Mexico Mexico - Jenny Chen, 26, Oaxaca, 11 April 2016 #2

[pukasonqo2]

So did Jenny not change her last name in the 3 years they were married?


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i didn't change my surname when i got married


Lupus est homini, non , quom qualis sit non novit

 

[rosesfromangels]

If I take a trip, can just anyone find my passport usage? How does that work?

Well...there is an official and unofficial answer to that. The official answer is that certain countries have "info sharing" agreements in place such as US and Mexico, US and Canada. In addition, there is the "advanced passenger information system or APIS, where airline passenger data is transmitted to the destination country.

I would speculate there are other systems that are not as transparent.

 

[GigTu]

Thanks, roses. I obviously have no clue where Jenny is, but I have to say that I wouldn't be surprised if she surfaced in China at some point. I have nothing to go by but my distrust in both Mexican and Chinese transparency efforts.

 

[Lilibet]

Two articles have been posted to the HFJ page showing what can happen to family members looking for their missing loved ones. The poster warns JR not to be alone. That didn't help either victim. The main article highlights LE indifference to helping when someone goes missing.

http://www.latimes.com/world/mexico-americas/la-fg-mexico-mother-20140520-story.html

http://www.telesurtv.net/english/ne...Missing-Daughter-in-Mexico-20160623-0027.html

https://www.facebook.com/groups/helpfindjenny/permalink/654390504735997/

 

[Tssiemer]

So not being mean but those could have just been random. Lots of people get murdered in Mexico. Doesn't have to be "because they were getting close to finding answers." Idk. It's tragic. But when we went to Mexico we were told not the leave the resort without an escort. And we only left once, to go swim with dolphins across the street lol. But the resort still escorted us by driving us and stayed with us until we were done.


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[Lilibet]

So not being mean but those could have just been random. Lots of people get murdered in Mexico. Doesn't have to be "because they were getting close to finding answers." Idk. It's tragic. But when we went to Mexico we were told not the leave the resort without an escort. And we only left once, to go swim with dolphins across the street lol. But the resort still escorted us by driving us and stayed with us until we were done.


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I do agree that the murder of the father in the second article while driving might have been random. While it's true that there are many murders in Mexico, it appears that this mother, at least, was lured to her death. Numerous gunshot wounds to her head indicates an execution, not a random murder. JMO

Hernandez was apparently lured to her death. After yet another fruitless meeting with state prosecutors, she received a call from an unknown person offering information on her son. She was directed to the Benito Juarez neighborhood of Culiacan. She went with a friend and was ambushed just off Constitution Street.
"Run! Run!" the friend cried, according to witnesses. The friend escaped, but it was too late for Hernandez, who died instantly of numerous gunshots to the head. Police reportedly recovered 15 spent 9-millimeter casings.

I do think it's too bad that JR does not understand how ineffective LE is in these cases. He still seems to be trying to push them to take Jenny's case seriously.

The official indifference, even callousness, in the face of such loss has been a recurring theme in Mexico. Only a handful of state governments have even bothered to take DNA evidence, and families have been forced to travel from morgue to morgue, mass grave to mass grave, in search of their loved ones.

If anything, JR has made himself more of a target. In an answer to a question on the FB page he said that his team can't interview the drivers because it will only hold up in court if LE does it. His goal needs to be to find Jenny, not make a court case stick. Hernandez made it clear that she just wanted her son back and wasn't trying to find out who did it...she was still murdered.

As Hernandez put it in a February interview with the Sinaloa newspaper Riodoce: "I am not looking for the guilty ones, for the details, I just want my son.... Please just tell me where he is."

http://www.latimes.com/world/mexico-americas/la-fg-mexico-mother-20140520-story.html

 

[Tssiemer]

Soooo who are they saying lured her? The people that killed her son or LE in Mexico??????


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[slowpoke]

Thanks for being on top of the HFJ site's updates, Lilibet. Seems the posts have already been removed from the HFJ site. If it wasn't for you, we would not have known about it and those links. Those two news stories have got to give JR pause. I wonder if his PI is fearful for his team's safety in investigating what happened to Jenny. A dangerous line of work to be in, in a place like Mexico.

From that LA Times article:

The official indifference, even callousness, in the face of such loss has been a recurring theme in Mexico. Only a handful of state governments have even bothered to take DNA evidence, and families have been forced to travel from morgue to morgue, mass grave to mass grave, in search of their loved ones.

http://www.latimes.com/world/mexico-americas/la-fg-mexico-mother-20140520-story.html

I wonder if JR's investigations include keeping in touch with the morgues of southern Mexico. Jenny's Asian appearance would hopefully make her stand out easier, should her body have ended up at one, unidentified.

 

[Tssiemer]

Why does he keep removing stuff??


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[saengseon]

Two articles have been posted to the HFJ page showing what can happen to family members looking for their missing loved ones. The poster warns JR not to be alone. That didn't help either victim. The main article highlights LE indifference to helping when someone goes missing.

http://www.latimes.com/world/mexico-americas/la-fg-mexico-mother-20140520-story.html


http://www.telesurtv.net/english/ne...Missing-Daughter-in-Mexico-20160623-0027.html

https://www.facebook.com/groups/helpfindjenny/permalink/654390504735997/

JR said on the Help Find Jenny site that he's going back to Mexico for the 5th time to "push" the police to stay on target/focus. I got the impression that you don't push the police, esp. in Mexico, lest you embarrass them, piss them off?

There was a story yesterday on the Daily Mail (yes, I know, but you get a lot of news and pics there you don't get anywhere else) and there was a beauty contest host who was murdered down the west coast of Mexico. Some hosts are threatened with their lives to let the ****'s girlfriend win. Not sure of this case, but he was targeted: his friends were released, his body and cash and other belongings were found with his body.

There was another story on DM a few days ago talking about all of the murders in Acapulco. Not like they don't happen in America, but...

A coworker visited sister who lives there north of Acapulco, popular retirement/resort town. She showed me pics of house and gators and whatnot. There was one pic of a truckload of Mexican police/troops in a back of a pickup with M16s and looking a big scared.

You couldn't pay me to go to Mexico. Human lives are cheaper than those of a chicken. This is what a Chinese-born person told me about China, too. People can off you if they don't like you and the police are gangsters, well, Chinese "Communist" party is a bunch of gangsters. And if you are robbed in China, you are murdered, because of the strict policy of execution for robbery. Not sure of Mexico, but Mexico reeks of lack of any rule of law, but a rule of who is in power or multiple powers, like the drug cartels are another government now in Mexico. There is dual governments running.

Day by day, I live America more and more, warts and all.

The fact that Jenny has dropped off the face of the earth, and gone for 4 months, hope JR/family gets closure on what happened to her.

 

[saengseon]

I do agree that the murder of the father in the second article while driving might have been random. While it's true that there are many murders in Mexico, it appears that this mother, at least, was lured to her death. Numerous gunshot wounds to her head indicates an execution, not a random murder. JMO

Hernandez was apparently lured to her death. After yet another fruitless meeting with state prosecutors, she received a call from an unknown person offering information on her son. She was directed to the Benito Juarez neighborhood of Culiacan. She went with a friend and was ambushed just off Constitution Street.
"Run! Run!" the friend cried, according to witnesses. The friend escaped, but it was too late for Hernandez, who died instantly of numerous gunshots to the head. Police reportedly recovered 15 spent 9-millimeter casings.

I do think it's too bad that JR does not understand how ineffective LE is in these cases. He still seems to be trying to push them to take Jenny's case seriously.

The official indifference, even callousness, in the face of such loss has been a recurring theme in Mexico. Only a handful of state governments have even bothered to take DNA evidence, and families have been forced to travel from morgue to morgue, mass grave to mass grave, in search of their loved ones.

If anything, JR has made himself more of a target. In an answer to a question on the FB page he said that his team can't interview the drivers because it will only hold up in court if LE does it. His goal needs to be to find Jenny, not make a court case stick. Hernandez made it clear that she just wanted her son back and wasn't trying to find out who did it...she was still murdered.

As Hernandez put it in a February interview with the Sinaloa newspaper Riodoce: "I am not looking for the guilty ones, for the details, I just want my son.... Please just tell me where he is."

http://www.latimes.com/world/mexico-americas/la-fg-mexico-mother-20140520-story.html

Nice post. It's all about quieting people (by killing them) and creating fear at the same time. With the internet, people can speak up and they want people to shut up. That's my feeling on the matter.

 

[saengseon]

Thanks, roses. I obviously have no clue where Jenny is, but I have to say that I wouldn't be surprised if she surfaced in China at some point. I have nothing to go by but my distrust in both Mexican and Chinese transparency efforts.

With chips and tracking in passports, it's not easy to walk into a country without detection.

 

[saengseon]

Chinese women rarely do

It depends. They don't change their names in China (like Korea, but unlike Japan - countries I'm familiar with, culturally), by custom, but coming to America, they may very well change their names. Also, people use all kinds of names on FB. Additionally, her husband may have decided to use Chen just to get her name out and use what she's commonly used.

At the end of the day, I suppose it doesn't really matter what one person uses as a last name, regardless of country or person or legal or social usage. Individuals, regardless of culture or nationality, will choose based on what they feel works for them, when emigrating.

Also, some who emigrate keep their old name because it's less of a hassle. Esp. flying - you can run into all kinds of problems at the airport, in any country, because your passport does not reflect your new last name. She's Jenny Chen (at least the Chen is Chinese) and then she has a greencard that has her husbands name, then a holdup at the ticket counter then TSA or some other foreign nation, then she has to bring her marriage certificate and hope they will be able to read it and also accept it. Additional hassles.

Women should prefer to keep their last names out of ease. But if the kids have father's name, the women may not like it and they may run into trouble traveling with kids and their last name is different from kids.

In Japan there is a movement for women to change the laws to keep their last names. In Korea, there's been a movement among Koreans to be able for women to take their husbands names. No matter where, no matter the system, someone's unhappy!

 

[saengseon]

So did Jenny not change her last name in the 3 years they were married?


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Again, I hope we are not confusing her legal name (changed or not) with the name she uses in public.

Where is it shown she changed her name legally? You don't. Women just adopt, right? Where it seems fit? If for utility bills, bank account, drivers license...there is not a legal name change associated with a marriage. You change your name where you feel like it.

My wife will keep her maiden name on her non-US passport. Why change it? Her US passport, one day, will have my name.

Her first name is not even Jenny, legally, so why do we call her by that? Because it's maybe easy and familiar and something she'd adopted. Depends on the woman and the situation. And she may have very well had Jenny Chen as her FB profile before she got married.

It doesn't really matter. I have a friend who doesn't publicly refer to his legal last name. Why? He wants his "ethnicity" shown. His call. He didnt' legally change his name, but that's what everyone knows him as.

 

[saengseon]

JR is going back to Mexico for the fifth time to push the police to stay on point regarding Jenny.

A commenter asks if anyone has explained why they can't interview someone whose identify is known. JR says he doesn't know but he's hoping for answers soon. He's warned to be careful since drugs from Columbia are transported through Mexico to the US, sometimes on "buses."



https://www.facebook.com/groups/helpfindjenny/permalink/653690964805951/

Great post. He really better not act like he does up here by "pushing the police" and "demanding" this or that. Knowing Mexico, Corona probably has its hit men, or like China, your life is "worth less than a chicken". Mexico is not a county that has a rule of law. Law seems to take a backseat (mind you, I'm no expert, but it just seems to suck down there and you have the dual government structure of voted/official government and the cartel's government (see NY Times))

If he attracts too much attention, that seems to be taboo down there based on murders of people speaking up.

I wonder if his lawyers are afraid to be around him. Anyway, he's not really good at communicating, so he will spend a week down there then throw out a one word blurb about his trip.

I feel his life is in danger the more he digs at this. And his lawyers are going to take his money are for their own sake, may not want to stick their necks out and tell them they tried.

 

[saengseon]

JR could totally spoil the case by finding the suspected driver. Also, if I was the driver in question, and wanted to be interviewed by a foreigner or anyone for that matter, in regards to a missing person, based on hearsay, and not have the police involved, that would be crazy to talk to anyone. Jesus, they must have their own version of the 5th amendment. Then you have people not trained in questioning now questioning you? That could get scary real quick with leading questions and what not.

And if JR "has his man", what the heck can he do? How do police handle this seemingly rogue, vigilante behavior?

I doubt he will get anywhere on this. He's wasting his time, but he has to go for himself and feel he did all he could do.

Hopefully, he comes back and is not "quieted". From all appearances, lives do not matter in Mexico with some people. What of the missing group of 47 high school students? Gone! Poof!

99% of people in Mexico who go missing are never found. According to a story I read recently.

 

[saengseon]

I always hate to accuse anyone of lying. However, it just seems unlikely to me that someone tied to social media and calling her mother every day like Jenny suddenly went voluntarily silent while still hitchhiking.* It's certainly not beyond the realm of possibility IMO that there was lying by both the police and the Chinese government, as JR indicated. Reassuring Jenny's parents may have served the interests of both the police and the Chinese for propaganda, business, diplomatic or other purposes. And what parent wouldn't grasp at that reassurance? Or maybe they didn't. We only have the story by the Chinese. The Mexican police didn't confirm or deny it.

*Rosesfromangels has suggested the remote possibility that Jenny's possible mental health issues could be responsible for her silence. But other than a break with reality causing her to stop communicating, I don't see her voluntarily going silent. According to her own words on Weibo, she was about to hitchhike to Cancun, so I don't see her suddenly deciding to hide from JR. I think she's either dead or trafficked. JMO

This is may be a way for authorities or police to divert attention from themselves so they don't have to investigate. For instance, in a similar way" Someone's murdered? Oh, suicide, because we found him dead alone. Case closed. Next!

 

[saengseon]

If I have the choice to believe JR or to believe the Mexican Police and the Chinese Embassy. I choose to believe the Mexican Police and the Chinese Embassy. Because I don’t believe one damn word that JR says. He has lied way too many times already.

What possible reason would the Mexican Police and the Chinese Embassy have to conspire to convince her family that she is alive and well, if she is not? It doesn’t make any sense. Even if the Mexican police are corrupt, the Chinese Embassy’s job is to represent their citizens, in this case Jenny and her family. They would have no reason to side with the Mexican police and try to convince their citizens that that daughter is fine.

I’m pretty sure Jenny's parents didn’t travel half way around the world just to hear the Mexican police tell them, their daughter is fine and then they said, 'Oh OK', and went back to China. The police must have given them some pretty credible information to convince them.

This case seems pretty typical of many missing persons threads, where the person is found safe. Big thread, lots of debate, is the person dead, are they alive, where are they? Then the news that the police have located the person, they are fine, and they are not going to release any more information due to privacy reasons. End of story. I don’t see why this case is any different.

99% of people who go missing in Mexico are never found. Those are some damning statistics. Jenny has been gone 4 month. Doesn't leave much room for speculation. Odds are in favor, unfortunately, that we will never know, but likely she was murdered after being assaulted and/or robbed. Then animals picked at her remains and nothing is left of her. I don't think it is wise to leave witnesses alive there. Loose lips sink ships and Mexico is brutally violent.

 

[Lilibet]

Soooo who are they saying lured her? The people that killed her son or LE in Mexico??????


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Hmmmmm...the way things work in Mexico it could be one and the same or both. :dunno:

 

[Lilibet]

Thanks for being on top of the HFJ site's updates, Lilibet. Seems the posts have already been removed from the HFJ site. If it wasn't for you, we would not have known about it and those links. Those two news stories have got to give JR pause. I wonder if his PI is fearful for his team's safety in investigating what happened to Jenny. A dangerous line of work to be in, in a place like Mexico.

From that LA Times article:

http://www.latimes.com/world/mexico-americas/la-fg-mexico-mother-20140520-story.html

I wonder if JR's investigations include keeping in touch with the morgues of southern Mexico. Jenny's Asian appearance would hopefully make her stand out easier, should her body have ended up at one, unidentified.

I guess my timing was good today. I expect JR doesn't want anything negative on his site, so I wasn't toooo surprised to see those posts were gone. Maybe his PI advised him to remove them. I wonder what has happened with the PI's he said he hired from outside Mexico. I can't imagine why they'd want to mess with this.

That's a good point about checking the morgues. I hope they've been alerted about Jenny's case.