Michelle Young ~ Pregnant Mother NC Part 3

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  • #161
  • #162
bi all - catch up later ....
 
  • #163
scandi said:
I would love to hear that whole 911 tape to the end, when Meredith asks Cassidy what happened and she starts to answer and then - bump, the tape cuts off. Does anyone have a link to that?

Scandi

Hey Scandi

Here it is: http://www.wral.com/news/10252313/detail.html ... just scroll down the page a bit and the link is there.

ETA: Oops ... now you have it twice.
 
  • #164
Do we know what Michelle was wearing when she was found?

Are we assuming she was in bed clothes since she was
found in the bedroom or do we know for sure?

Since her friends left at 10:30 M, that would mean she
had time to change and get ready for bed.

If the husband had come back shortly after the friends left,
she would probably still be wearing the clothes from the
evening before.

Do we know??
 
  • #165
MysteryAddict said:
Do we know what Michelle was wearing when she was found?

Are we assuming she was in bed clothes since she was
found in the bedroom or do we know for sure?

Since her friends left at 10:30 M, that would mean she
had time to change and get ready for bed.

If the husband had come back shortly after the friends left,
she would probably still be wearing the clothes from the
evening before.

Do we know??
Hi Mystery. We have no clue what she was wearing. We assume she was in bed when this occurred because she was found in the bedroom, but we really have no clue. Not enough info being released.
 
  • #166
MrsMush99 said:
Hi Mystery. We have no clue what she was wearing. We assume she was in bed when this occurred because she was found in the bedroom, but we really have no clue. Not enough info being released.
http://www.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/ny-lislay1115,0,6433065.story?coll=ny-linews-headlines

"News reports have stated that Jason Young called his wife's sister, Meridith Fisher, on the morning of Nov. 3, asking that she drop by the house to pick up a fax he didn't want his wife to see. She entered the home and found her sister's lifeless body on her bed.
During the 911 call, Meridith Fisher frantically states that the house doesn't look as it usually does, and that Cassidy's tiny footprints, marked with her mother's blood, are all around the house."
 
  • #167
PolkSaladAnnie said:
Gosh, MrsM, everytime we think "ahhhh-hah!!! That's why such and such happened", that darned fax gets in the way of logic! It's got in the way of everything, actually.

You're right, tho. Think the dog going nuts alerted Meredith's senses - and if she walked in and Michelle was there, M/dith may have 'acted casual as though she popped in out of the blue' and - perhaps - would hve called JY to say "Michelle is hom, saw no fax...bla bla bla..."

Still nothing in the press....

Whatever/whomsoever is behind this, many of us will be watching the trial, thinking back to these 3 threads that contain every possible thought under the sun as to the mystery of it all, lol!

What a senseless, brutal, cruel crime, though.
I don't think that fax is in the way of anything. If there is a real fax, was it printed the morning of the 3rd or prior to the 3rd and why would it really matter? I think it is possible that there was something he wanted Meredith to pick up, we don't know for sure what it was about only a rumor. But so what it was printed out in truth on the 1st of November - wouldn't Jason know it was in a pile anyway ? What I'm saying is - the fax really doesn't matter unless of course there is no fax matching the description Jason gave to Meredith.

Bottom line for me - the fax was a ruse, whether it is real or not. I look at it this way if Jason did this:

He was wanting someone else to find the body while he was well away from the area. So he goes through his meeting - no terrible news received. He calls Michelle and gets her voicemail - notice he doesn't call where she works - he wants someone to call him. He's driving along towards the folks house and still no terrible news. Call the voicemail again because he knows that is all he is going to get. Since he did not kill the baby and no news yet he realizes that baby is there alone.

So he calls Meredith about the fax because he does want the baby cared for and he is in desperate need for someone to find that body while he can account for his whereabouts - he doesn't want to return Saturday and find the body of his wife and who knows how the baby would have been by Saturday when he was suppose to return. (Meredith even tells the 911 operator it is a "fluke" for her to go to the house during the day.) He really wants to be with his folks when the news comes in so they can verify his obvious immediate grief. If he killed her, his reaction in front of the parents may well have been from his own nervousness about the crime not being found while he is gone and in accordance with his plan.

There really could be a fax, but that doesn't mean he didn't kill his wife - even if he got on the web and requested the info that morning - the fax is meaningless with respect to whether he killed his wife or not.

It is only meaningful if it does not exist IMO. so I just don't see this as a big issue that proves anything if it exists. JMHO
 
  • #168
That was very interesting to hear, and thank you dear Otto.

Near the first part of the tape when Meridith gets Cassidy focused and she starts talking, the first word our of Cassidy's mouth I heard was Daddy . .and then a couple of words followed that. And towards the end of the tape befrore he tried to connect with the Sheriff, I heard Cassidy talking in the background, and again heard her say Daddy, and it was like she was trying to explain something both times I heard it.

Thank goodness Cassidy is a little motormouth! LOL I think she probably told them exactly what she saw, and it almost seemed like she was trying to explain the action or maybe Michelle and the killer struggling with each other. Boy, it wouldn't take much to enhance that tape and hear most of what little Cassidy said. She sounds really sharp.

She was still in rigor it sounds like when she was found - stiff. There is a time when rigor softens, and I'll have to look that up, but it is a way to tell the approx time of death. It could be the Sheriff thinks she could have been alive as late as 6am, as they asked for anything unusual up to that time to be reported.

Scandi

ETA: I hope you guys will listen to that tape too to see if you hear what I did. The tape was very clear to understand, and I had the volume all the way up.
 
  • #169
raisincharlie said:
I don't think that fax is in the way of anything. If there is a real fax, was it printed the morning of the 3rd or prior to the 3rd and why would it really matter? I think it is possible that there was something he wanted Meredith to pick up, we don't know for sure what it was about only a rumor. But so what it was printed out in truth on the 1st of November - wouldn't Jason know it was in a pile anyway ? What I'm saying is - the fax really doesn't matter unless of course there is no fax matching the description Jason gave to Meredith.

Bottom line for me - the fax was a ruse, whether it is real or not. I look at it this way if Jason did this:

He was wanting someone else to find the body while he was well away from the area. So he goes through his meeting - no terrible news received. He calls Michelle and gets her voicemail - notice he doesn't call where she works - he wants someone to call him. He's driving along towards the folks house and still no terrible news. Call the voicemail again because he knows that is all he is going to get. Since he did not kill the baby and no news yet he realizes that baby is there alone.

So he calls Meredith about the fax because he does want the baby cared for and he is in desperate need for someone to find that body while he can account for his whereabouts - he doesn't want to return Saturday and find the body of his wife and who knows how the baby would have been by Saturday when he was suppose to return. (Meredith even tells the 911 operator it is a "fluke" for her to go to the house during the day.) He really wants to be with his folks when the news comes in so they can verify his obvious immediate grief. If he killed her, his reaction in front of the parents may well have been from his own nervousness about the crime not being found while he is gone and in accordance with his plan.

There really could be a fax, but that doesn't mean he didn't kill his wife - even if he got on the web and requested the info that morning - the fax is meaningless with respect to whether he killed his wife or not.

It is only meaningful if it does not exist IMO. so I just don't see this as a big issue that proves anything if it exists. JMHO

I totally agree on every aspect you proposed. This has been rattling around in my head for days. You just expressed it better. Thanks, Otto.
 
  • #170
got home, got settled...(my son's team won the bowling match :))

i heard a little bit ago that NG will discuss this case tomorrow night...got Greta on, waiting to see if anything will be brought up....
 
  • #171
There really could be a fax, but that doesn't mean he didn't kill his wife - even if he got on the web and requested the info that morning - the fax is meaningless with respect to whether he killed his wife or not.

It is only meaningful if it does not exist IMO. so I just don't see this as a big issue that proves anything if it exists. JMHO


exactly raisin.....we won't know if there really WAS a fax there, for Meredith to retrieve, until this goes to trial....that's of course if JY is the one to go to trial....IF he IS charged for this crime, then the fax, (OR the fact there isn't one) was a ruse......something to get Meredith there to find the body....
 
  • #172
scandi said:
That was very interesting to hear, and thank you dear Otto.

Near the first part of the tape when Meridith gets Cassidy focused and she starts talking, the first word our of Cassidy's mouth I heard was Daddy . .and then a couple of words followed that. And towards the end of the tape befrore he tried to connect with the Sheriff, I heard Cassidy talking in the background, and again heard her say Daddy, and it was like she was trying to explain something both times I heard it.

Thank goodness Cassidy is a little motormouth! LOL I think she probably told them exactly what she saw, and it almost seemed like she was trying to explain the action or maybe Michelle and the killer struggling with each other. Boy, it wouldn't take much to enhance that tape and hear most of what little Cassidy said. She sounds really sharp.

She was still in rigor it sounds like when she was found - stiff. There is a time when rigor softens, and I'll have to look that up, but it is a way to tell the approx time of death. It could be the Sheriff thinks she could have been alive as late as 6am, as they asked for anything unusual up to that time to be reported.

Scandi

ETA: I hope you guys will listen to that tape too to see if you hear what I did. The tape was very clear to understand, and I had the volume all the way up.

lol, yes Scandi....Cassidy was a lil motormouth during the 911 call...bless her heart:)

i've listened to that 911 call so many times, it's downright crazy...had my husband sit & listen with me, & my middle son (21)....
 
  • #173
concernedperson said:
I totally agree on every aspect you proposed. This has been rattling around in my head for days. You just expressed it better. Thanks, Otto.

i hear ya CP...this whole case has been rattlin around in my head for days....i found myself thinking about it this afternoon while driving ..... geeeeesh!
 
  • #174
PolkSaladAnnie said:
BeeCh: I'm one of those and with you regarding hanging on the Sheriff's word. One thing is for sure (and outside the 911 call that we plucked apart breath by breath): the ConcernedCitizen poster's "fully informed facts" and "the real truth" was behind more debated concepts and ideas than the actual facts and known media reports that have come in about this case.

Maybe LE still have the car because JY hasn't collected it and they're can't very well leave it on the side of a road - or drive it to the Young's home. For all we know, they've set a time/date for collection and, with luck, an interview.

As an aside: Wonder if Larry King is going to call the families in and discuss this? Hah, he's probably more interested in getting OJ on to talk about that %^$%#@ ! "book". What an absolute NERVE...

if LE still has JY's car, IMO, they found something........
 
  • #175
panthera said:
Another interesting point that hasn't been resolved yet through the media! Did the perpetrator (someone other than Jason) enter through the front door, the garage or a back entry? "No sign of forced entry" doesn't necessarily mean that Michelle answered the door after someone knocked or rang the bell. She could've already been up in the bedroom when she was attacked. I wish we'd get an update!!
:confused:

i wish we'd get an update too!!!....i must assume there's nothing to report....it really is strange though...IF LE is stumped, (i have to think that's not the case...not yet anyway) you'd think they'd be trying to get help from the public...they haven't done that either, other than right from the beginning....something's gotta break soon....i just know it...ugh

i'm curious to know if LE found ANY doors/windows unlocked...a person could get through an unlocked window, & then have no way to lock it, if they exit through the same window....oh hell, that doesn't mean anything...they could simply lock the window back, once they're in the house, & leave through a door that can be locked before exiting..........(talking outloud here)
 
  • #176
I think I know why this isn't a forum yet.It happens to be the case at CTV too. It is obvious that enough suspicions arise and that this case will be solved quickly. We saw Imette's forum go quietly when a suspect was arrested.

I, personally, think every victim should get a forum but that isn't reasonable. There are so many crimes, it takes our breathe away.

For victims everywhere.We never stop looking, we have pause in our endeavors
 
  • #177
scandi said:
Good Morning,

I guess my question that got lost was the last one on the previous thread, but I was wondering if anything has been said about a safety gate at the top of the stairs? I thought I read a post by Strach where she said it was closed. Has anyone read anything about this?

I'm trying to think like a profiler after watching a Daryl Hinman marathon last week!~ LOL

I think whoever killed Michelle took care to do certain things after the murder that showed caring for Stephanie. She evidently was left in the room with her mom to have gotten blood on her feet, or at least been able to walk into her mom's bedroom:

a} If there was a gate and it was secured before the killer went back down the stairs, it says to me they wanted the baby safe from harm and seperated from the dog.
b} After the dispatcher on the 911 call told her not to move anything, Meridith said she had moved a pillow. That tells me there was a reason to move it which would have to be she wanted to see something that would be underneath it. Like a face, right, to see if it indeed was her sister.

That would mean the killer took time to toss or set a pillow over whatever it was. Why? Michelle was found on her stomach, but part of her face could have been visible. Tradition says that when someone dies you cover their face, right? I think this was part of the instructions given to whomever actually killed her.

c} The house was not broken into.

To me all these factors, if they are fact, add up to the great possibility that the killer was someone close to Michelle or instructed by someone personally attached to her. It is unusual I think for the bit of decorum with the pillow and concern for the safety of the baby.

Reading through today's posts I see we really have very little to even speculate with which is too bad. We're pulling at straws. But if the Sheriff meant what he said when he used the words 'persons who did this' it intimates more than one person being involved in her death. I take that as fact from what he said. Moving the pillow is a fact. The baby being left with access to her mom, as shown by bloody footprints is a fact {though I think 'all over the house' could have been an exageration caused by the trauma of the scene}.

I also think the office where the fax machine was could have been upstairs adjacent to the MB as it is in so many houses, which is why Meridith possibly headed upstairs.

Scandi

good points made, Scandi!.....i haven't heard about a safety gate, but it's possible they had one....

the pillow could have been over her face (side of her face)...the killer might not have wanted to look at her, once she was dead....

& you're absolutely right...the place where Meredith was suppose to retrieve a fax, could very well have been upstairs....

this might have been a 'murder for hire'.......hmmm
 
  • #178
concernedperson said:
I think I know why this isn't a forum yet.It happens to be the case at CTV too. It is obvious that enough suspicions arise and that this case will be solved quickly. We saw Imette's forum go quietly when a suspect was arrested.

I, personally, think every victim should get a forum but that isn't reasonable. There are so many crimes, it takes our breathe away.

For victims everywhere.We never stop looking, we have pause in our endeavors

i haven't checked out ctv, since i've been back home this evening, but there seems to be no more info than there is here....a lot of the same speculation...lots of folks are very 'into' this case....BTW, it got brought up at the bowling alley this afternoon....a lady i sit with occasionally said something about Greta's show...i brought up this case & she knew exactly what i was talking about....she's very interested in it also....

again, here's hoping justice is served for Michelle, her family & friends....
 
  • #179
scandi said:
That was very interesting to hear, and thank you dear Otto.

Near the first part of the tape when Meridith gets Cassidy focused and she starts talking, the first word our of Cassidy's mouth I heard was Daddy . .and then a couple of words followed that. And towards the end of the tape befrore he tried to connect with the Sheriff, I heard Cassidy talking in the background, and again heard her say Daddy, and it was like she was trying to explain something both times I heard it.

Thank goodness Cassidy is a little motormouth! LOL I think she probably told them exactly what she saw, and it almost seemed like she was trying to explain the action or maybe Michelle and the killer struggling with each other. Boy, it wouldn't take much to enhance that tape and hear most of what little Cassidy said. She sounds really sharp.

She was still in rigor it sounds like when she was found - stiff. There is a time when rigor softens, and I'll have to look that up, but it is a way to tell the approx time of death. It could be the Sheriff thinks she could have been alive as late as 6am, as they asked for anything unusual up to that time to be reported.

Scandi

ETA: I hope you guys will listen to that tape too to see if you hear what I did. The tape was very clear to understand, and I had the volume all the way up.

It is an interesting tape and she from what I hear, she says Daddy ... when asked what happened. I have to listen to it again more carefully to really know what else is there.

As to rigor, I posted this way back on the first thread:

"For the first hour after death, the body temperature will fall from its normal level (of about 98.6 degrees Fahrenheit) at a rate of roughly one and a half to two degrees per hour for the first twelve hours. This depends on the build of the victim, the amount of clothing or covering, and the temperature around them- if, for instance, the body is in the water the temperature will fall much quicker.
There are also other signs that can help with determining the time of death. Usually about two hours of the person dying, rigor mortis sets in. Which is a Latin term meaning "the stiffness of death". The internal chemistry of the body changes from its normal acid state to an alkaline one. This causes the muscles which were once relaxed at the time of death to tense and stiffen. Rigor mortis begins with the eyelids and then progresses to the muscles of the face, and then to the arms, torso and finally the legs. Within twelve hours rigor mortis has been fully established and the body is stiff and as unbending as a block of unbending wood. The body can remain in this condition for any time between twelve and forty-eight hours, until the body returns to a natural acid state. This reverse process affects the muscles in the same order in which rigor mortis stiffened them from the eyelids to the legs." I confirmed it with a second link but this one is here:
http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=1501608
 
  • #180
otto said:
It is an interesting tape and she from what I hear, she says Daddy ... when asked what happened. I have to listen to it again more carefully to really know what else is there.

As to rigor, I posted this way back on the first thread:

"For the first hour after death, the body temperature will fall from its normal level (of about 98.6 degrees Fahrenheit) at a rate of roughly one and a half to two degrees per hour for the first twelve hours. This depends on the build of the victim, the amount of clothing or covering, and the temperature around them- if, for instance, the body is in the water the temperature will fall much quicker.
There are also other signs that can help with determining the time of death. Usually about two hours of the person dying, rigor mortis sets in. Which is a Latin term meaning "the stiffness of death". The internal chemistry of the body changes from its normal acid state to an alkaline one. This causes the muscles which were once relaxed at the time of death to tense and stiffen. Rigor mortis begins with the eyelids and then progresses to the muscles of the face, and then to the arms, torso and finally the legs. Within twelve hours rigor mortis has been fully established and the body is stiff and as unbending as a block of unbending wood. The body can remain in this condition for any time between twelve and forty-eight hours, until the body returns to a natural acid state. This reverse process affects the muscles in the same order in which rigor mortis stiffened them from the eyelids to the legs." I confirmed it with a second link but this one is here:
http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=1501608

yes Otto...thanks for posting that again....

wonder when we'll hear an update, at least confirming the ME's time of death????....that should be coming out soon, wouldn't yall think??...that wouldn't be something that LE would necessarily want 'sealed', right???

i know that LE wanted info from anyone that saw (or didn't see ) anything betw the hours of midnight & 6 am, but the ME can pinpoint TOD closer than that....
 
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