Missouri - The Springfield Three--missing since June 1992 - #9

[SpringfieldMan341]

Police said Riedel was out of town on the night this crime occurred. And Recla didn't skip town. Only Clay skipped town shortly after the crime occurred. Lets please keep the known facts of this case accurate.

Show me where it says Riedel was out of town.

Exact source please. He skipped town AFTER the 7th, not before.

 

[SpringfieldMan341]

In chaos theory, the butterfly effect is the phenomenon whereby a small change in a complex system can have large effects elsewhere.

Suzie's forthcoming testimony might immediately have affected only the graverobbers but its effect might also have reverberated upward, to those seemingly removed from the facts of the case being tried.

Yes!! agree with this post.

I do not think the grave robbers planned this.

But something that trickled upward set it into motion..?

 

[Scooby Doo 4U]

Show me where it says Riedel was out of town.

Exact source please. He skipped town AFTER the 7th, not before.

Show me one source that says that Recla skipped town to Colorado as you claimed, as opposed to moving there much later, as he did.

 

[Missouri Mule]

So you would have Steven Garrison, the multi-time convicted felon and Rapist, who held his victim at knife point for over three hours while he raped her repeatedly, "In your house, and found him very cordial". Seriously????

Yes.

 

[SpringfieldMan341]

Show me one source that says that Recla skipped town to Colorado as you claimed, as opposed to moving there much later, as he did.

I already provided that for you. Read back a few pages.

Not everything is in the papers. you need intel from other places sometimes.

 

[MooseMeMuch]

I still think Janelle and Mike were delaying that day for whatever reason.

That explains why they didn’t call Mrs McCall as she would of called the cops a lot sooner if she had known what had been left behind.

Logically speaking Mrs McCall should of been called as soon as Janelle couldn’t find them that morning.

If the house did look staged then only Janelle and Mike could of realistically of staged it and they had so many hours unaccounted for as well.

\

Amen......thank you. J and M had all day to call Stacy's parent's.
All day.
IMO they did not want to. If they had wanted to, they would have found a way.

 

[SpringfieldMan341]

Joseph Riedel was in fact in town.

NL, Missing, Day 24:

"The 21 year old man, Joseph Riedel, is jailed in Illinois awaiting extradition to Springfield on a fugitive warrant for institutional vandalism. The fugitive was believed to be in town when the three disappeared from Levitt's home. The fugitive is held in Lake County,IL jail on a fugitive bond of $100,000. He was arrested in Mundlein, IL, about 50 miles north of Chicago. Officials would not say if he lives there, nor would they explain the $100,000 bond. A June 22 Greene County warrant placed a $10,000 bond on him for the vandalism charge."

 

[Whiskers16]

Discussing information posted on other forums is not allowed unless it's the account of an LE/MSM entity and a link is provided.

 

[Scooby Doo 4U]

Here's something interesting I found in the article that MMM posted earlier. It's a direct quote from Kathy Kirby. I touched on her apparent annoyed attitude in the article, but just caught this issue,
"If she wanted to get a hold of her daughter, she knew exactly where to call, said Kathy Kirby, the mother of one of Streeter's and McCalls friends. "Our phone did not ring one time. I don't want to call anyone a liar, but to me it's just very strange that she did not call us, when we had told her to call us if she needed to get a hold of Susie".

Ok, so with that said, number one, why would Sherrill have had any reason to call Kathy Kirby's house that night, the girls weren't even suppose to be there other than to meet up with Janelle and go to the parties then to Branson?

Number two, the girls plans to stay at the Kirby residence didn't occur until around 10:30pm or so when Stacy called her mother and said they had decided not to go to Branson that night, and were going to stay at the Kirby residence instead, but there is no report of Susie calling Sherrill and letting her know this change of plans.

They had no plans to stay there that night, and were planning to go to Branson, so why would Kathy Kirby have said that Sherrill knew exactly where to call to find her daughter?

Add in her needless defensive response, as well as her saying that she heard the girls leave her house that night at 2:15am, something that would have provided a perfect alibi for her daughter, and it raises yet another red flag regarding the statements of Kathy Kirby. Don't you think?

 

[SpringfieldMan341]

Discussing information posted on other forums is not allowed unless it's the account of an LE/MSM entity and a link is provided.

I get this, and I don't own the forum.

But if the answers were in only newspaper articles, this would have been solved a long time ago. The papers actually got a lot wrong with the actual facts of the case, for what it's worth. That's been proven.

 

[chestnut&bypass]

Here's something interesting I found in the article that MMM posted earlier. It's a direct quote from Kathy Kirby. I touched on her apparent annoyed attitude in the article, but just caught this issue,
"If she wanted to get a hold of her daughter, she knew exactly where to call, said Kathy Kirby, the mother of one of Streeter's and McCalls friends. "Our phone did not ring one time. I don't want to call anyone a liar, but to me it's just very strange that she did not call us, when we had told her to call us if she needed to get a hold of Susie".

Ok, so with that said, number one, why would Sherrill have had any reason to call Kathy Kirby's house that night, the girls weren't even suppose to be there other than to meet up with Janelle and go to the parties then to Branson?

Number two, the girls plans to stay at the Kirby residence didn't occur until around 10:30pm or so when Stacy called her mother and said they had decided not to go to Branson that night, and were going to stay at the Kirby residence instead, but there is no report of Susie calling Sherrill and letting her know this change of plans.

They had no plans to stay there that night, and were planning to go to Branson, so why would Kathy Kirby have said that Sherrill knew exactly where to call to find her daughter?

Add in her needless defensive response, as well as her saying that she heard the girls leave her house that night at 2:15am, something that would have provided a perfect alibi for her daughter, and it raises yet another red flag regarding the statements of Kathy Kirby. Don't you think?

Yeah, I agree with you Scoob. This just don't make sense....

 

[SpringfieldMan341]

Fact: Darrell Moore (ex DA in Springfield) said some detectives feel the grave robbers should not have been cleared (Crime Watch Daily episode and SPD 25 anniversary)

Fact: All 3 Grave Robbers left Springfield area just after the crime

Fact: Several detectives thought the grave robbing angle made the most sense

Fact: Steve Garrison has sufficient ties to the grave robbers.

Fact: Steve Garrison (and two others) were summoned to the only grand jury hearing on this case

Fact: Mike Clay did not have nice things to say about the women (b*tches are dead comment)

Fact: Dusty's girlfriend at the time, J W, lived with Steve Garrison because her mom dated him. She was also called to the GJ

Where there's smoke. There's fire.

 

[MooseMeMuch]

You may claim it’s silly to place blame on them but a lot of posters don’t.

Their actions don’t add up at that day and yes somebody had to find the crime scene that day but highly suspicious Janelle was the last known person to see them and also the first one on the scene. Then she contaminated said crime scene and acted like nothing was amiss when clearly something was obviously amiss with 3 cars and all personal items still inside.

I don’t care if it was 1992 or 2918 their actions defy logic that day.

We're all in separate camps on this case, definitely keeps it lively and informative.

I agree, 'their actions don't add up'. As Kelly Seigler (Cold Justice) often says when comparing actions and explanations of people close to the victim(s)."That makes no sense."

Too many inconsistencies to ignore or excuse away.
Of the GR trio...it sounds like Clay would be the closest to being a 'suspect' with his mother dating Garrison.

 

[Scooby Doo 4U]

Fact: Darrell Moore (ex DA in Springfield) said some detectives feel the grave robbers should not have been cleared (Crime Watch Daily episode and SPD 25 anniversary)

Fact: All 3 Grave Robbers left Springfield area just after the crime

Fact: Several detectives thought the grave robbing angle made the most sense

Fact: Steve Garrison has sufficient ties to the grave robbers.

Fact: Steve Garrison (and two others) were summoned to the only grand jury hearing on this case

Fact: Mike Clay did not have nice things to say about the women (b*tches are dead comment)

Fact: Dusty's girlfriend at the time, J W, lived with Steve Garrison because her mom dated him. She was also called to the GJ

Where there's smoke. There's fire.

Post your sources or you can not call these facts. Only speculations. And "Crime Watch Daily" is not a definitive source. Many different media outlets have made many different claims regarding this case. They have mixed up known facts, misstated and misqouted things regarding this case many times. It even happened between several different media outlets in the early days of the crime. One said one thing, and another misstated or misquoted what the other had said.
I'm sorry but Facts are Facts, and Speculation is just that, Speculation. And what you have in most of what you've posted is Speculation, not known Fact. Not bickering, just trying to keep things fare and accurate, and not muddy up this case any worse than it already is with conjecture.

 

[Scooby Doo 4U]

We're all in separate camps on this case, definitely keeps it lively and informative.

I agree, 'their actions don't add up'. As Kelly Seigler (Cold Justice) often says when comparing actions and explanations of people close to the victim(s)."That makes no sense."

Too many inconsistencies to ignore or excuse away.
Of the GR trio...it sounds like Clay would be the closest to being a 'suspect' with his mother dating Garrison.

Wait what? I've never heard that Clay's mother was dating Garrison? I have heard that J.W.'s mother was dating Garrison, but not the J.W.'s mother was Clay's mother as well?

Was this true? I know Clay and his sister lived together in an apartment close to where Dusty Recla lived, when the crime was committed, but have never heard anything regarding who his mother was. I don't know everything about this case by any stretch of the imagination I will readily admit. Help me clarify this issue.

 

[SpringfieldMan341]

JW’s mom dated Garrison. Not JR. not Clay’s

Scooby I gave you Newsleader article on Riedel being in town.

There’s something to the GRs and Garrison. No speculation. Speculation is running wild with theories about Janelle and driving cars back and saying Levitt caught mid transit and murdered along with vacuuming fibers and staging a crime scene. That’s wild speculation. Might as well say aliens did it.

I’m dealing in facts.

 

[Scooby Doo 4U]

The one thing I will say is this, I don't think Michael Clay committed this crime. No "Sane Person" that was just part of a triple abduction and presumed triple homicides, would have ever made the excited utterance to the detective of, "I hope those B's are dead". He would have to have been off he ever loving rocker to have made that statement if he was directly involved.

But I also find it weird that Mike Recla, Dustins brother is being a lookie loo at the crime scene in the days following its discovery, with a crowd of other people and makes the statement of, "I hope they find out who did this before someone ends up hurt/dead (I can't remember if he said hurt or dead). But regardless, he makes the statement, in my humble opinion, like he either knows or has some knowledge of what happened to them.

Do I think Clay may have been on the outskirts of this crime. Yes it is a distinct possibility. But only a complete nutbag crazy person with no brain, would ever make the statement that he did to the detective, if he had actually committed the crime "First Hand".

 

[SpringfieldMan341]

The one thing I will say is this, I don't think Michael Clay committed this crime. No "Sane Person" that was just part of a triple abduction and presumed triple homicides, would have ever made the excited utterance to the detective of, "I hope those B's are dead". He would have to have been off he ever loving rocker to have made that statement if he was directly involved.

But I also find it weird that Mike Recla, Dustins brother is being a lookie loo at the crime scene in the days following its discovery, with a crowd of other people and makes the statement of, "I hope they find out who did this before someone ends up hurt/dead (I can't remember if he said hurt or dead). But regardless, he makes the statement, in my humble opinion, like he either knows or has some knowledge of what happened to them.

Do I think Clay may have been on the outskirts of this crime. Yes it is a distinct possibility. But only a complete nutbag crazy person with no brain, would ever make the statement that he did to the detective, if he had actually committed the crime "First Hand".

You’re missing a GR. There were 3.

Clay and Recla were at a concert....

Riedel was....?

And you’re thinking of Johnny. There is no Mike Recla. You keep preaching about sticking to the facts but there’s >10 facts you’ve been wrong about..........

Johnny Recla also friends with Henson.

 

[Scooby Doo 4U]

JW’s mom dated Garrison. Not JR. not Clay’s

Scooby I gave you Newsleader article on Riedel being in town.

There’s something to the GRs and Garrison. No speculation. Speculation is running wild with theories about Janelle and driving cars back and saying Levitt caught mid transit and murdered along with vacuuming fibers and staging a crime scene. That’s wild speculation. Might as well say aliens did it.

I’m dealing in facts.

Yes thank you, J.W. not J.R. Thanks for catching my mistake there. I was thinking how it sounded in my head and typed it wrong. Thanks for correcting that for me.
Well you got the whole J.W. and Garrison dating her mother issue from R.S., and he was a self admitted junkie at the time. Who said Sherrill was caught in mid-transit. She went out looking for her daughter according to some accounts. No one knows what happened from there, regardless of whether her car was found under the carport the next day. It was said that it was pulled much further forward than she normally parked it (Springfield News-Leader).
Not sure what you mean about vacuuming fibers? They vacuumed for fiber forensic evidence when the police processed the house, but other than that, I'm not sure what you're getting at.

 

[Scooby Doo 4U]

You’re missing a GR. There were 3.

Clay and Recla were at a concert....

Riedel was....?

And you’re thinking of Johnny. There is no Mike Recla. You keep preaching about sticking to the facts but there’s >10 facts you’ve been wrong about..........

Johnny Recla also friends with Henson.

Yes Johnny, sorry, it's getting late, you are most certainly correct. At least I'm contrite when I make mistakes. But your >10 facts statistic is way off. I only misquoted two things tonight. And only because its 1am and I'm tired. But I'm not posting things as Fact and calling them Fact without any supporting references either. So who's really to say what is Fact and What's not, or what I was wrong about and what I wasn't. Until I see otherwise, I'm going to have to classify it as unfounded speculation, but not fact. Some of what you've posted that is. Don't get me wrong, I think you're on the right track, and have always had the GR's at the top of my list as the catalyst at the very least, that put this ball into motion. I may be wrong. And if so I'll be the first to be contrite. But I'm going to continue to investigate the known facts, and speculate things that are speculative, but not call them facts, until I can prove them as such.