Miners Trapped In WV Coal Mine

[housemaid25]

Can anyone provide the time that Geraldo first stated that all 12 were alive? TIA

I heard Geralda talking yesturday morning and he said it was 11:50 when he arrived and people were yelling their alive. this is probually right because my sister called shortly after that to see if I was watching and the caller ID says she called at 12:02

 

[poco]

Saw the Dr. interviewed this morning and the carbon monoxide poisoning damaged multiple organs; although his condition is improving, there is no telling, at this time, if irreversible organ damage has occurred, or how Mr. McCloy will end up.. It's a little too early to know, for sure, if he will recover, ley alone fully recover.

Exactly - that is what I am trying to say - I guess - don't call it a miracle until it is one.

Kinda like - it's a miracle that he made it out alive - unfortunately there is irreparable brain damage and he will never walk and have nightmares the rest of his life be because of his ordeal - but damn, he survived???!!!!!

I realize we don't know any of this yet and he may be perfectly fine. I was just speaking in general, not about this specific situation, when I said what I said in an earlier post. Just because someone survived an ordeal, doesn't necessarily make it a miracle - sometimes the miracle lies in them not surviving (IMO).

 

[Details]

The CEO isn't responsible for the mine's safety record - they only bought it 2 months ago. Where he should be - I don't know - there's a positive side to having him overseeing and helping with the rescue effort, and there's a positive side to having him with the families. Me - I wouldn't feel right being with the families when my mine (however recently I'd gotten it) might have killed them - I'd feel that was intruding on their private time. I'd be wanting to go where I could do something productive - be there for the rescue effort, to authorize whatever resources, act as a conduit for official news (as when he told the police to tell them 12 alive was not confirmed), etc.

This CEO seems to really care.

 

[Details]

Exactly - that is what I am trying to say - I guess - don't call it a miracle until it is one.

Kinda like - it's a miracle that he made it out alive - unfortunately there is irreparable brain damage and he will never walk and have nightmares the rest of his life be because of his ordeal - but damn, he survived???!!!!!

I realize we don't know any of this yet and he may be perfectly fine. I was just speaking in general, not about this specific situation, when I said what I said in an earlier post. Just because someone survived an ordeal, doesn't necessarily make it a miracle - sometimes the miracle lies in them not surviving (IMO).

Yeah, but my point is that we already know enough to know that he has had pretty good progress so far. None of the organs are critical (or he wouldn't have survived - they may recover, or they may need to be replaced or sustained with medicines - a lot of organs can be dealt with that way, and your life is still quite worth living. People who can't walk still want to live their lives. Brain damage is the big one - but there are indications that he doesn't have much if any - relatively speaking. Survivor guilt and nightmares - so many people have that, and life is still worth living for them. Survivor guilt and he will never walk again and some minor brain damage - I think that's still a life well worth living - people who have that think their life is still worth living.

I do know what you mean - I watch a lot of the medical channels, and when you see a burn patient come in, or someone with severe brain damage that will leave them vegetative or an infant for the rest of their life - sometimes it's pretty clear that survival is not the good option there - but they can do a lot these days. I agree with your general point, but in this case there's plenty of indications that surviving was the good option this time.

 

[Linda7NJ]

This definitely isn't again you, cheko, but I'm questioning why we tend to feel that a miracle happened because this man survived. This man will be haunted the rest of his life by what happened. As the sole survivor - he will live in his own personel hell the rest of his life. What will his life be like now?

Suppose he has severe brain and/or organ damage because of the carbon monoxide poisoning and gets to live the rest of this life as what, a vegetable, paralyzed, crippled? We call this a miracle????

IMO, there were no survivors!

Sadly, I agree

 

[PrayersForMaura]

TV Psychic Misses Mark on Miners

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,180681,00.html

Imagine that :angel:

 

[Linda7NJ]

Yeah, but my point is that we already know enough to know that he has had pretty good progress so far. None of the organs are critical (or he wouldn't have survived - they may recover, or they may need to be replaced or sustained with medicines - a lot of organs can be dealt with that way, and your life is still quite worth living. People who can't walk still want to live their lives. Brain damage is the big one - but there are indications that he doesn't have much if any - relatively speaking. Survivor guilt and nightmares - so many people have that, and life is still worth living for them. Survivor guilt and he will never walk again and some minor brain damage - I think that's still a life well worth living - people who have that think their life is still worth living.

I do know what you mean - I watch a lot of the medical channels, and when you see a burn patient come in, or someone with severe brain damage that will leave them vegetative or an infant for the rest of their life - sometimes it's pretty clear that survival is not the good option there - but they can do a lot these days. I agree with your general point, but in this case there's plenty of indications that surviving was the good option this time.

I think the statement that there was no brain injury was referring to a physical brain injury, not oxygen deprivation

 

[Mygirlsadie]

Your absolutely right. He seemed to be a hands on CEO during the search and rescue he tried to set the record straight but nobody would listen I also heard on the news today that it was taking over 45 minutes to get from the church to the mine due to all the congestion in the area family,friends,cousins uncles aunts dogs cats who or whatever else was in the area at the time the police were doing what they could to control that but it seems that them going from church to mine to church would be an almost 2 hour trip. This CEO & Mayor were trying to get true and honest facts for the families and I think that is great that they were out doing that, ya know they were not sitting there trying to be the ''do gooder'' to earn brownie points so people could sit back and say well they never got actual facts but they gave great compassion and hugs nope they had a job to do and they did it. Some might call that heartless and uncaring but I call it professional.

The CEO isn't responsible for the mine's safety record - they only bought it 2 months ago. Where he should be - I don't know - there's a positive side to having him overseeing and helping with the rescue effort, and there's a positive side to having him with the families. Me - I wouldn't feel right being with the families when my mine (however recently I'd gotten it) might have killed them - I'd feel that was intruding on their private time. I'd be wanting to go where I could do something productive - be there for the rescue effort, to authorize whatever resources, act as a conduit for official news (as when he told the police to tell them 12 alive was not confirmed), etc.

This CEO seems to really care.

 

[Details]

I think the statement that there was no brain injury was referring to a physical brain injury, not oxygen deprivation

Actually, I was referring to the fact that he could squeeze a hand on command, and had interaction with his wife through facial expressions - that is an incredibly good sign that the brain is largely intact. Especially since he was still under some sedation during that time.

And unlike a physical brain injury, the oxygen deprivation damage is done and over with once oxygen is restored - he should only get better now - unlike a physical brain injury where the swelling causes more and more damage over time.

 

[indigomood]

I think the statement that there was no brain injury was referring to a physical brain injury, not oxygen deprivation

I agree... CT scans of the brain ruled out immediate things like bleeds etc but for long term neurological sequelae, only time will tell. Problems like memory loss, diminished intellectual functioning, concentration problems, personality change etc will be determined only after the passage of some time. IMO

I certainly prayer that with continued intervention, this young man's recovery is maximized.

 

[Sassygerl]

I think the statement that there was no brain injury was referring to a physical brain injury, not oxygen deprivation

I did see the latest news conference from the hospital and he does have injury to the brain. They are still testing to determine how much. His organs are slightly improving and while the doctor said him squeezing was a good sign, he did say that is a simple reflex that even babies do. He's in stable but guarded condition and it was said several times he is a critical patient. I am praying for him and hoping he will open his eyes soon and show more progress.

I still think it's a miracle he made it out.....JMO.

 

[Details]

Ah. I got the impression the squeezing was on command, not just random. That isn't as good.

Still, some brain damage - my cousin has that. She's still mostly herself - some trouble walking, little facial muscles she can't control, bit of a personality change, bit slower - but still mostly herself, newly married, has a job, has a kid - a good life.

 

[SewingDeb]

http://www.click2houston.com/news/5858218/detail.html

TALLMANSVILLE, W.Va. -- Some of the 12 coal miners who died following an explosion left notes behind assuring family members that their final hours trapped underground were not spent in agony, a relative said Thursday.

"The notes said they weren't suffering, they were just going to sleep," said Peggy Cohen, who had been called to a makeshift morgue at a school to identify the body of her father, 59-year-old mining machine operator Fred Ware Jr.

Cohen said a note was not left with Ware's body, but that she planned to retrieve his personal belongings later Thursday to see if he left one in his lunch box. But she said the medical examiner told her notes left with several of the bodies all carried a similar message: "Your dad didn't suffer."

Ware was among a dozen miners who were found after 41 hours inside the mine. They were found at the deepest point of the Sago Mine, about 2.5 miles from the entrance, behind a fibrous plastic cloth stretched across an area about 20 feet wide to keep out deadly carbon monoxide gas.

Cohen said her father had the peaceful look of someone who died from carbon monoxide, and the only mark on his body was a bruise on his chest. "It comforts me to know he didn't suffer and he wasn't bruised or crushed. I didn't need a note. I think I needed to visualize and see him."

~more at link~

 

[Details]

The one good thing about carbon monoxide - you don't suffer. You just get very tired and go to sleep - forever.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

The one good thing about carbon monoxide - you don't suffer. You just get very tired and go to sleep - forever.

I'm sure there are worse ways to die, but I guess the hard part is KNOWING that you're about to die. I can only begin to imagine what would go through one's mind when its inevitable, but it has to be its own kind of torture. Thoughts about how your family will handle it. How will your children go on without you. What you didn't get a chance to say to those you love. Its just heartbreaking.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Actually, I was referring to the fact that he could squeeze a hand on command, and had interaction with his wife through facial expressions - that is an incredibly good sign that the brain is largely intact. Especially since he was still under some sedation during that time.

And unlike a physical brain injury, the oxygen deprivation damage is done and over with once oxygen is restored - he should only get better now - unlike a physical brain injury where the swelling causes more and more damage over time.

I disagree. IMO while neither is any better than the other. Often times physical brain injuries do cause brain swelling that leads to more damage. But often times this can be minimized by relieving the pressure with shunts.

 

[Details]

I disagree. IMO while neither is any better than the other. Often times physical brain injuries do cause brain swelling that leads to more damage. But often times this can be minimized by relieving the pressure with shunts.

No, neither is any better than the other - my point was just that with oxygen deprivation they shouldn't have to worry about him getting worse over time. However bad he is now is it - he'll just get better - no more damage will occur so long as he keeps getting oxygen.

A physical brain injury - the swelling can accelerate, can hit the point where a shunt will do no good. So they can come in responding to commands, even talking, and suddenly go into coma, and then to brain death. That shouldn't happen in this one.

An unrelated story - I was watching one of the ER shows (reality, not scripted), and there was an odd case - an elderly gentleman was in a car wreck, serious brain swelling - nothing the doctors could do for it. But what saved him is that he had had a stroke some years ago, and the brain had atrophied in that area - which ended up providing enough space that the brain swelling did not put any pressure on the brain, and thus he was just fine - no brain damage, no difference to his personality at all! He'd have been dead, except for that stroke clearing out the room for the brain to swell. It was just unbelievable!

 

[Buzz Mills]

Carbon Monoxide poisoning

http://tinyurl.com/alhc7


Lobg Term Effects of Carbon Monoxide Poisoning

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/09/040906083815.htm

 

[indigomood]

The one good thing about carbon monoxide - you don't suffer. You just get very tired and go to sleep - forever.

I hope that is what happened here, but I can't help but think about the likelihood of seizures prior to loss of consciousness. It's so sad they had time to contemplate their own demise. I can think of nothing more haunting

 

[christine2448]

Carbon Monoxide poisoning

http://tinyurl.com/alhc7


Lobg Term Effects of Carbon Monoxide Poisoning

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/09/040906083815.htmhttp://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/09/040906083815.htm

Thanks for the links Buzz.