Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #13

[SMK]

If you've read the last few pages of this thread, you'll find most of us are surprised that the defense is bothering with the accusations against other suspects and concerned that such testimony will muddy the waters and hurt the defense.

But it may be the defense attorneys feel they have to bring up anything that might exonerate their clients. I don't know exactly what defense attorneys in Italy are taught in terms of their ethical obligations.

Right. I have seen on IIP forum as well, most people are either horrified or at least worried. Something very "off" about this whole thing, UNLESS it is merely to show, "There are so many conflicting "who-done-it" theories, we do not know WHO should be convicted at this point, so have reasonable doubt." Certainly, Hendry, with his excellent professional analysis about the "simple genius of Occam's razor - the plainest- theory -with -the- least- amount -of- participants- Lone Wolf scenario" must be horrified beyond belief.

 

[Malkmus]

Okeydokey.

Which part of 'I want to know what they have to say' should I decipher?

Sigh... you and I just had this conversation:

While I agree that bringing too many whacko inmates into the picture is potentially harmful, the fact that Hellman is allowing them to be heard tells us a lot about his opinion of the prosecution's case.

 

[OldSteve]

Right. I have seen on IIP forum as well, most people are either horrified or at least worried. Something very "off" about this whole thing, UNLESS it is merely to show, "There are so many conflicting "who-done-it" theories, we do not know WHO should be convicted at this point, so have reasonable doubt." Certainly, Hendry, with his excellent professional analysis about the "simple genius of Occam's razor - the plainest- theory -with -the- least- amount -of- participants- Lone Wolf scenario" must be horrified beyond belief.

I take it as sign that the defense thinks they are in an un-winnable position and are grasping for the proverbial straw - but I don't know why they feel like that?

Perhaps they just realized that Otto and dgfred are on the jury anic:

 

[dgfred]

Sigh... which is it then? You either agree with me or want to hear what they have to 'say'.

And I posted I didn't agree with your 'tells us a lot' theory anyway.

 

[dgfred]

I take it as sign that the defense thinks they are in an un-winnable position and are grasping for the proverbial straw - but I don't why they feel like that?

Perhaps they just realized that Otto and dgfred are on the jury anic:

Haha, or the ones they ACTUALLY DO HAVE on the jury are the concern.

 

[dgfred]

I take it as sign that the defense thinks they are in an un-winnable position and are grasping for the proverbial straw - but I don't why they feel like that?

Perhaps they just realized that Otto and dgfred are on the jury anic:

Hey, I'm the so-called Straw Man... stop that 'grasping'.

 

[SMK]

Haha, or the ones they ACTUALLY DO HAVE on the jury are the concern.

Either way, it is a strange tactic. I can only hope that they know what they are doing, and we can leave the driving to them. Amanda must be out of her mind with worry at this point. I do NOT view this as a positive.

 

[Nova]

Right. I have seen on IIP forum as well, most people are either horrified or at least worried. Something very "off" about this whole thing, UNLESS it is merely to show, "There are so many conflicting "who-done-it" theories, we do not know WHO should be convicted at this point, so have reasonable doubt." Certainly, Hendry, with his excellent professional analysis about the "simple genius of Occam's razor - the plainest- theory -with -the- least- amount -of- participants- Lone Wolf scenario" must be horrified beyond belief.

Who knows? If an Italian jury was allowed to hear testimony re "smooching" and "cartwheels" and actually considered it, maybe an Italian jury will actually find something worthwhile in wild tales that paint MK as a drug kingpin. (I know "kingpin" is my word; but I don't believe anyone spends $250K to hire a hit on a common street dealer.)

 

[Nova]

Either way, it is a strange tactic. I can only hope that they know what they are doing, and we can leave the driving to them. Amanda must be out of her mind with worry at this point. I do NOT view this as a positive.

If somebody says his brother killed MK and he buried her keys, etc., I think the defense has to at least petition to court to send someone to look.

 

[Malkmus]

Yes, your intentions are interesting to me, and your 'actual points' not so much... because I don't hold your point of view.

Enough with the 'straw man' JREF stuff already. You can always ignore my post. I try to refrain from quoting you anyway, because you seem to have this 'reaction' every time I do.

I think I'm perfectly in the right for asking you to, please, refrain from posting what you think our intentions are. I'm politely asking you to stop, Fred. Then we can all get along and continue discussing the ongoing news and facts, not guessing what "excuses" we're going to come up with next, or anticipating with glee our reaction to the convictions being upheld.

 

[Nova]

Hey, I'm the so-called Straw Man... stop that 'grasping'.

Have you actually looked up what a Straw Man Argument is?

It's something any of us could slip into, but something we would all be best to avoid as such arguments quickly derail conversations.

 

[Malkmus]

Sigh... which is it then? You either agree with me or want to hear what they have to 'say'.

And I posted I didn't agree with your 'tells us a lot' theory anyway.

Fred, I want to hear what the inmates who shared a cell with Rudy have to say. I think it's foolish to bring in the guy who claims Meredith was murdered over a drug debt. I don't expect Hellman to accept his testimony anyway.

 

[SMK]

If somebody says his brother killed MK and he buried her keys, etc., I think the defense has to at least petition to court to send someone to look.

Right---if this idiot kid says he has the keys and knife and is lying, he should have his head handed to him. Either they are there, or he lied, or Mignini took them already

 

[dgfred]

I think I'm perfectly in the right for asking you to, please, refrain from posting what you think our intentions are. I'm politely asking you to stop, Fred. Then we can all get along and continue discussing the ongoing news and facts, not guessing what "excuses" we're going to come up with next, or anticipating with glee our reaction to the convictions being upheld.

See, at first this looks completely reasonable... but in the end (as usual) you throw in a barb about 'guessing' and 'glee'. I'm perfectly in the right for asking you to just ignore me if my post are your problem.

 

[Nova]

I think I'm perfectly in the right for asking you to, please, refrain from posting what you think our intentions are. I'm politely asking you to stop, Fred. Then we can all get along and continue discussing the ongoing news and facts, not guessing what "excuses" we're going to come up with next, or anticipating with glee our reaction to the convictions being upheld.

BBM: Without intruding on your disagreement with dgfred (neither of you needing my help), I think the bolded sentence above bears repeating and applies to all of us. There will be no occasion for glee in this case.

If Amanda and Rafi are exonerated, Meredith will still be dead and Rudy will have thrown away a major part of his life.

If the convictions of Amanda and Rafi are upheld, then we will end up with two innocent people wrongly imprisoned OR two guilty young people who threw away their lives for a moment's impulse.

Nothing to celebrate in any event.

 

[Malkmus]

See, at first this looks completely reasonable... but in the end (as usual) you throw in a barb about 'guessing' and 'glee'. I'm perfectly in the right for asking you to just ignore me if my post are your problem.

Fine, Fred. I agree.
But I don't put people on ignore, fyi.

 

[dgfred]

Fred, I want to hear what the inmates who shared a cell with Rudy have to say. I think it's foolish to bring in the guy who claims Meredith was murdered over a drug debt. I don't expect Hellman to accept his testimony anyway.

Malk, Do you really believe:

1- RG would tell anyone that AK and RS were innocent while being held for murder that they were suspected of? Why would he not say the same now?

2- A child-killer would have ANYTHING worthwhile to present in court?

3- Why if true what he claims... has nobody picked up the keys/knife?

 

[Nova]

Right---if this idiot kid says he has the keys and knife and is lying, he should have his head handed to him. Either they are there, or he lied, or Mignini took them already

Wow! That would take Mignini to a degree of corruption I haven't even considered as yet.

 

[dgfred]

Fine, Fred. I agree.
But I don't put people on ignore, fyi.

Well quit picking on me... I might get a complex or something.

 

[SMK]

Malk, Do you really believe:

1- RG would tell anyone that AK and RS were innocent while being held for murder that they were suspected of? Why would he not say the same now?

2- A child-killer would have ANYTHING worthwhile to present in court?

3- Why if true what he claims... has nobody picked up the keys/knife?

I agree. It is all very suspicious.
1. RG MAY have said in an "off" moment that they were not there, but if true, he obviously is no friend of theirs, or he would do what Luciano Aviello did: write letters to all proclaiming the truth. Guede has nothing to offer. He will deny, deny, deny.
2. A child-killer is not going to carry much weight, no.
3. Right. Unless something horrific has happened, such as Mignini going and getting them and hiding them away ( I would hope he would not do anything of the kind) this is probably a wild goose chase. This Luciano has been talking since 2007. Where are these items? Were they ever there? Were they taken? Something tells me they will not be found, for whatever reason.

Either the defense attorneys are now "crazy like foxes" or just plain crazy.