Mitigating Factor: Casey's Parents

[Leila]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned but I'm having a difficult time keeping up with watching the jury selection and this forum...
As it appears now, the defense is going to use George & Cindy as mitigating factors in Casey's sentencing - yet IF Casey is sentenced to death, it is the family who is called upon FIRST & FOREMOST by the defense to plead to spare their loved ones life before the judge. This is going to get extremely interesting...

This is a unique situation in which the grandparents are family to both the victim and the defendant.

Often, the prosecution will ask the family of the victim what their wishes are when it comes to punishment of the defendant.

 

[allycat1208]

I believe that the only mitigating circumstance that should influence the penalty phase would be if the defendant is brain-damaged, mentally retarded, has an extremely low i.q. or has been severely physically and mentally abused their whole life. I do not think that CA and GA were so severely dysfunctional to have caused KC's actions either. While they may have been lacking in judgement, that is no reason to blame them for KC's behavior. If Lee or George is accused of sexual abuse it would be extremely hard to believe it and even if it was true, I don't think KC deserves a more lenient sentence. Many people have been sexually abused and do not go out and kill people. Many people come from dysfunctional families and most of them don't kill their babies. It seems like sexual abuse or mental abuse has been used to get criminals lenient sentences all the time and I don't buy it. You are still responsible for your actions especially in regards for harming or murdering another individual.

What I don't understand is if KC is claiming she's not guilty anyway, why bring all this possible talk of child abuse and judging from the questions addressed by the defense teams to the potential jurors, it seams like they may do this. I would think the defense team should lead us to the actual murderer, Zanny or whomever instead of trying to paint a better KC.

Personally, I feel sorry for George and Cindy. I've read their depositions and while they seem extremely combative, (especially the deposition for the civil case of Zenaida Gonzales) I cannot judge them so harshly as it relates to what they have been through. I think all they are guilty of is not wanting to believe that KC is a murderer and changing their statements a bit to defend her. I think its too difficult for parents to believe their children are murderers. Lots or parents condone their children's behavior for much less serious offenses, so how can you convince them to believe their child is a murderer? If anything, KC has damaged her family.

 

[darnudes]

Using ICA as a decoy? That is a very interesting and strange thing to say. It makes it sound like they pimped her out! Maybe they will claim ICA was set up to have a baby for Cindy. Then Cindy expected her to be responsible to care for the child. Or maybe Ha used her as a way to meet women? Bizarre statement!

I thought the word "decoy" was odd too until just now reading it again -

"she was used as a decoy or pawn by her parents and a scapegoat for parental misconduct"

I think what is being intimated here is that there was a lot of parental misconduct ie. affairs, gambling, Nigerian money scams, sudden occupational changes, relocation of family etc. Now as an attempt for one parent or another to escape responsibility for that "parental misconduct" they used ICA as a decoy or pawn. Look at one of the definitions for decoy and you'll find this at Merriam Webster -

someone or something used to draw attention away from another

So, reading into things, it could go like this -

Poor ICA was surrounded by parents who were involved in some very questionable behaviour and in an attempt to continue that behaviour or not be found out or evade responsibility our client was used as a decoy, pawn or scapegoat, to throw suspicion off either of the parents and onto our client.

It's quite simple really and it's also quite brilliant because the Anthonys are not going to come over well to a jury in my opinion.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

However I feel about this tactic, I'm not going to pretend I'm not going to get some level of sick enjoyment out of watching ALL their dirty laundry being aired in public by the defense.

No wonder Casey hasn't wanted to see them, respond to their letters or look their way in court.

 

[zoey]

:banghead:

I think the DT might try to also say it wasn't ICA who took all the money, but she took all the blame. There have been discussions here about where ICA spent 45K. And then there was that strange deposit incident. It involved a car that was sold didn't it? I almost wondered whether one of the parents said don't deposit, say you did and we'll split it.

As dysfunctional as the family has behaved, I could believe alot of what will be claimed. At the same time ICA is such a liar it could all be made up. Either way, IMO, it's no excuse. Sure is interesting though.

Or suspicious............

Heck I'm still trying to figure out why jb would ask about the lying....considering who he represents...:banghead:

 

[zoey]

I thought the word "decoy" was odd too until just now reading it again -

"she was used as a decoy or pawn by her parents and a scapegoat for parental misconduct"

I think what is being intimated here is that there was a lot of parental misconduct ie. affairs, gambling, Nigerian money scams, sudden occupational changes, relocation of family etc. Now as an attempt for one parent or another to escape responsibility for that "parental misconduct" they used ICA as a decoy or pawn. Look at one of the definitions for decoy and you'll find this at Merriam Webster -

someone or something used to draw attention away from another

So, reading into things, it could go like this -

Poor ICA was surrounded by parents who were involved in some very questionable behaviour and in an attempt to continue that behaviour or not be found out or evade responsibility our client was used as a decoy, pawn or scapegoat, to throw suspicion off either of the parents and onto our client.

It's quite simple really and it's also quite brilliant because the Anthonys are not going to come over well to a jury in my opinion.

Sooooooo I'm thinking the real "decoy" was Caylee --- the others not so much..I don't think its a brilliant because it is an overused excuse, imo in crimes....still does't justifiy the death of a two year old...

If that house was that bad----why didn't she move out? She was old enough--get a job, save money----move along.....and if your parents are all that bad you don't leave your child with them...

 

[21merc7]

:banghead:

Or suspicious............

Heck I'm still trying to figure out why jb would ask about the lying....considering who he represents...:banghead:

Because of KC's lies to Yuri, the officers that took her to Universal to find her office, the script from the kidnappers, who knows what other lies, and b.c the State will make a big deal out of them, more so now that the DT is going for diminished capacity, and she is actually charged with it.

 

[darnudes]

Sooooooo I'm thinking the real "decoy" was Caylee --- the others not so much..I don't think its a brilliant because it is an overused excuse, imo in crimes....still does't justifiy the death of a two year old...

If that house was that bad----why didn't she move out? She was old enough--get a job, save money----move along.....and if your parents are all that bad you don't leave your child with them...

Of course it doesn't justify the death of Caylee - that's not what I'm saying, I'm also not saying it will work, but when you consider what Jeannie Barrett had to work with, it's a stroke of genius.

I think it's brilliant because -

1. I've not heard of this being used as a mitigation factor before, I'm sure it has been but I don't know about it, so it's somewhat new or novel and maybe a jury will go for it
2. Because the Anthonys are who they are and they won't be able to help showing the jury who they are - and that's the really brilliant part.

You have to factor in the makeup and behavioural aspects of the Anthony clan also added to this is that ICA probably does know some dirty little secrets, that have nothing to do with the murder and disposal of Caylee, but may have everything to do with Mason's comments about "liars and hypocrites" and how much he will enjoy exposing them.

In my mind I've pretty much nixed the idea that the "liars and hypocrites" quote by Mason was targeted at LE. I don't believe they will use that tact and LDB put the Kibosh on it at one of the hearings last month, IIRC (I think she may have meant it for everyone but specifically for LE). No, I think the defenseless ones in this scenario are the Anthony family and Mason is going to go for the jugular. I also think that Baez will not be involved in questioning of the Anthony family so that he can later claim "what could I do? it was all Mason's idea". In my opinion Baez is a bully and a coward and I don't see him being able to look the Anthony family in the face as he is destroying them, Mason wouldn't have a problem with this as he's had no personal relationship with them at all.

 

[Mysteeri]

However I feel about this tactic, I'm not going to pretend I'm not going to get some level of sick enjoyment out of watching ALL their dirty laundry being aired in public by the defense.

No wonder Casey hasn't wanted to see them, respond to their letters or look their way in court.

After Caylees body was found she had no use for them, now it`s better to make them look bad and shift the blame.

:twocents:

Edit. I mean seeing them would be just a huge waste.

 

[lowens1975]

Yowza. Ain't THAT something?!

I really have to wonder whether the Anthonys knew for a fact this was coming, or not. I mean, clearly it's been speculation for a good long time now, but to have it out there now, today, well I just have to wonder if it's as much a kaboom shock to them as it is to us.

The only thing I can come up with for Ann F.'s theory about how KC was used as a decoy or scapegoat is if KC was taking the rap for one of her parents stealing money from the other parent.

It is pretty clear from Cindy's July Myspace post that Cindy thinks SHE is the martyred one. Since the purpose of Cindy's Myspace post was to manipulate ICA with guilt, I believe Cindy thought ICA took her money.

It is strange that IF George was really the one stealing Cindy's money, he always took the exact amount needed to pay ICA's cell phone bill--according to Cindy's financial records and ICA's cell phone payment records.

This is what I got out of the 'mitigating' circumstances. That George used Cindy's finances or credit, lost the money somehow and then blamed it on Casey. Is it GA and CA lying and covering up about what happened or the defense twisting the circumstances to suit their client?

 

[Kentjbkent]

This is LENGTHY reading, but VERY INTERESTING just the same...

Maybe bookmark for reading during those long court breaks!

Summaries of Successful Ineffective Assistance of Counsel Claims

POST-Wiggins v. Smith Involving Capital Sentencing Phase Errors

Abuse, Sexual Abuse, Dysfunctional Family


http://www.caught.net/caught/Capital Sentencing Errors Post-Wiggins.pdf

 

[iluvmua]

I think just Lee will be accused of the sexual abuse, and CA and GA will be accused of ignoring it/dismissing it, which to be honest, I'm inclined to listen to the supposed proof, because this family is so dysfunctional that, imo, I can see a scenario like that happening.

However, I'm not the type who would spare KC the death penalty because of past trauma.

Exactly! to me this is all about getting justice for a little girl who was brutally killed at the hands of her own mother.

 

[iluvmua]

I don't believe that Cindy and George's behavior will provide any chance of Casey getting out of a guilty verdict, but during the sentencing phase, their behavior, could be used to lessen her punishment. I think back on the many interviews done by Cindy and George, and can not forget how infuriated I became with these people. It's sad to say, but there were times I debated over who I was more mad at, them or Casey. Casey will be held responsible for this crime, I feel sure...but if a jury reacts to Cindy and George like many of us have, in the sentencing phase, I worry that may be Casey's ticket out of the Death Penalty.

Not if Judge Perry hands it to her. He's the one who decides between Life & Death.

 

[lowens1975]

I believe that the only mitigating circumstance that should influence the penalty phase would be if the defendant is brain-damaged, mentally retarded, has an extremely low i.q. or has been severely physically and mentally abused their whole life.

Respectfully sniped and BBM

Guessing here, but while other 'mitigating circumstances' have been mentioned in open court, this one has not. When discussing mental health as being a issue at the end of a hearing, the words 'diminished capacity' was overhead, being denied by the defense as being the correct term. It would make sense from a defense standpoint, Cindy has made declarations that Casey had to have 'help' indicating that ICA wasn't smart enough to carry out killing her own child and disposing of her body. The defense could claim that she was 'borderline' in her mental capacity.

 

[Tiki]

Respectfully sniped and BBM

Guessing here, but while other 'mitigating circumstances' have been mentioned in open court, this one has not. When discussing mental health as being a issue at the end of a hearing, the words 'diminished capacity' was overhead, being denied by the defense as being the correct term. It would make sense from a defense standpoint, Cindy has made declarations that Casey had to have 'help' indicating that ICA wasn't smart enough to carry out killing her own child and disposing of her body. The defense could claim that she was 'borderline' in her mental capacity.

But at the same time, they are saying she was a very good student and got above average grades. That just doesn't work for me.
jmo

 

[lowens1975]

But at the same time, they are saying she was a very good student and got above average grades. That just doesn't work for me.
jmo

Thanks, I hadn't heard that about the "above average grades".

 

[Ricki]

But at the same time, they are saying she was a very good student and got above average grades. That just doesn't work for me.
jmo

Correct me if I am wrong. I thought I read KC did not graduate.

 

[kathryann]

While listening to the "mitigating factors" statement yesterday I wondered if somehow the "biological father" of Caylee has something to do with the reported sex abuse. I've always been curious as to why this person has never been named, or never paid support for Caylee. I would think the way the Anthony's are they would have demanded support from him. The sexual abuse, although she referred to it with LA and GA, maybe has to do with someone other than just a family member. If this has been brought up before let me know. I don't say that this is any excuse for hurting a little girl, I just wonder if this may be the sexual abuse she is talking about.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

I'm hoping common sense will prevail and those jurors will see it for what it is...

Many come from dysfunctional families and many have not killed their child.

Is the DT saying due to her immaturity she has no common sense?

Is the DT saying due to her immaturity, she has no logic?

Is the DT saying due to immaturity she had poor impulse control?

Is the DT saying due to her immaturity, she can't tell right from wrong?

The DT has alluded to an awful accident, (much like GA telling RC, it was an accident that snowballed)...but one call to 911 and ICA might not have faced any charges, depending on how Caylee's accident would have occured..but instead ICA comes up with this elaborate plan of an alleged kidnapping or this nanny who doesn't exist, absconded with Caylee..ICA in order to make it appear more realistic, places duct tape over Caylee's airways, puts her in the trunk until she triple bagged her and dumped her in a watery swamp, just 1/4 mile from where they resided...allowed LE to go on a wild goose chase as her parents try to derail LE investigation throwing all innocent people out there as someone who 'could' have done this to Caylee...this family along with ICA allowed 4,000 volunteers to try and find a missing child, accepting donations while the entire time, ICA said nothing and offered no help...absurd...

I'm sure a jury will see it for what it truly was, once this relationship between mother and child is told by the SA's, contentious relationship and ICA held massive contempt for CA, mostly...they will lay it out as it happened in those jailhouse visitis..ICA has no fear of CA or GA...telling them to off...:banghead: She also said to CA that she chose to speak with dad because he doesn't interrogate me...as told in the jailhouse visit...so which is it? Was she that frightened of them or is it just a ploy to get off easier with LWOP vs death...this might come back to bite ICA harder than she's ever been bitten before...she had a choice..her choice was to take her rage/comtempt she held for her parents and take it out on Caylee?

It appears the DT is counting on a guilty verdict so this is all in an effort to save her from certain death, that's all it is..but common sense will prevail, the law will prevail and as long as ICA remains in prison for her own actions,or if she is sentenced to death, justice will be served to Caylee...JMHO

Justice for Caylee

 

[lowens1975]

While listening to the "mitigating factors" statement yesterday I wondered if somehow the "biological father" of Caylee has something to do with the reported sex abuse. I've always been curious as to why this person has never been named, or never paid support for Caylee. I would think the way the Anthony's are they would have demanded support from him. The sexual abuse, although she referred to it with LA and GA, maybe has to do with someone other than just a family member. If this has been brought up before let me know. I don't say that this is any excuse for hurting a little girl, I just wonder if this may be the sexual abuse she is talking about.

I have a feeling he's alive and well and probably right under our noses. :great: