MI MI - Danielle Stislicki, 28, Southfield, 2 Dec 2016 #9

[Gardenista]

Please reread the past two pages.

OK, I just did. You said it records "run time, speed, distance" and I don't see that. Can you please copy and paste what I am missing?

 

[recovering]

recovering:

I think I am misunderstanding you or missing something.

I appreciated hearing that most newer cars are equipped with EDRs. I didn't know this. I remain confused about what meaningful data could be obtained from the EDR in DSs Jeep if it wasn't in an accident or some other unusual circumstance. The manual states:

NOTE: EDR data are recorded by your vehicle only if a
non-trivial crash situation occurs; no data are recorded by
the EDR under normal driving conditions and no per-
sonal data (e.g., name, gender, age, and crash location)
are recorded.

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1144814/Jeep-Renegade-2015.html?page=278

Which last 2 pages are you referring to ? Starting at 668 or 278 ?

I'm referring to the last two pages of this thread. Not the manual.

So, a computer saves data in a few ways. But basically, it boils down to 1's and 0's being recorded magnetically. These 1's and 0's make up a language that the computer can understand. If those 1's and 0's aren't overwritten, they exist indefinitely as read only memory. This means, that even though the EDR was designed to record data specific to events relating to a short time period before and after a crash, that they exist until overwritten. They don't just disappear because the vehicle shuts off.

Now, the EDR is only one of the computers on board a modern day vehicle. There are computers constantly saving, storing, submitting data back and fourth to one another. They run your fuel injection, your anti-lock brakes, your stability control, etc. There is data stored all over the vehicle.

A good computer forensic scientist, can take that data, and make something from it. It's not like you get a nice excel spreadsheet with all the information you want readily available. No, it's like a puzzle. You take what you have and piece it together and make a bigger picture.

That said, at a minimum, the EDR would answer what day the car pulled into Independence Greens Apartments. That data would be available provided the cops didn't just start the vehicle and drive it away. Considering it's a piece of evidence, I really hope they didn't do that as they could compromise the integrity of what the computers in her vehicle stored before it was last shut off.

 

[Hoosier952]

Even if the EDR saved the data without a crash, they would likely be skirting a really fine line legally if they tried to retrieve that data without an accident happening.

 

[recovering]

Even if the EDR saved the data without a crash, they would likely be skirting a really fine line legally if they tried to retrieve that data without an accident happening.

A 28 year old woman has been missing for over a month. The legal ramifications for a violation of her privacy have already been breached.

 

[Vresia]

I'm referring to the last two pages of this thread. Not the manual.

So, a computer saves data in a few ways. But basically, it boils down to 1's and 0's being recorded magnetically. These 1's and 0's make up a language that the computer can understand. If those 1's and 0's aren't overwritten, they exist indefinitely as read only memory. This means, that even though the EDR was designed to record data specific to events relating to a short time period before and after a crash, that they exist until overwritten. They don't just disappear because the vehicle shuts off.

Now, the EDR is only one of the computers on board a modern day vehicle. There are computers constantly saving, storing, submitting data back and fourth to one another. They run your fuel injection, your anti-lock brakes, your stability control, etc. There is data stored all over the vehicle.

A good computer forensic scientist, can take that data, and make something from it. It's not like you get a nice excel spreadsheet with all the information you want readily available. No, it's like a puzzle. You take what you have and piece it together and make a bigger picture.

That said, at a minimum, the EDR would answer what day the car pulled into Independence Greens Apartments. That data would be available provided the cops didn't just start the vehicle and drive it away. Considering it's a piece of evidence, I really hope they didn't do that as they could compromise the integrity of what the computers in her vehicle stored before it was last shut off.

Thank you for your explanation. It certainly has changed my view of information that could possibly be obtained from a vehicle. As it happens, this could be useful information to me in my work and I am very appreciative.

The place that I am still stuck is that, in my reading of the links and manual, it doesn't appear the EDR is actually triggered to record unless there is an accident or some other odd event. Am I reading this wrong ? I would love it if this type of info was available.

 

[Zebra Lady]

I'm referring to the last two pages of this thread. Not the manual.

So, a computer saves data in a few ways. But basically, it boils down to 1's and 0's being recorded magnetically. These 1's and 0's make up a language that the computer can understand. If those 1's and 0's aren't overwritten, they exist indefinitely as read only memory. This means, that even though the EDR was designed to record data specific to events relating to a short time period before and after a crash, that they exist until overwritten. They don't just disappear because the vehicle shuts off.

Now, the EDR is only one of the computers on board a modern day vehicle. There are computers constantly saving, storing, submitting data back and fourth to one another. They run your fuel injection, your anti-lock brakes, your stability control, etc. There is data stored all over the vehicle.

A good computer forensic scientist, can take that data, and make something from it. It's not like you get a nice excel spreadsheet with all the information you want readily available. No, it's like a puzzle. You take what you have and piece it together and make a bigger picture.

That said, at a minimum, the EDR would answer what day the car pulled into Independence Greens Apartments. That data would be available provided the cops didn't just start the vehicle and drive it away. Considering it's a piece of evidence, I really hope they didn't do that as they could compromise the integrity of what the computers in her vehicle stored before it was last shut off.

Absoultely fascinating ! Thank-you for sharing this information.

Now , I wonder what info the other two vehicles LE took may reveal.

 

[recovering]

Thank you for your explanation. It certainly has changed my view of information that could possibly be obtained from a vehicle. As it happens, this could be useful information to me in my work and I am very appreciative.

The place that I am still stuck is that, in my reading of the links and manual, it doesn't appear the EDR is actually triggered to record unless there is an accident or some other odd event. Am I reading this wrong ? I would love it if this type of info was available.

The EDR is constantly recording. That's all you need to know. It can't say "Oh, we crashed, where's the data from 30 seconds from before we crashed?" and then just magically obtain it. It has that data because it's constantly being recorded somewhere.

 

[kammiemc]

http://www.npr.org/sections/alltech...new-car-has-a-black-box-wheres-the-off-switch

The car has a black box in it. That is a newer car. If you looked at it's EDR (it's black box) it'd tell you exactly what that car did once it left the parking lot.

I do not trust the Foxnews anonymous source.

Also, the rampant speculation towards the SG is ludicrous. He hadn't worked there since October. He wasn't in the building with her that day. I said in the previous thread #8 that it's more likely he's all the police had to go off of when trying to find a possible suspect. They look at things like "disgruntled former employee who was familiar with missing person" as a way of developing leads based on profiles that fit that kind of description.

Do you have inside info that he was not in or around the building that day? Or that she did not encounter this man that evening? I think it is fair to assume, given that they were able to get a search warrant, that there was something to connect the SG and the victim (whether it be eyewitness testimony, technology and/or evidence) when she went missing. I don't think that is ridiculous speculation at all. To the contrary it seems reasonable.


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[newwe]

The EDR is constantly recording. That's all you need to know. It can't say "Oh, we crashed, where's the data from 30 seconds from before we crashed?" and then just magically obtain it. It has that data because it's constantly being recorded somewhere.

Yes, it doesn't seem like it would only start recording the moment the crash happened. How would they know how fast you were going when you crashed? If it only recorded the moment you crashed, it would record that speed (probably a slower speed if you hit something). There's more ways we're being tracked all of the time, fit bits, watches, phones, cars, ect.


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[NoHeartAnthony]

You can track acceleration vs damage to the vehicle and probably get a good picture of the velocity before crashing.

#firstsemesterphysics

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[recovering]

Do you have inside info that he was not in or around the building that day? Or that she did not encounter this man that evening? I think it is fair to assume, given that they were able to get a search warrant, that there was something to connect the SG and the victim (whether it be eyewitness testimony, technology and/or evidence) when she went missing. I don't think that is ridiculous speculation at all. To the contrary it seems reasonable.


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I said earlier, if he was a real POI, he'd be in hand cuffs. I imagine that he did know Dani at some point when he worked there, but news reports say he hadn't worked there since October.

From my point of view, when a person goes missing, cops look for profiles of who would fit. He fit a profile and it's why his house was searched. The evidence they took from his house doesn't seem to have created any new leads and I doubt that police are still looking at him as a suspect seeing as he isn't in custody.

 

[Hoosier952]

A 28 year old woman has been missing for over a month. The legal ramifications for a violation of her privacy have already been breached.

It's not so much her privacy, it's what would happen if the data found lead them to a suspect and if anything found because of that discovery would hold up in court. There are laws in place to protect the rights of everyone. Unfortunately those rights are also allowed to criminals. No right minded defense attorney would let that evidence fly, IMO.

 

[recovering]

It's not so much her privacy, it's what would happen if the data found lead them to a suspect and if anything found because of that discovery would hold up in court. There are laws in place to protect the rights of everyone. Unfortunately those rights are also allowed to criminals. No right minded defense attorney would let that evidence fly, IMO.

See, I understand wanting to do things right to make sure the suspect is prosecuted correctly, but at this point, if we are to assume Dani is still alive, it's a second priority.

Bringing her back is number one and I'm really tired of this statement being used as a reason to be 'patient' because if it was me who was kidnapped, I would only care that people were trying to rescue me. Not build a case against my captors.

 

[Vresia]

The EDR is constantly recording. That's all you need to know. It can't say "Oh, we crashed, where's the data from 30 seconds from before we crashed?" and then just magically obtain it. It has that data because it's constantly being recorded somewhere.

I get it now. Thank you. At the very least, it is possible that LE could identify when DSs Jeep was parked.

 

[crhedBngr]

Thank you for your explanation. It certainly has changed my view of information that could possibly be obtained from a vehicle. As it happens, this could be useful information to me in my work and I am very appreciative.

The place that I am still stuck is that, in my reading of the links and manual, it doesn't appear the EDR is actually triggered to record unless there is an accident or some other odd event. Am I reading this wrong ? I would love it if this type of info was available.

Did a bit of research on this, and I found this document:

https://www.nhtsa.gov/DOT/NHTSA/Rulemaking/Rules/Associated Files/EDR_QAs_11Aug2006.pdf

I've included Paragraph 2 of the above-referenced document:

What is the difference between an EDR and a “black box”? “EDR” is the term NHTSA has coined to refer to the device commonly installed on motor vehicles to record vehicle technical data for a brief period of time in the event of an accident. In contrast, airplanes, trains, and ships use sophisticated recording devices, known as black boxes,that record data continuously throughout the operation of the vehicle, capture much more data than EDRs, and, in some cases, can record sound.

BBM

I've found a second article that I am enclosing as well for a reference guide: http://www.crashforensics.com/automobiledatarecorders.cfm

The "crashforensics" article has the following regarding ECM's/EDR's:

These ECMs, when equipped with an Event Data Recorder (EDR) function, are often referred to as a "Black Box." Although, these ECMs are not a "Black Box", in the true sense of the term, this descriptor helps simplify the explanation of this device. These ECMs with an EDR function historically have not provided large amounts of data recorded over long periods of time and often only provide crash acceleration data. However, some do store pre-crash data including Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) data for a period of five to twenty seconds before an impact.

BBM

Obviously, I could be completely wrong on this, but it doesn't make sense to me for automobile manufacturers to put a highly-functional EDR in vehicles, such as the ones found in aircraft--the cost would be too high.

I apologize if this question has been raised before (I've perused most of the postings in these threads), but did Dani's car have GPS? If so, I would think those records would be the first things LE would want to view.

 

[Zebra Lady]

Yes, it doesn't seem like it would only start recording the moment the crash happened. How would they know how fast you were going when you crashed? If it only recorded the moment you crashed, it would record that speed (probably a slower speed if you hit something). There's more ways we're being tracked all of the time, fit bits, watches, phones, cars, ect.


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Oh my gosh !! I think you may be on to something else. There is a picture of Danielle that was recently shared with her wearing a black Fitbit . If she was wearing that on the day she went missing maybe it will have information too ?

 

[kammiemc]

I said earlier, if he was a real POI, he'd be in hand cuffs. I imagine that he did know Dani at some point when he worked there, but news reports say he hadn't worked there since October.

From my point of view, when a person goes missing, cops look for profiles of who would fit. He fit a profile and it's why his house was searched. The evidence they took from his house doesn't seem to have created any new leads and I doubt that police are still looking at him as a suspect seeing as he isn't in custody.

I don't think that's how it works. I don't think "fits a profile" equals sure search warrant. Even if that is possible it absolutely does not mean that is the case here. And the idea that every POI who ends up being guilty is arrested immediately or even soon after a search is very different from reality. I would have assumed that before I started following cases here a couple of years ago. But POI's can go months/years without being arrested. Especially when there is no body. So, again, that an arrest has not been made absolutely does not mean that the POI is no longer a POI nor that he will not be arrested in the future. I don't know everything in life and I don't like to make wild assumptions. But I definitely know this.


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[recovering]

I don't think that's how it works. I don't think "fits a profile" equals sure search warrant. Even if that is possible it absolutely does not mean that is the case here. And the idea that every POI who ends up being guilty is arrested immediately or even soon after a search is very different from reality. I would have assumed that before I started following cases here a couple of years ago. But POI's can go months/years without being arrested. Especially when there is no body. So, again, that an arrest has not been made absolutely does not mean that the POI is no longer a POI nor that he will not be arrested in the future. I don't know everything in life and I don't like to make wild assumptions. But I definitely know this.


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I was just expressing doubt that the Security Guard was ever anything than some old fashioned police work where there were little actual leads to go off of. Also, if the SG had a record, even with just minors/misdemeanors, it makes it that much easier to sign off a warrant to search his home.

I'm simply being skeptical of his involvement. To many things don't add up for me to think the case would be solved that easily. I have noticed he invoking his 5A rights and lawyered up. But to me, that says nothing other than he's smart and knows his rights. If it were me, I wouldn't talk to the police either.

As for crhedBngr, cars now record 15 data points continuously according to the various articles posted previously in this thread ( http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/.../26/keep-your-car-black-box-private/20609035/ ). The document you linked is from 2006. I believe the latest regulations were for cars made after 2014. I think Dani's car makes that cut.

 

[Lmustang89]

https://www.facebook.com/permalink....1086372851&id=135124389844199&hc_location=ufi

City of Farmington Hills information of Danielle.

UPDATE
Missing Person Danielle Stislicki
December 7, 2016
The Farmington Hills Police Department continues to investigate the disappearance of a missing Farmington Hills resident. The missing person is Danielle Stislicki, a 28-year-old white female, brown wavy medium length hair, 5’5”, 123 lbs. Danielle was last seen wearing blue jeans, black zip-up shirt, sky blue 3 in 1 Eddie Bauer coat, and burgundy boots. She was last seen on Friday, December 2, 2016 at approximately 5:00 p.m. leaving the Met Life Office Building on Telegraph north of 10 Mile Road in the City of Southfield. Her vehicle was discovered in front of her apartment building on Lincoln Court in the Independence Green Apartment Complex, in the area of Halsted and Grand River, at approximately 6:00 p.m. on Saturday, December 3, 2016. The vehicle is a 2015 Jeep Renegade with a Michigan License Plate of DGH 8957. Her disappearance is out of character and is a concern to the family and police.
The family is asking for help from the public and a friend of the family has established a GoFundMe account and is offering a reward for information leading to Danielle’s whereabouts.
The Farmington Hills Police Department is asking the assistance of the public for:
• Anyone who may have observed Danielle and/or her vehicle leaving the Met Life office building/parking lot on December 2, 2016.
• Anyone who may have observed Danielle and/or her vehicle arriving at her residence between 5:00 p.m. on December 2 and 6:00 p.m. on December 3, 2016.
• Anyone who may have observed Danielle any time between 5:00 p.m. on December 2 and 6:00 p.m. on December 3, 2016 when her car was located.
• Anyone who may have seen or found a Samsung Galaxy Core Prime cell phone in a rose-colored case and key chain with a charm and two keys.
Anyone with information on this case is asked to please call the Farmington Hills Police Department at 248 871-2610
Image may contain: car and outdoor
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Image may contain: phone and text
Image may contain: people standing

 

[kammiemc]

Oh my gosh !! I think you may be on to something else. There is a picture of Danielle that was recently shared with her wearing a black Fitbit . If she was wearing that on the day she went missing maybe it will have information too ?

I have a Fitbit. It only tracks me with gps if I hit "run." Otherwise it tracks steps (and X steps equal X distance). That said, it does tell you how many steps you make per hour of you have it programmed that way. And it can track heartbeat. (Some models do different things.) So I am sure they would look at results (what she would normally view on her app) to see if anything could be garnered if she were swearing that night. It's pretty incredible how much technology reveals our actions!


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