MN - Jacob Wetterling, 11, St. Joseph, 22 Oct 1989 - #12

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  • #761
On occasion, Immelman brings the Wetterling case into the classroom. In past years around the time of the anniversary, he has taken his criminal psychology students to the site of the abduction. He parks his car next to the road, not quite on the person-of-interest’s driveway, and has his students move about 50 yards away and walk towards him while he stands in the road, as a type of reenactment.

“One time the moon wasn’t out,” Immelman said. “They almost walked right into me without seeing me, and never saw the car, which was two yards from road. There are not a lot of lights in the area and it was even darker then, when there were almost no houses.”

http://csbsjurecord.com/2014/10/jaco...5-years-later/
 
  • #762
Your suggestions and the links you provide are appreciated, I'm sure. Relax though. No reason to reprimand anyone. Sometimes sharing your thoughts and concerns, and having others input, is just as valuable as any google search.

People kept talking and talking about no information being available about Kevin's story. There is information if you take the time and look.
 
  • #763
On occasion, Immelman brings the Wetterling case into the classroom. In past years around the time of the anniversary, he has taken his criminal psychology students to the site of the abduction. He parks his car next to the road, not quite on the person-of-interest’s driveway, and has his students move about 50 yards away and walk towards him while he stands in the road, as a type of reenactment.

“One time the moon wasn’t out,” Immelman said. “They almost walked right into me without seeing me, and never saw the car, which was two yards from road. There are not a lot of lights in the area and it was even darker then, when there were almost no houses.”

http://csbsjurecord.com/2014/10/jaco...5-years-later/

I found this very interesting as well.
 
  • #764
On occasion, Immelman brings the Wetterling case into the classroom. In past years around the time of the anniversary, he has taken his criminal psychology students to the site of the abduction. He parks his car next to the road, not quite on the person-of-interest’s driveway, and has his students move about 50 yards away and walk towards him while he stands in the road, as a type of reenactment.

“One time the moon wasn’t out,” Immelman said. “They almost walked right into me without seeing me, and never saw the car, which was two yards from road. There are not a lot of lights in the area and it was even darker then, when there were almost no houses.”

http://csbsjurecord.com/2014/10/jaco...5-years-later/

I am curious then if they almost ran into him, how did the perp know it was safe haven to run where he told them to, and also being able to see it was only woods, which is at least 100 yards away.
 
  • #765
  • #766
I am curious then if they almost ran into him, how did the perp know it was safe haven to run where he told them to, and also being able to see it was only woods, which is at least 100 yards away.



"CASAREZ: To Pat Brown, where do you think the investigation needs to keep going at this point?

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Oh, I think, Jean, that they are going in the right direction. As I said before, I don`t believe this person had a vehicle because if he did, it would be much easier just to drive by and just grab one of them and keep going. He didn`t have to go through all that sticking them in a ditch stuff and don`t look back. I think he had his little own special ops thing going and his little fantasy.

He`s out there like in Vietnam doing special ops. He saw the boys coming by, said, here`s a good victim, he waited for them to return. He stood there. He got rid of the two of them because he couldn`t handle all three, brought one back to wherever, and kept them there for as long as he wanted to continue what he was doing, until perhaps, some other people would be around and would find him there. So, I think they`re looking exactly the right place. We don`t know if that man on the farm is guilty of anything, but it`s the top place to look."

This is from nmogren's link above.


http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../28/ng.01.html
 
  • #767
http://a.abcnews.com/images/US/abc_nwo_search4_100701_wn.jpg

Screenshot_2014-11-01-01-37-57.jpg
 
  • #768
Well thought out, Dave. I've always thought on the part about the cop who escorted the Wetterlings, that he was still waiting for the Wetterlings to arrive home when Kevin came up to his car. Because they had to drive a ways. (25 minutes - half hour at least to get back to St. Joe I think? Depending on traffic and how fast they were going.) But it could be that the new cop was abrupt with Kevin because his job was to watch for Wetterlings and escort them back to their home when they arrived. And he didn't want to miss them while this kid was trying to talk to him.

I would think the new cop knew about the bikes because the 911 operator told LE about the bikes and scooter and the location. IMO, that's why they wanted to escort Patty and Jerry home - so if on their way home, they saw the bikes in the ditch they wouldn't stop to look at all and possibly contaminate the scene.

So I don't think the new cop had already escorted them home and was just sitting there, I think he was still waiting for Wetterlings to arrive.

I've wondered if the medical cop in Tom Thumb couldn't have been Feeney, because he was in the area and with some folks out on Kiwi, but maybe once all the cop cars pulled in there he split and stopped at the store? He may have told Kevin he was a "medical cop" as a joke or something? I can't imagine Kevin would have made that up on his own.
 
  • #769
Kevin's girlfriends car was a tan / silver Grand Prix. It was that car that had the new tires on it. The car Rassier reported seeing was smaller, and dark in color. It's been reported that the car he saw did not match the description of the car that Kevin was driving, and I believe Rassier himself has said it was not Kevin that he saw.

Interestingly stated.
 
  • #770
So the 4 witnesses are all lying for him and have covered up for 25 years?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It is possible for both. The time he was known to have been in the driveway with 4 witnesses and one or more times when no one else knew. I don't discount anything, ever. Some things I file away as high probability and others as low probability, but all available to pull back out should I have a missing part of the puzzle.

"when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth"
 
  • #771
Who would agree at this point that either Kevin is slowly coming forward about this, or its DR and noone else? Are we down to it or is there a phantom.

I have an outlier theory that there are more than a couple of people coming forward a bit late, and others yet to come forward to give evidence as it would put them in the proximity of the crime and focus the LE spotlight on them. None of them were involved, yet they have seen all too many example of LE jamming innocent people up in a rush to find a perp. Also possible that they were out doing something they should not have been from a legal or moral position.
 
  • #772
How could Kevin have done this?


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Two points. Do you have enough information to conclusively eliminate him? If he is innocent of the abduction, do all the facts add up that he was where he said he was, when said he was and no other evidence points to him being at the abduction scene more than once, both after and before the abduction? Other than verbal, I have not seen anything physical.

Not saying you are incorrect, I am pulling at strings to see where they go.
 
  • #773
Do you think the guy in the Tom Thumb could have said he was 'medical corps'. A military bearing has been discussed before
 
  • #774
I have an outlier theory that there are more than a couple of people coming forward a bit late, and others yet to come forward to give evidence as it would put them in the proximity of the crime and focus the LE spotlight on them. None of them were involved, yet they have seen all too many example of LE jamming innocent people up in a rush to find a perp. Also possible that they were out doing something they should not have been from a legal or moral position.

Possibly people of age at the "party spot" nearby perhaps smoking pot or using other drugs or underage drinking who may have been a witness of some sort and "don't want to get involved?"

That certainly would be a dilemma but you figure someone would have passed anything critical to the case anonymously by now.
 
  • #775
Well thought out, Dave. I've always thought on the part about the cop who escorted the Wetterlings, that he was still waiting for the Wetterlings to arrive home when Kevin came up to his car. Because they had to drive a ways. (25 minutes - half hour at least to get back to St. Joe I think? Depending on traffic and how fast they were going.) But it could be that the new cop was abrupt with Kevin because his job was to watch for Wetterlings and escort them back to their home when they arrived. And he didn't want to miss them while this kid was trying to talk to him.

I would think the new cop knew about the bikes because the 911 operator told LE about the bikes and scooter and the location. IMO, that's why they wanted to escort Patty and Jerry home - so if on their way home, they saw the bikes in the ditch they wouldn't stop to look at all and possibly contaminate the scene.

So I don't think the new cop had already escorted them home and was just sitting there, I think he was still waiting for Wetterlings to arrive.

I've wondered if the medical cop in Tom Thumb couldn't have been Feeney, because he was in the area and with some folks out on Kiwi, but maybe once all the cop cars pulled in there he split and stopped at the store? He may have told Kevin he was a "medical cop" as a joke or something? I can't imagine Kevin would have made that up on his own.

Right! I think there are a couple of good explanations for that part; the 'new cop' by T Thumb's! Frankly, I hadn't given due consideration to what you mentioned about how he could have actually been there at that time, still waiting for the Wetterlings; in that, as you stated, it's an estimated 25 min drive, and even though they left immediately, give or take a minute or so.

I've been basically assuming from the reports I've read, that all the town's cop cars, including the new cop, headed off in the same direction; so, I assumed they all went straight to the Wetterling's; and actually if that had been the case, and then the 'new cop' was sent up to the area around the store; you'd expect that he moved quickly and had his lights on; which then makes you wonder, why Kevin didn't see him. It's hard to say.

Overall, because of the various things I mentioned, I just find it really hard to put into a realistic time frame, with the time allotted and all the variable factors that have to be considered. Frankly, like you said, the kids leaving their bikes, could well have been established over the phone or by radio, or whatever; for whatever reason, the way it's stated that he responded 'yeah, we know all about the bikes' whatever the exact quote; just sounds like it came from someone who had been to the crime scene; but, obviously not necessarily. He could have also been sent back to the area around the store, just to keep an eye out for any possible suspicious vehicles. In which case, it would make sense that he had no lights and the motor not running; also, in that case, or in either case; Kevin probably was bothering him; as Kevin stated, 'he acted like I was wasting his time,' or something like that.

Like I said, it's hard to spell out, but, reading, re-reading... the story and other material surrounding that aspect, I just keep getting a sense that it's somehow really hard to see how all the events happened concerning time and logistics.

I just wish we had some kind of a semi-comprehensive, accurate layout of the timeline from the police from that night, the first couple of hours. Seems, like there really may be something there that just never was uncovered or considered as significant. I mean, we only have so much to go by, and, even LE, only has so much to go by. The first 20 Minutes, first 30 minutes, first Hour, first Two Hours, first Three Hours.... I'd really like to be able to look at like a diagram, flowchart type of layout of the timeline, locations, activity....

I expect that it's just as likely as not that the 'medical cop' was Feeney. Apparently, he was a wannabe Cop, and had actually been a medic. Whether it was him or not, the quote 'medical cop' could have various meanings, certainly including the one you mention, just thinking he was funny. J123 has an interesting post #748 has some interesting speculation about the 'medical cop' quote; I quoted and commented on it, on post #749. Speculates that it could have been a slightly different statement that Kevin heard as "medical cop" - my guess was "I'm a Medic not a Cop" - with 'nota' being slightly slurred; I'm a Medic(nota) Cop. Thanks for the note....
 
  • #776
Do you think the guy in the Tom Thumb could have said he was 'medical corps'. A military bearing has been discussed before

That's not impossible! Not certain. Did you see J123's post #748; I threw my 2€ worth on #749. I've been somewhat thinking along the lines that the 'medical cop' may well have been Feeney, but, we really don't know. In which case, I don't believe that he had been in the military, unless possibly ROTC, I don't know, but, apparently, he was a wannabe Cop and had in fact been an EMT.
 
  • #777
I am curious then if they almost ran into him, how did the perp know it was safe haven to run where he told them to, and also being able to see it was only woods, which is at least 100 yards away.

Because he sat there in his car and had time to see the woods?
 
  • #778
That's not impossible! Not certain. Did you see J123's post #748; I threw my 2€ worth on #749. I've been somewhat thinking along the lines that the 'medical cop' may well have been Feeney, but, we really don't know. In which case, I don't believe that he had been in the military, unless possibly ROTC, I don't know, but, apparently, he was a wannabe Cop and had in fact been an EMT.

If Feeney is now the medical cop and also now the abductor, should LE have kevin look at a picture of Feeney and decide for sure?
 
  • #779
Has anyone created a list of ideas for what a "medical cop" could be? Can we ask this Kevin for more deets?
 
  • #780
Has anyone created a list of ideas for what a "medical cop" could be? Can we ask this Kevin for more deets?

I wonder if he said, I'm a Minnesota cop.
 
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