Mexico Mexico - David Hartley, 30, Lake Falcon, 30 Sept 2010 #2

[WellDone]

BBM

I agree & it doesn't just happen over here in Mexican/US border towns & even the multiple LE personnel getting involved when someone is pulled over.....

I picked up a vehicle my husband bought & drove it back to our state.,.... in the middle of the night I crossed state lines.... & was pulled over... LE told me is was because I didn't have a license plate (had the temps & pink slip) & they were checking in case it was a stolen vehicle &/or drugs.... they looked at my documentation, asked me my story & let me on my way.... no biggie... just a precaution on LE's part....IMO

I don't necessarily believe it's true that the only people who'd bother keeping an eye on two innocent tourists on jets skis would be the US LE. We may not have the whole story. It's a well known fact that Mexican drug gangs use American citizens to smuggle firearms into Mexico all the time. They pay willing Americans top dollar. From what I understand - firearms are not legally for sale in Mexico. I'm not saying I believe that David and Tiffany were engaged in this type of activity, I'm just giving you an example of why an otherwise innocent looking tourist may be watched by the Zetas.

I don't in any way believe that Tiffany is responsible for David's death. I believe Tiffany is telling the truth when she says pirates shot at her and her husband. But, I'm also not sure we have the whole story. I do believe however - whatever reason David was out on that lake that day, he certainly didn't deserve to be murdered. It's tragic what happened and I feel for Tiffany and for David's family.

 

[MsBrisbee]

They would have been watched from U.S. side. Would'nt be to hard to shadow someone on the lake from a boat with binocs after it was radioed in. I've spent alot of time in the valley, lived in McAllen and Laredo, have been to Zapatas many times to launch our boat and go fishing on Falcon lake. It's a good fishing lake and the only lake in the area, lots of people, including my husband and myself do not put their watercraft in the gulf because the salt water eats up everything it touches, especially engine parts, you've got to spend hours afterwards cleaning everything with fresh water. Falcon lake is very isolated, the towns around it are very small including Zapatas, you can go miles and miles and never see another person on the lake, or on the shores. The only border crossing in the area is on the dam itself, the crossing is the road on top of the dam, with the check point about halfway over, its a very long dam. Its also miles away from Zapata. You do not have to have a visa or have to check in with anyone in order to cross your boat onto the Mexican side, but if your fishing, as someone mentioned earlier, you better have a Mexican fishing liscense, same with driving over, you have to have Mexican auto insurance. At any rate no one is ever stopped or checked going into Mexico, it's only when leaving that your checked because many things have a customs tax your required to pay, so bags and vehicles are searched and ofcourse the drug sniffing dogs are there. I believe this woman, and I also believe she got very very lucky.

 

[MsBrisbee]

BBM

I agree & it doesn't just happen over here in Mexican/US border towns & even the multiple LE personnel getting involved when someone is pulled over.....

I picked up a vehicle my husband bought & drove it back to our state.,.... in the middle of the night I crossed state lines.... & was pulled over... LE told me is was because I didn't have a license plate (had the temps & pink slip) & they were checking in case it was a stolen vehicle &/or drugs.... they looked at my documentation, asked me my story & let me on my way.... no biggie... just a precaution on LE's part....IMO

Multiple LE is no big deal, happens all the time down there, that they had Mexican plates I'm sure caused initial confusion and may have been the cause. I was pulled over once, after having been followed by one, then two troopers for about 15 minutes. They were looking for a reason to stop me, and after those 15 minutes they had one, lol, made me so nervous I crossed the white line on the right ever so slightly with my tires. When they told me this I had to laugh, and said if it weren't so windy and they hadn't made me so nervous it wouldn't have happened. At any rate the real reason I was stopped is because I was driving a van, they thought they might be snagging some illegals, they only found hubby and our dogs. Border patrol pulled up as we were leaving. You see it happen all the time.

 

[WellDone]

BBM

I totally agree!!!

I hate when they follow you like that... waiting for you to do something... it's like stalking...lol I'd rather they just pull me over, ask whatever they want & be done with it & let me go about my business!!! The other day a cop followed me from the gym in the little town nearest us to the lake where we live...lol I thought.. what? you want my exercise matt??? LOL He never did pull me over, but escorted me all the way home in broad daylight... weird.

Multiple LE is no big deal, happens all the time down there, that they had Mexican plates I'm sure caused initial confusion and may have been the cause. I was pulled over once, after having been followed by one, then two troopers for about 15 minutes. They were looking for a reason to stop me, and after those 15 minutes they had one, lol, made me so nervous I crossed the white line on the right ever so slightly with my tires. When they told me this I had to laugh, and said if it weren't so windy and they hadn't made me so nervous it wouldn't have happened. At any rate the real reason I was stopped is because I was driving a van, they thought they might be snagging some illegals, they only found hubby and our dogs. Border patrol pulled up as we were leaving. You see it happen all the time.

 

[laytonian]

BBM

I totally agree!!!

I hate when they follow you like that... waiting for you to do something... it's like stalking...lol I'd rather they just pull me over, ask whatever they want & be done with it & let me go about my business!!! The other day a cop followed me from the gym in the little town nearest us to the lake where we live...lol I thought.. what? you want my exercise matt??? LOL He never did pull me over, but escorted me all the way home in broad daylight... weird.

It took me awhile to find out that the local sheriff lived up the street; until I knew that, I couldn't figure out why I got the gracious escort

 

[Linda7NJ]

what???????????? OMG.... Is this for all over???? Will they still fly from Texas into Mexico???? OMG... I am to leave in a matter of days!!! What???

Where the heck have I been???? This came out September 10, 2010 also....... http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_4755.html

Here is the link alwaysonmymind spoke of....

http://www.kens5.com/home/Cancel-your-Mexico-plans-authorities-release-travel-warning-104961924.html

All I know, my butt is going to be in Cancun for Thanksgiving!

Last year, there was a travel advisory when I went due to the swine flu, I went anyway! The place was EMPTY, it was wonderful!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[WellDone]

BBM
LMAO.... Too funny!!!!!

]It took me awhile to find out that the local sheriff lived up the street; until I knew that, I couldn't figure out why I got the gracious escort [/[/B]QUOTE]

 

[WellDone]

BBM

Really? So it's ok to go??? Are you going inclusive? We're going to Cozumel & hubby seems to think we'll be fine too.... um, he said he's been following this case since I freaked on him about Mexico & travel advisories.... he said he DID plan to fish Falcon this year, but changed his mind....Surprized me! He's a diehard fisherman! He said all the anglers cancelled! :waitasec:

All I know, my butt is going to be in Cancun for Thanksgiving!

Last year, there was a travel advisory when I went due to the swine flu, I went anyway! The place was EMPTY, it was wonderful!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Tuffy]

All I know, my butt is going to be in Cancun for Thanksgiving!

Last year, there was a travel advisory when I went due to the swine flu, I went anyway! The place was EMPTY, it was wonderful!!!!!!!!!!!!

Be careful, Linda! Have fun :Banane30: But be safe!

 

[Linda7NJ]

BBM

Really? So it's ok to go??? Are you going inclusive? We're going to Cozumel & hubby seems to think we'll be fine too.... um, he said he's been following this case since I freaked on him about Mexico & travel advisories.... he said he DID plan to fish Falcon this year, but changed his mind....Surprized me! He's a diehard fisherman! He said all the anglers cancelled! :waitasec:

All I know, my butt is going to be in Cancun for Thanksgiving!

Last year, there was a travel advisory when I went due to the swine flu, I went anyway! The place was EMPTY, it was wonderful!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mexico is a HUGE country. When the warning was issued for the swine flu, it was in MEXICO CITY! You know how faraway from Cancun that is? FAR! I live in New Jersey, which borders on New York City..swine flu was in NYC ( way closer to me in NJ than Mexico City is to Cancun) You didn't see any travel warning not to go to New York City did you? NO!

Yes, I am going all inclusive, but I will be out and about site seeing, shopping, and day trips to Cozumel and Isla Maharis. When I took my son last year all the archeology sites were closed.

You'll be fine! Have a great time! Do you Scuba Dive or snorkel? If you don't, you better learn before ya get there!

 

[WellDone]

BBM

Really? So it's ok to go??? Are you going inclusive? We're going to Cozumel & hubby seems to think we'll be fine too.... um, he said he's been following this case since I freaked on him about Mexico & travel advisories.... he said he DID plan to fish Falcon this year, but changed his mind....Surprized me! He's a diehard fisherman! He said all the anglers cancelled! :waitasec:

Mexico is a HUGE country. When the warning was issued for the swine flu, it was in MEXICO CITY! You know how faraway from Cancun that is? FAR! I live in New Jersey, which borders on New York City..swine flu was in NYC ( way closer to me in NJ than Mexico City is to Cancun) You didn't see any travel warning not to go to New York City did you? NO!

Yes, I am going all inclusive, but I will be out and about site seeing, shopping, and day trips to Cozumel and Isla Maharis. When I took my son last year all the archeology sites were closed.

You'll be fine! Have a great time! Do you Scuba Dive or snorkel? If you don't, you better learn before ya get there!

BBM

Thank you so much, I feel better now...

I've snorkeled, never scuba dived... we're looking forward to both.... EXCEPT... now I'm on antibiotics & ear drops for an inner ear infection & so I'm wondering if that's such a good idea now.... we'll see I guess.

I thought will all this going on then getting sick... oh great, our trip will have to be cancelled... I guess not!

We've never been.... what do you recommend???

I almost picked Cancun when this all came about, but I thought since it's our very first vacation without kids &/or about fishing we'd opt for the quieter Cozumel.... I probably should of opted for Cancun...LOL We're suppose to go to Curacao to renew our vows for our 25th anniversary in Feb.... I'm really excited for that trip.... do you know anything about that island???

 

[mountaintime]

Thank you, Well Done!

I live in Mexico over half the time, and have for years...

As W.D. said, it is a huge country, and MOST of it is fine...
the people are kind, friendly and hospitable...I love it.

I live on the coast of the state of Oaxaca, in a great town with beautiful beaches.
The city of Oaxaca ( the capital, in the center of the state) is one of the friendliest and most interesting in the whole country...

Cancun is certainly great for package tours, as is Isla Mujeres...for my self, I prefer a more real Mexico.
But that is not a judgement call! I speak Spanish, and am comfortable pretty much everywhere. I understand the appeal of having it all there for you...

My heart is very sad for the areas that are in such difficulty...I have many times driven from the US to where we are ( very southern Mexico), but I will not drive through the North now.
I think it is going to get worse on the border for awhile...but I do think that eventually it will be over..
Remember how bad Colombia was..? It is a different country now...very beautiful, in fact.
Please remember Mexico and the Mexicans in your prayers...they are as distressed and horrified by the cartels as we are - MORE.

 

[CocoChanel]

I have a defense background, and have been wracking my brain to remember what STRATFOR is. Took awhile. They're a politically-active, quasi-investigative "shadow" intelligence company that has published some poorly-researched documents and books.

Does anyone else remember founder Friedman's book The Coming War With Japan (1991), which predicted that we'd be in full war with Japan within 20 years?

Maybe it's just me, but relying on a politically-active group come up with a finding that supports their political actions, is circular logic.

Thank you laytonian. I have wondered what agenda this group has, as they seemed to insert themselves in this story. They have no doubt gotten thousands of additional hits on their website as result. What a brilliant PR move for them.

 

[WellDone]

BBM

Actually it was Linda7NJ that was telling me about Mexico - my 1st time going there will be in 13 days! WooHoo!

Thank you for all your descriptions as well!

How is Cozumel? Do you have any recommedations???

I do feel for the people of Mexico ~ I imagine this time is horrible for them also & hope it will get better soon! I can't imagine what it must be like for them...

Thank you, Well Done!

I live in Mexico over half the time, and have for years...

As W.D. said, it is a huge country, and MOST of it is fine...
the people are kind, friendly and hospitable...I love it.

I live on the coast of the state of Oaxaca, in a great town with beautiful beaches.
The city of Oaxaca ( the capital, in the center of the state) is one of the friendliest and most interesting in the whole country...

Cancun is certainly great for package tours, as is Isla Mujeres...for my self, I prefer a more real Mexico.
But that is not a judgement call! I speak Spanish, and am comfortable pretty much everywhere. I understand the appeal of having it all there for you...

My heart is very sad for the areas that are in such difficulty...I have many times driven from the US to where we are ( very southern Mexico), but I will not drive through the North now.
I think it is going to get worse on the border for awhile...but I do think that eventually it will be over..
Remember how bad Colombia was..? It is a different country now...very beautiful, in fact.
Please remember Mexico and the Mexicans in your prayers...they are as distressed and horrified by the cartels as we are - MORE.

 

[Tuffy]

Tests on the life vest were supposed to have been completed 3 days ago, now. No results have been released yet.

 

[Gypsy Road]

Tests on the life vest were supposed to have been completed 3 days ago, now. No results have been released yet.

Hmmm...you're right. I wonder if the test results have come back and they just haven't been released - or if they are still waiting for them to come back?

From earlier article dated 10/12/10 -

"Test Results on Blood Found Due Back Today"

"....Tiffany’s life jacket was sent to state crime lab technicians when blood was found on it after the attack.

Police want to know if the blood is that of Tiffany or her husband."

http://www.krgv.com/news/local/stor...nd-Due-Back-Today/mqshqI9mikuOkQJ2mdrOVw.cspx

 

[Gypsy Road]

Wife of missing American meets with Mexican feds

"Tiffany Hartley -- who says her husband, David, was shot September 30 on a lake that straddles the U.S.-Mexican border -- is "fully cooperating in assisting Mexican prosecutors with their investigation," said Brian Quigley, spokesman for the U.S. Consulate in Matamoros, Mexico.
The interview Friday with officials from the federal attorney general's office and the prosecutors in the state of Tamaulipas was held in the FBI field office in McAllen, Texas. It took place the day after Mexican authorities suspended the search for David Hartley."

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/16/texas.missing.american/

 

[mountaintime]

BBM

Actually it was Linda7NJ that was telling me about Mexico - my 1st time going there will be in 13 days! WooHoo!

Thank you for all your descriptions as well!

How is Cozumel? Do you have any recommedations???

I do feel for the people of Mexico ~ I imagine this time is horrible for them also & hope it will get better soon! I can't imagine what it must be like for them...

Well, THANKS Linda7NJ!

And Well Done, you are going to have such a good time!

Cozumel is beautiful.....it will be wonderful right now, as the fall is the most perfect time in Mexico. Few people, and perfect weather ( but check right before you go to see if there are any hurricanes forming!)

I really don't have any recommendations, because I have spent little time there...I know other parts of Mexico better.
But I DO know it is lovely and delightful!
Have a great time....!

 

[hollyblue]

Wife of missing American meets with Mexican feds

"Tiffany Hartley -- who says her husband, David, was shot September 30 on a lake that straddles the U.S.-Mexican border -- is "fully cooperating in assisting Mexican prosecutors with their investigation," said Brian Quigley, spokesman for the U.S. Consulate in Matamoros, Mexico.
The interview Friday with officials from the federal attorney general's office and the prosecutors in the state of Tamaulipas was held in the FBI field office in McAllen, Texas. It took place the day after Mexican authorities suspended the search for David Hartley."

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/16/texas.missing.american/

Jumping off your post Gyspy:

Federal and state authorities in Mexico held an eight-hour, "in-depth" interview with the wife of an American reportedly shot dead by gunmen investigators believe are linked to a Mexican drug gang, a U.S. spokesman confirmed Saturday

Getting more interesting....and I'm curious about the vest also. I have no doubt it's David's blood, but just what the location and the amount may tell. Eight hour "questioning" is not an easy task to endure, I'd think.

As far as justice for David,... which I think would be the only justice that could take place given the particulars.... the cartel said they would take care of their own.....they haven't...and they have their own way of getting that info...swiftly...so what does that tell us? If this brought undo attraction and hinders the cartel, I don't think they would let who ever screwed up get away with it...that's $$$ lost in more than one way to them.

Whatever the FBI and officials glean from the investigation, I truly doubt his body is still available for finding at this point.

JMO

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Wife of missing American meets with Mexican feds

"Tiffany Hartley -- who says her husband, David, was shot September 30 on a lake that straddles the U.S.-Mexican border -- is "fully cooperating in assisting Mexican prosecutors with their investigation," said Brian Quigley, spokesman for the U.S. Consulate in Matamoros, Mexico.
The interview Friday with officials from the federal attorney general's office and the prosecutors in the state of Tamaulipas was held in the FBI field office in McAllen, Texas. It took place the day after Mexican authorities suspended the search for David Hartley."

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/16/texas.missing.american/

Eight hours of questions. Wow.