• #801
From a July 8th, 1992 Springfield News-Leader article (emphasis mine):

"The investigation is in its second month. The three women, Sherrill Levitt, Suzanne Streeter and Stacy McCall, disappeared June 7. Knowles reported on the investigation during a noon luncheon of the City Council. Knowles told council members:

* The police have found thumbprints and concluded the three women left through the front door rather than through the carport door of Levitt's home. They also have concluded McCall had left barefooted.

* Police believe more than one person participated in the alleged abduction.

Knowles said the disturbance of evidence at Levitt's home hampered the investigation. For example, the women's purses were moved, and witnesses gave conflicting information, he said. Police found 60 fingerprints but established that 18 people were in the house before they had arrived, Knowles said. Now, they have to eliminate the 18 individuals' fingerprints before they can investigate the others, he said."

Three conclusions can be drawn from this:

1. They obviously knew Stacy left barefooted because her shoes were left behind.

2. The purses being lined up in Suzie's room could be a complete red herring and they were moved by the 18 people inside the house.

3. If they found thumbprints and concluded that they left through the front door rather than the carport door, this would suggest to me that Stacy's thumbprint was found on the interior door knob, because you would expect Sherrill and Suzie's prints to be all over that door from living there for two months. Or perhaps a lack of fingerprints found on the carport door led them to believe that no one used that door (which was found locked).
The thumbprints is definitely interesting, but Suzie and Sherrill's thumbprints would be all over the doorknob anyway, and that means only Stacy's prints would be telling. Only jmo they're not really telling because she followed Suzie home, it's Suzie's house, Suzie undoubtedly went in first, she has the key to open the door and Stacy behind, so who's going to be shutting that inside door? The last one in, Stacy. So I just don't think this means the women left through that door. It seems to be implied, yes, but it's not necessarily how it happened, jmo.
shoes left behind.
Understood, jmo shoes being there means shoes there, and that's it. People can be carried out of a building.
If they knew this person, they could have opened the blinds (as found in Suzie's bedroom with the TV turned down) and saw who it was. No knock to the front door is necessary. And the perp/s would have never had to have stepped foot inside the house.
This makes a lot of sense to me, I could picture that happening. I just don't think it did because that scene is too controlled, it's jmo almost smothering.

Teeny boppers at the window don't leave a CS like that-- usually. But one never knows, agreed. But how'd Sherrill end up outside as well? In the end, I just don't think so, honestly. Too slick.
 
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  • #802
i dont believe all 3 women were targets, so why were all 3 taken. its more plausible perp was in the house already when streeter and mccall arrived home.
It depends on why they left. For an overdose* or other emergency, they'd likely all go rather than "Welp, I'm going to bed, let me know how it goes." Otherwise, it's the reason some crimes remain unsolved in perpetuity - dead witnesses don't talk, and you don't have to be a target to be collateral.

The most sinister take on this for me is they were taken to another location for some time. And if that's the case, I think it's possible the transport person/s were not the same as the killer/s and perhaps murder wasn't the intended result. But then we're talking conspiracy, and conspiracy equals more people and we're back to dead or missing witnesses.

I don't know that it's even that complicated. If the perp was already in the house, he was in plain sight and Sherrill was alive. Otherwise, Cinnamon would be at least acting strangely if not fully losing her mind. I just can't envision Stacy and Suzie prepping for bed while Sherrill is dead or incapacitated with a perp lurking. If Cinnamon were already in the bathroom, Suzie would have either looked for her mom to find out why or let Cinnamon out, who would then likely beeline to wherever Sherrill was or had been. Either way, they're not taking off make-up and changing...still tipsy/tired possibly, oblivious, no. Some might see a yapping nervous breed, but Suzie would know her dog and read the anxiety. All to say at that point, IMO everything was stable because the only way they're not thinking of Sherrill is if she left a note or voice message saying she was spending the next night at X's, intending for Suzie to find it after the water park. That scenario seems to require the perp comes back to the house because he left something traceable, and then removes Stacy and Suzie because he has to. You'd need a very good reason to come back in the first place, and it wouldn't be for 2 more people you didn't know were there (or he knew that Suzie knew who Sherrill was with). Perhaps perp was on the answering machine as well saying he was coming by to see Sherrill. That message would have to go. But then he put Sherill's purse back to make it appear she never left? The "what ifs" start to unravel everything.

I think the perp name is in the case file (LE knows), at least one clue was on the machine (LE knows), and Cinnamon knew. I would love to know who she kept to in the house the next day; did that person put her in a bathroom if she was paying too much attention to him? No one in real time was thinking of a crime, so an accidental perfect scenario for a perp coming to the house. I can only assume anyone MIA the next few days, either laying low or on a bender was looked at.

* Overdose would be my first guess only because the supplier would have an immediate and swift interest, esp if already known to LE or with a record. Stacy or Suzie ODs and survives, trouble. ODs and doesn't survive, big all she wrote trouble. Asthma attack, alcohol poisoning, chest pains...any could get them all to leave. But to not come back, someone has liability.
 
  • #803
this was not carried out by someone who was drunk. the girls appear to have been taken out of the house quickly. no time to grab there clothes. no time to grab anything.
So, under the influence and drunk aren't necessarily the same, esp since under the influence doesn't only refer to alcohol. But FWIW, highly functioning alcoholics can do myriad things. Getting 3 women out of the house doesn't mean you can pass a field sobriety test.

I agree they left quickly, if not for their own reasons, then via brandished weapon. Side note - a lot is made of the perp having a gun, which doesn't mean it wasn't a gun (or knife) from the house. A gun from the house missing would be something LE might keep under wraps, and a knife is cooperation inducing if it's against the throat of a loved one or friend.

It appears they were in at least sleep clothes, and we don't know what or if they grabbed anything. They could have been barefoot regardless of the perp's intoxication status.
 
  • #804
From a July 8th, 1992 Springfield News-Leader article (emphasis mine):

"The investigation is in its second month. The three women, Sherrill Levitt, Suzanne Streeter and Stacy McCall, disappeared June 7. Knowles reported on the investigation during a noon luncheon of the City Council. Knowles told council members:

* The police have found thumbprints and concluded the three women left through the front door rather than through the carport door of Levitt's home. They also have concluded McCall had left barefooted.

* Police believe more than one person participated in the alleged abduction.

Knowles said the disturbance of evidence at Levitt's home hampered the investigation. For example, the women's purses were moved, and witnesses gave conflicting information, he said. Police found 60 fingerprints but established that 18 people were in the house before they had arrived, Knowles said. Now, they have to eliminate the 18 individuals' fingerprints before they can investigate the others, he said."

Three conclusions can be drawn from this:

1. They obviously knew Stacy left barefooted because her shoes were left behind.

2. The purses being lined up in Suzie's room could be a complete red herring and they were moved by the 18 people inside the house.

3. If they found thumbprints and concluded that they left through the front door rather than the carport door, this would suggest to me that Stacy's thumbprint was found on the interior door knob, because you would expect Sherrill and Suzie's prints to be all over that door from living there for two months. Or perhaps a lack of fingerprints found on the carport door led them to believe that no one used that door (which was found locked).
I also recall there being mention Stacy's blood was found, presumably from stepping on the glass globe shards. I'll see if I can find the link for that.
 
  • #805
It depends on why they left. For an overdose* or other emergency, they'd likely all go rather than "Welp, I'm going to bed, let me know how it goes." Otherwise, it's the reason some crimes remain unsolved in perpetuity - dead witnesses don't talk, and you don't have to be a target to be collateral.

The most sinister take on this for me is they were taken to another location for some time. And if that's the case, I think it's possible the transport person/s were not the same as the killer/s and perhaps murder wasn't the intended result. But then we're talking conspiracy, and conspiracy equals more people and we're back to dead or missing witnesses.

I don't know that it's even that complicated. If the perp was already in the house, he was in plain sight and Sherrill was alive. Otherwise, Cinnamon would be at least acting strangely if not fully losing her mind. I just can't envision Stacy and Suzie prepping for bed while Sherrill is dead or incapacitated with a perp lurking. If Cinnamon were already in the bathroom, Suzie would have either looked for her mom to find out why or let Cinnamon out, who would then likely beeline to wherever Sherrill was or had been. Either way, they're not taking off make-up and changing...still tipsy/tired possibly, oblivious, no. Some might see a yapping nervous breed, but Suzie would know her dog and read the anxiety. All to say at that point, IMO everything was stable because the only way they're not thinking of Sherrill is if she left a note or voice message saying she was spending the next night at X's, intending for Suzie to find it after the water park. That scenario seems to require the perp comes back to the house because he left something traceable, and then removes Stacy and Suzie because he has to. You'd need a very good reason to come back in the first place, and it wouldn't be for 2 more people you didn't know were there (or he knew that Suzie knew who Sherrill was with). Perhaps perp was on the answering machine as well saying he was coming by to see Sherrill. That message would have to go. But then he put Sherill's purse back to make it appear she never left? The "what ifs" start to unravel everything.

I think the perp name is in the case file (LE knows), at least one clue was on the machine (LE knows), and Cinnamon knew. I would love to know who she kept to in the house the next day; did that person put her in a bathroom if she was paying too much attention to him? No one in real time was thinking of a crime, so an accidental perfect scenario for a perp coming to the house. I can only assume anyone MIA the next few days, either laying low or on a bender was looked at.

* Overdose would be my first guess only because the supplier would have an immediate and swift interest, esp if already known to LE or with a record. Stacy or Suzie ODs and survives, trouble. ODs and doesn't survive, big all she wrote trouble. Asthma attack, alcohol poisoning, chest pains...any could get them all to leave. But to not come back, someone has liability.
Overdose really does seem plausible, jmo. But don't think a dealer or buddy who supplied drugs would up the ante to multiple homicides over an overdose. Also find it hard to believe that if he did, he'd leave hundreds of dollars in one of the victim's purses. If he's willing to peddle drugs for cash and is so devoted to those ends that he's now going to kill over it, why not take the money? And if he's not an outright dealer but some friend who supplied the durgs... I still can't picture him now resorting to murder. Also don't think your average street dealer or buddy supplying drugs is going to have the ability to conceal three victims' bodies for decades. But it's possible that yes, he somehow did. (But jmo doubtful.)

Continue to lean towards an intruder after all these decades. He probably watched for a point when the dog was out in the yard through the little doggie door and gave the little thing a steak, something to keep the dog preoccupied for a time. Intruder already had figured out a way to get in, the shattering of the globe may have been to test for how heavy a sleeper Sherrill was, and/or to draw her away from an area for a time because he needed her out of that area to make entry. Once he was in & had some control, he probably latched or blocked the doggie door, leaving the little thing puzzled, unsettled, and maybe that's how the little dog ended up trotting around the area outside the yard. It's possible that when Suzie and Stacy came home, they assumed Sherrill was asleep, Cinnamon was in the room with her, and didn't want to wake her, but it's jmo. Don't think this is any low-level player, jmo, this is not the usual suspects. I may well be wrong, though.
 
  • #806
this was not carried out by someone who was drunk. the girls appear to have been taken out of the house quickly. no time to grab there clothes. no time to grab anything.
interesting point. i had not thought of streeter bringing someone home to delmar with mccall.
 
  • #807
Overdose really does seem plausible, jmo. But don't think a dealer or buddy who supplied drugs would up the ante to multiple homicides over an overdose. Also find it hard to believe that if he did, he'd leave hundreds of dollars in one of the victim's purses. If he's willing to peddle drugs for cash and is so devoted to those ends that he's now going to kill over it, why not take the money? And if he's not an outright dealer but some friend who supplied the durgs... I still can't picture him now resorting to murder. Also don't think your average street dealer or buddy supplying drugs is going to have the ability to conceal three victims' bodies for decades. But it's possible that yes, he somehow did. (But jmo doubtful.)

Continue to lean towards an intruder after all these decades. He probably watched for a point when the dog was out in the yard through the little doggie door and gave the little thing a steak, something to keep the dog preoccupied for a time. Intruder already had figured out a way to get in, the shattering of the globe may have been to test for how heavy a sleeper Sherrill was, and/or to draw her away from an area for a time because he needed her out of that area to make entry. Once he was in & had some control, he probably latched or blocked the doggie door, leaving the little thing puzzled, unsettled, and maybe that's how the little dog ended up trotting around the area outside the yard. It's possible that when Suzie and Stacy came home, they assumed Sherrill was asleep, Cinnamon was in the room with her, and didn't want to wake her, but it's jmo. Don't think this is any low-level player, jmo, this is not the usual suspects. I may well be wrong, though.
more that one person. i cant see that. someone would have rolled over by now. 2 people keeping a triple abduction secret would not be easy. after 34 yrs why has no one talked.
 
  • #808
If they knew this person, they could have opened the blinds (as found in Suzie's bedroom with the TV turned down) and saw who it was. No knock to the front door is necessary. And the perp/s would have never had to have stepped foot inside the house.
blinds open means nothing. it could have been done hours earlier or day before.
 
  • #809
(respectfully bolded) Agreed this is a special night, and that does seem extremely significant. Still feel this is someone who was aware of the activities but not necessarily from that area, and he was jmo likely beyond the age range for participating in the parties, so tend to agree with the fringe aspect. He's "in between," he's younger than Sherrill and older than Suzie and Stacy, but again jmo. Also, special nights like graduation bring chaos and unexpected events, but I think he had been watching that house and the women in it for a time and may have felt fairly confident that he generally knew what to expect-- he may have even welcomed the chaos, it's not just chaotic for him. He may have been rifling through purses and spending time once inside the house to make sure he was prepared for what might come next.

I don't know on the bold aspect, tend to agree especially if that was him calling on the phone, but think he's an active or dormant SK and he's as calculated as he is bold. Am wondering if a high school graduation event didn't trigger him in some way. Evidently killers might target milestone events, and since this theoretical killer would himself have experienced a high school graduation-- maybe it triggered something in him.

As special as the night is, I don't think it's more special than the layout & location of that house with two attractive females occupying it. But totally agreeing with the idea that the graduation-- it had to play some role. Am staying open to all the theories discussed on here, they've all seemed plausible and well supported and I'm not glued to any theory right now. With that said, I don't think this was any teenager or group of teens, graverobber, etc. The voice might be teenish, but this was jmo no teen.
JK told det asher the caller sounded teenish, but also said she should have stayed on the phone longer to keep him talking. hindsight, and what about weird message on levitt answering machine that was deleted by JM.
 
  • #810
Stacy planned on spending the night somewhere other than her home. We know she would have packed a swimsuit. It stands to reason she would have also packed some sleep clothes. Was she going to sleep at Janelle's or Brian Joy's in her underwear? Doubtful.



The phone was working. They would have called the cops. I'm a dude and if I hear a glass shatter on the porch there's no way I'm opening the door for anyone unless it was a very close relative.
the light globe that broken was already faulty when levitt and streeter moved to delmar st earlier that year.
 
  • #811
Janis says that when she entered the house, it was dark and she couldn't really see anything. She fumbled around trying to find a light and finally got the ceiling fan light in the living room to turn on. This is when she noticed the VCR and cable box being on. IMO, if she could barely see in the living room, this tells me that the living room TV was not on or else the light from the TV would have helped her see better. So that means Suzie's room was the one with the staticky TV with the volume turned down. But the VCR being on in the living room would suggest that Sherrill watched a movie that night.
the house had a strong smell of varnish because levitt had been varnishing a cabinet, and painting and decorating. levitt would have opened windows to let some air in. perp/prowler could have seen her reading in bed, then it went from there.
 
  • #812
Can anyone confirm the screen was actually off Sherrill's window when police arrived? I'm seeing this in the review of case thread, I couldn't believe my eyes.

It was off when they came, seriously? I find that difficult to believe, but...?? Trying to confirm. And just updating real quick, I'm already seeing conflicting information about this on sources.

I find it hard to believe, and I'm sure others do as well, but I don't necessarily think that means it didn't happen anyway. But maybe this piece of information has been updated in that LE actually removed the screen to dust for prints? Just going to assume that's the case unless someone knows otherwise.
 
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  • #813
Can anyone confirm the screen was actually off Sherrill's window when police arrived? I'm seeing this in the review of case thread, I couldn't believe my eyes.

It was off when they came, seriously? I find that difficult to believe, but...?? Trying to confirm. And just updating real quick, I'm already seeing conflicting information about this on sources.

I find it hard to believe, and I'm sure others do as well, but I don't necessarily think that means it didn't happen anyway. But maybe this piece of information has been updated in that LE actually removed the screen to dust for prints? Just going to assume that's the case unless someone knows otherwise.
levitt had her window open that night.
 

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