MI, Grand Blanc - Mass Shooting at Mormon Church, fire, 28 Sept 2025

[Barbb]

I read the entire building is a total loss. It's a big building. I hope insurance covers it. That's a big expense there. I'd hate to think the church members would have to figure out how to pony up that one. Bad enough loss of life and injuries.

 

[iamshadow21]

I read the entire building is a total loss. It's a big building. I hope insurance covers it. That's a big expense there. I'd hate to think the church members would have to figure out how to pony up that one. Bad enough loss of life and injuries.

As I said in an earlier post - that's what tithing's for. The cost won't be borne by the congregation that worshipped there, but by the LDS church as a whole. Active members contribute 10% of their income to the church. There's no cause to worry that the rebuild won't happen. Even if it was completely uninsured, the church could afford it.

MOO

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

As I said in an earlier post - that's what tithing's for. The cost won't be borne by the congregation that worshipped there, but by the LDS church as a whole. Active members contribute 10% of their income to the church. There's no cause to worry that the rebuild won't happen. Even if it was completely uninsured, the church could afford it.

MOO

Thank you for your many informative contributions to this discussion. DH and I were discussing this earlier, and I have a question. I know nothing about an LDS church and was wondering if there would be expensive artifacts that were lost in the fire?

 

[OneLove]

He rented a room in Utah in 2010. This was 15 years ago, so it is hard to imagine it would be such a monumental issue for him right now. I do hope we get some information of the health of his marriage, and any other recent situations in his life.

So, at the moment I am blanking out on his profession or work??? Hopefully some one will fill me in...

Yes; I'm looking for that info also. So little has been said about him other than his child who has significant medical needs.

 

[bcallred]

Thank you for your many informative contributions to this discussion. DH and I were discussing this earlier, and I have a question. I know nothing about an LDS church and was wondering if there would be expensive artifacts that were lost in the fire?

Buildings are utilitarian exclusively. The most valuable thing is a mass-printed painting on the wall or a knockoff organ. All 'artifacts' are kept in vaults the government is jealous of. (lookup 'granite mountain')
In all of this, do not mourn the loss of finances in the slightest. As stated, the church can very easily afford this financial loss, which I am quite confident is insured. This congregation will probably share a building with the Burton congregation for a year or so and will have a beautiful new building in this same spot without lifting a finger.

 

[iamshadow21]

Buildings are utilitarian exclusively. The most valuable thing is a mass-printed painting on the wall or a knockoff organ. All 'artifacts' are kept in vaults the government is jealous of. (lookup 'granite mountain')
In all of this, do not mourn the loss of finances in the slightest. As stated, the church can very easily afford this financial loss, which I am quite confident is insured. This congregation will probably share a building with the Burton congregation for a year or so and will have a beautiful new building in this same spot without lifting a finger.

Yeah, there is unlikely to be anything valuable. Every LDS church I ever visited had mass produced prints of art, cheap, utilitarian furniture and fixtures. No great works of unique art or relics like some other religions have in their churches. What will be lost is the space where forty four years of memories were made by the members who attended there. That matters, even if nothing of monetary or religious value was destroyed.

MOO

 

[iamshadow21]

Buildings are utilitarian exclusively. The most valuable thing is a mass-printed painting on the wall or a knockoff organ. All 'artifacts' are kept in vaults the government is jealous of. (lookup 'granite mountain')
In all of this, do not mourn the loss of finances in the slightest. As stated, the church can very easily afford this financial loss, which I am quite confident is insured. This congregation will probably share a building with the Burton congregation for a year or so and will have a beautiful new building in this same spot without lifting a finger.

Yeah, LDS churches go up fast. This one was timber frame and brick veneer, built in 1981. My childhood church was I think 1970s, cinder block painted white. Do you know what the current trend for construction is for new builds? Are they still using things like brick, or are they using newer methods like concrete slab prefab? If the latter, it could go up really quickly.

MOO

 

[IceIce9]

Yeah, LDS churches go up fast. This one was timber frame and brick veneer, built in 1981. My childhood church was I think 1970s, cinder block painted white. Do you know what the current trend for construction is for new builds? Are they still using things like brick, or are they using newer methods like concrete slab prefab? If the latter, it could go up really quickly.

MOO

Wouldn’t the building be required to have sprinkler systems?

 

[angelainwi]

He rented a room in Utah in 2010. This was 15 years ago, so it is hard to imagine it would be such a monumental issue for him right now. I do hope we get some information of the health of his marriage, and any other recent situations in his life.

So, at the moment I am blanking out on his profession or work??? Hopefully some one will fill me in...

I believe he worked at a farm.

 

[iamshadow21]

Victim named as 77 year old John Bond, a Navy veteran and grandfather.

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2025/09/29/john-bond-identified-as-fatal-victim-in-michigan-church-shooting/86428091007/

 

[OneLove]

I believe he worked at a farm.

No friends, neighbors, employers, or family members have spoken out yet? Any info on his prior burglary arrest record? That can make it hard to find suitable jobs.

 

[iamshadow21]

This article confirms that the attack took place right in the middle of sacrament meeting, when everyone would have been in the chapel together.

An eyewitness account from Michigan: Latter-day Saints under gunfire fought to save each other

Members of the Grand Blanc Ward of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints evacuated through the back of the building as the shooter entered the front

www.deseret.com

I was also spot on with the architecture - the truck hit directly behind the pulpit and choir stalls.

 

[layer]

Yeah, LDS churches go up fast. This one was timber frame and brick veneer, built in 1981. My childhood church was I think 1970s, cinder block painted white. Do you know what the current trend for construction is for new builds? Are they still using things like brick, or are they using newer methods like concrete slab prefab? If the latter, it could go up really quickly.

I worked on them in 2003-2005. They went from ground to complete in about 5-6 months. Frankly they were the most spec'd out jobs I ever did that weren't powerhouses or US Govt stuff. These were all wood with brick exteriors, real brick. And like someone said, very utilitarian, especially compared to the nearby temple.

 

[airportwoman]

Wouldn’t the building be required to have sprinkler systems?

There are all kinds of exemptions for places of worship. For example, the Episcopal church I used to attend did not require handicapped-accessible bathrooms by law, but a church member who does remodeling on the side (he's a schoolteacher) did update them one summer.

 

[iamshadow21]

I worked on them in 2003-2005. They went from ground to complete in about 5-6 months. Frankly they were the most spec'd out jobs I ever did that weren't powerhouses or US Govt stuff. These were all wood with brick exteriors, real brick. And like someone said, very utilitarian, especially compared to the nearby temple.

Yeah, temples are the complete opposite. Stained glass, decorative bits and bobs for days, and that's just the outsides. The insides, you've got deep pile carpeting, chandeliers, sometimes whole rooms are painted with murals. My temple experience is limited to the one area teens go from about the age of fourteen or fifteen, but I've seen photographs. Google 'inside LDS temple' and you'll see what I mean.

By comparison, the churches are absolutely Spartan. Well built, but absolutely practical from start to finish.

MOO

 

[airportwoman]

Yeah, temples are the complete opposite. Stained glass, decorative bits and bobs for days, and that's just the outsides. The insides, you've got deep pile carpeting, chandeliers, sometimes whole rooms are painted with murals. My temple experience is limited to the one area teens go from about the age of fourteen or fifteen, but I've seen photographs. Google 'inside LDS temple' and you'll see what I mean.

By comparison, the churches are absolutely Spartan. Well built, but absolutely practical from start to finish.

MOO

I remember when the Nauvoo Temple, in west-central Illinois, was dedicated in the early 00s. (I live in the region.) It was open for public tours until it was officially blessed, or whatever the church does, and they had to tear out the carpet and replace all the furniture, because it would have had non-Mormon dust on them, I guess. I never went on a tour, but it's quite a beautiful building in this small farming town.

 

[Arkay]

Father of Michigan church shooter breaks silence in sorrowful address

Thomas Sanford - the father of 40-year-old Thomas Jacob Sanford - issued the family's first words since his son rammed his pickup truck into the Grand Blanc Township church.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Yet again, a family of origin who seem to literally have NO IDEA how their son could commit a mass murder.

And of course, here we are talking about a son who is 40, not a teenager or in his 20s.

A man who apparently went to great lengths to help his very sickly baby, as any good parent would, yet shot other people’s children and set the building that housed them on fire.

Once again, there are frantic and bewildered parents who are stunned, and whose son is now dead. And a new widow and a fatherless child, one who REALLY needs a good dad, are left to cope with this fallout.

We can never understand how someone who seemed to be a good man can morph into a mass murderer, of people who most likely were anonymous to him and did him no harm.

JMO

 

[iamshadow21]

I remember when the Nauvoo Temple, in west-central Illinois, was dedicated in the early 00s. (I live in the region.) It was open for public tours until it was officially blessed, or whatever the church does, and they had to tear out the carpet and replace all the furniture, because it would have had non-Mormon dust on them, I guess. I never went on a tour, but it's quite a beautiful building in this small farming town.

Nothing nonMormon cooties about it, just good old fashioned DIRT! When you get hundreds of people, possibly thousands, traipsing through, it takes a toll on those white carpets and furnishings. The visiting of Nauvoo prior to dedication would have been intense, and the vast majority of visitors would have had some flavour of LDS heritage. (If you read up on Nauvoo temple history, you might get why it, specifically, and Kirtland are a big deal. Too far off topic to dig into here.)

When a temple is being used, everyone wears white shoes that aren't worn outside, so there's no tracking in of dirt under usual circumstances.

MOO

 

[Charlot123]

Father of Michigan church shooter breaks silence in sorrowful address

Thomas Sanford - the father of 40-year-old Thomas Jacob Sanford - issued the family's first words since his son rammed his pickup truck into the Grand Blanc Township church.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Yet again, a family of origin who seem to literally have NO IDEA how their son could commit a mass murder.

And of course, here we are talking about a son who is 40, not a teenager or in his 20s.

A man who apparently went to great lengths to help his very sickly baby, as any good parent would, yet shot other people’s children and set the building that housed them on fire.

Once again, there are frantic and bewildered parents who are stunned, and whose son is now dead. And a new widow and a fatherless child, one who REALLY needs a good dad, are left to cope with this fallout.

We can never understand how someone who seemed to be a good man can morph into a mass murderer, of people who most likely were anonymous to him and did him no harm.

JMO

Am I the only one who sees him as "mainstream for the area" before that crime? No bad blood in school, had friends, liked in the army, not asocial, a good neighbor. He lived in Utah, but in 2010, so whatever could have happened there was 15 years ago! He is likely an average voter, no more obsessed with politics than others. DUI and a burglary stand out, but it happens, and as long as there is no recidivism, people with good family support can fit back in. (We don't know the circumstances, of course). He has a sick child, this is what sets him apart, but he and wife managed. They bought a house. Nothing that we know today explains the horrible act.

What we know though is that there is a history of substance and alcohol use. Periodically reverting back to old habits is not uncommon. Could that have triggered a psychotic event?

Sanford is friendly to a total stranger who canvasses the neighborhood (so, not that paranoid or angry, it seems). In the conversation he is obsessively fixated on LDS, but not to a dangerous degree, the visitor thinks. Could taking too much of *whatever floats on the streets these days, and we don't always know what* turn some prejudice into a deadly sick obsession?

Well, your guess is as good as mine. I hope we’d be told what has caused such distorted thinking. His family is shocked, it seems.

 

[iamshadow21]

Am I the only one who sees him as "mainstream for the area" before that crime? No bad blood in school, had friends, liked in the army, not asocial, a good neighbor. He lived in Utah, but in 2010, so whatever could have happened there was 15 years ago! He is likely an average voter, no more obsessed with politics than others. DUI and a burglary stand out, but it happens, and as long as there is no recidivism, people with good family support can fit back in. (We don't know the circumstances, of course). He has a sick child, this is what sets him apart, but he and wife managed. They bought a house. Nothing that we know today explains the horrible act.

What we know though is that there is a history of substance and alcohol use. Periodically reverting back to old habits is not uncommon. Could that have triggered a psychotic event?

Sanford is friendly to a total stranger who canvasses the neighborhood (so, not that paranoid or angry, it seems). In the conversation he is obsessively fixated on LDS, but not to a dangerous degree, the visitor thinks. Could taking too much of *whatever floats on the streets these days, and we don't always know what* turn some prejudice into a deadly sick obsession?

Well, your guess is as good as mine. I hope we’d be told what has caused such distorted thinking. His family is shocked, it seems.

It really doesn't take much to tip someone into hate, and turn them into someone unrecognisable. All it takes is an idea, and validation. Yes, substance abuse and mental illness can exacerbate things, but sometimes, previously reasonable people find something, either online or through someone they know that tells them that the reason they have problems is THOSE PEOPLE. Who those people are varies with time, society, culture, religion, but it's a poison that some people are all too willing to drink, because they feel an imaginary wound and want to strike out at what they perceive as the cause.

For some reason, this killer hated LDS and saw them as a problem he personally needed to eliminate from the world. However he justified that to himself is never going to make sense because there was never any wound or injustice that warranted this. There was just one man's rage that he pointed at a blameless congregation of families gathering on a Sunday.

MOO