseppe De Donno.

3.) Ordering illegal investigations of two officials of the Viminale, the Ministry of the Interior in Rome, including an illegal investigation of the Roberto Sgalla, ex-director of the office of external affairs
 
  • #328
Well, since it attempted to show Mignini in a bad light. Maybe you should consider things Preston has said in the past:

'... as for Mignini himself, I think he's a sincere man and an honest and incorruptible judge. I don't think that he's a bad man...'

'I think in many ways he was badly misled by Giuttari, the police officer who was running the investigation (MOF).'

Which is it? Terrible and corruptible... or not :waitasec: .

Nice try. The prosecutor is in charge of the investigation.
 
  • #329
'a representative of the Knox family told CNN' :floorlaugh:

I have not seen a valid link or report saying the bra clasp was 'stored in water'. What was wrong with the first testing?

How many would you like? I can provide more if need be....:giggle:

" Why? Because it seems, the clasp has been stored, for years, in a jar of liquid. Not only has any DNA long since rotted away, the clasp itself has actually rusted. Any competent forensic investigator knows that DNA samples must be kept dry or they will decompose."

http://www.zimbio.com/Amanda+Knox/ar...es+Amanda+Knox

According to the leaked report, the clasp - which had been cut from the bra - had been poorly kept in a 'liquid jar' and not properly dried which meant it had 'rotted and rusted'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz1Lnm3y1HY

Jordan says she was "literally horrified" when she heard the bra clasp on which DNA was supposedly found had rusted. "How could it have rusted?" she asked. "You always have to dry DNA, very specific techniques, store it properly, chain of custody. It apparently was stored in a jar of liquid

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/...20047474.shtml
 
  • #330
Not quite so much to laugh about in the experts eyes

"In March leaked details of their initial findings appeared to give fresh hope to Knox - jailed for the murder of student Meredith Kercher in Italy - after the new experts said the evidence was "insufficient to convict her".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...xperts-another-40-days-to-complete-tests.html

So do you think the 'new experts' said (if they did at all) "the evidence was insufficient to convict her" regarding the ORIGINAL evidence... or what is left now?

I think the supposed 'leak' was taken out of context or the extra time they asked for was misinterpreted. It seems to be catching. :innocent:

*That wasn't what my post was referring to anyway, it was about the defense not receiving all the evidence from police and a Knox family representative speaking of it.
 
  • #331
Nice try. The prosecutor is in charge of the investigation.

I didn't 'try' anything... those are actual quotes by Preston.

But I do notice your 'efforts'... and they are not even 'nice'.
 
  • #332
How many would you like? I can provide more if need be....:giggle:

" Why? Because it seems, the clasp has been stored, for years, in a jar of liquid. Not only has any DNA long since rotted away, the clasp itself has actually rusted. Any competent forensic investigator knows that DNA samples must be kept dry or they will decompose."

http://www.zimbio.com/Amanda+Knox/ar...es+Amanda+Knox

According to the leaked report, the clasp - which had been cut from the bra - had been poorly kept in a 'liquid jar' and not properly dried which meant it had 'rotted and rusted'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz1Lnm3y1HY

Jordan says she was "literally horrified" when she heard the bra clasp on which DNA was supposedly found had rusted. "How could it have rusted?" she asked. "You always have to dry DNA, very specific techniques, store it properly, chain of custody. It apparently was stored in a jar of liquid

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/...20047474.shtml

1- 'it seems'
2- 'according to a leaked report'
3- 'apparently'

:waitasec: Talk about muddying the water. The first testing was either valid or not- that is all they have to decide upon.
 
  • #333
Oh yeah, I see 'nonsense':

'Perugia LE first coerced a false statement' So did she get RE-COERCED???

'used his office to strong-arm witnesses such as the homeless heroin addict'
I suppose you have proof of this?

Snipped for space

Today he repeated his claim that he had seen the lovers 'talking excitedly' in the square and said he thought it was Halloween night - which would be the night before the November 1, 2007 murder.

http://www.whatsonningbo.com/news-2...tness-antonio-curatolo-changes-his-story.html
 
  • #334
1- 'it seems'
2- 'according to a leaked report'
3- 'apparently'

:waitasec: Talk about muddying the water. The first testing was either valid or not- that is all they have to decide upon.

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:
 
  • #335
1- 'it seems'
2- 'according to a leaked report'
3- 'apparently'

:waitasec: Talk about muddying the water. The first testing was either valid or not- that is all they have to decide upon.

The first was NOT valid. If you don't follow accepted testing protocol or if the sample is too low the tests are INVALIDATED and should never of been presented to court

You simply must stop relying on the "Machine" for your information
 
  • #336
I didn't 'try' anything... those are actual quotes by Preston.

But I do notice your 'efforts'... and they are not even 'nice'.

Yes I know about Mignini and I am always nice :innocent: except when I am bad
 
  • #337
Not only do I follow many cases here, I have opinions on them as well. Some less popular than others though LOL.

Sounds like us straight jacket people .....slides your own personal one to you :giggle:

The private asylum is also in the caribbean :D
 
  • #338
I apologize if this has been asked and answered, but did MK have bruising to indicate that she was held down by multiple people? I imagine that in the struggle of being raped/attacked, there would be lots of bruising.

This is probably one of places where I have seen the most detail describing her wounds but if you google Dr. Lalli you will find parts attributed to him. I think since most of this was done per the Kerchers' request in a closed courtroom without public the exact description of various wounds are tough to come across. It is part of Hendry's evaluation but I believe this part has never fully been published HTH

"Most of the notable wounds were to Meredith Kercher’s head and neck regions. She suffered a hard blow to her nose and lips which resulted in significant swelling before she died. No obvious outer contact abrasion was observed to her nose and lips. Pathologist Lalli found bruising on the inside of her lips and gums. "

A shallow horizontal cut of about one inch in length was found to the left cheek about one inch in front of the left ear.

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/RonHendry7.html
 
  • #339
Really? It amazes me that some of you who know sooo much about the case would think that 'report' was accurate, well made, or fair and balanced.

It was a POV fluff piece IMO.

This case requires a mini series to do it justice. A one hour segment could not possibly cover everything with respect to this case.

A one hour segment with Mignini I would of enjoyed
 
  • #340
I think during the first medical examination, the dr. said that she apparently had sex sometime before death and there were no signs of rape. Prosecutors couldn't even prove rape during the trial... (maybe) that's why during closing arguments Mignini tried to fallback on the satanic ritual theory until Comodi? stepped in saying no motive was necessary, people kill just to kill (something like that)

Is there a possibility she had sex w/ her boyfriend before he left town and the dna is actually his? because I have no idea... I think most likely, rudy stabbed her first and then convinced himself it was consensual, what do you think?

I don't know. I assume RG had to incapacitate MK in some manner before raping her (particularly if he penetrated her with one hand while masturbating with the other). Since there is no evidence MK was ever tied and bound, I assume that means RG stabbed her first and then pleasured himself as she was dying or dead. Both possibilities strike me as equally disturbing.

All of which is why it is so outrageous to suggest that AK was somehow the "mastermind" in all this! There is NO evidence that she sexually assaulted MK, nor is there anything in her history that suggests she would be a party to such an attack.

Yet ILE, under Mignini's direction, implies that AK is somehow most responsible for what happened to MK?! I don't get it.
 
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