MN - Philando Castile, 32, shot by police officer, 6 July 2016 #1

[human]

Because our wheel is obviously quite different from yours...I am not going any further with this conversation. Abolishing police is a not something I would vote for and I would say the majority of Americans as well. So continue to pound on that point BLM and see how far you get.

Just a very quick google shows that American LE are interested in meeting with and having conferences with LE in other countries.

http://www.internationalpoliceconference.com

 

[galiuro]

So you feel putting LE in harm's way is the only solution to a traffic stop? No other ideas ?

its better than putting innocent civilians in harms way, no? which happens all the time in Chicago,Baltimore, any number of American cities. Cities already pretty much without cops, because they are pretty much outmanned and outgunned by their peaceful citizenry. You'll excuse me if i do not want that experiment turned loose on my neighborhood.

 

[Elley Mae]

So you feel putting LE in harm's way is the only solution to a traffic stop? No other ideas ?[/QUOTE]

bbm, Yeah, Tell the public to comply. It;s actually really easy, unless your guilty of something.jmo idk

 

[galiuro]

Just a very quick google shows that American LE are interested in meeting with and having conferences with LE in other countries.

http://www.internationalpoliceconference.com[/QUOTE

Sure and high on their agenda I am sure will be the abolishment of those very same police.

 

[Woodland]

Because our wheel is obviously quite different from yours...I am not going any further with this conversation. Abolishing police is a not something I would vote for and I would say the majority of Americans as well. So continue to pound on that point BLM and see how far you get.

UBM

Seems as though that thought will ensure things stay on the current path of destruction with no change in sight - how far will that get anyone? Or should things not change?

 

[galiuro]

UBM

Seems as though that thought will ensure things stay on the current path of destruction with no change in sight - how far will that get anyone? Or should things not change?

Things should change but it is not only the police who need to change.. are you going to bring criminals to this nice conference and get them to change their wheel?

 

[Woodland]

Things should change but it is not only the police who need to change.. are you going to bring criminals to this nice conference and get them to change their wheel?

There has been no mention that only the police should change. Sounds like a conference is a waste of time as all wheels seem stuck and spinning in one place.

 

[Only4Justice]

Absolutely disgusting. I don't even know what to say anymore. Nothing is going to change until responsible police officers start policing the sick police officers, and help change the culture of law enforcement. I lost a ton of respect for police when I saw the NYPD turn their backs on the mayor last year. It's getting harder every day to look at them as any more than badged t***s. Policing can be a dangerous occupation, and officers must understand that there are going to be instances when they are going to have to put their lives on the line. It's the nature of policing. That does not mean, however, that they can check their brains at the door and follow a shoot first policy because they are so fearful. That's what they're being paid for, to PROTECT and SERVE, NOT to be judge, jury and executioners.

Way behind on threads but [emoji1319][emoji1319][emoji1319][emoji1319][emoji1319][emoji1319].

 

[Damarna]

I watched this video right after it happened and it was unedited. There have been many of these police shootings caught on camera where I was able to understand why the cops may have done what they did. Not this one. I think this cop is in BIG trouble. 4 shots into a guy that was simply reaching for his wallet ?? I can understand shots being fired when an officer is actually physically fighting with a person in hand to hand combat, but not in a case like this where the motorist is sitting still and simply following orders as he was directed.

Now, to play devils advocate. It's possible that when the officer asked him to get his license and registration out, the victim mumbled something about having a concealed carry permit or possibly said it incoherently and the officer didn't actually hear what he said. When the victim twisted around to get his wallet, the officer was able to see the butt of his pistol, and that's what set everything into motion. Normally, when it is made aware to an officer that a person has a weapon in the car, legally or not, there is a certain protocol that goes into affect until the weapon is located and secured. Asking for the guys license and registration would have been the last thing on the list if the officer had known he was armed.

I'll bet this is going to boil down to the officer involved claiming that yes, the victim did say something to him, but he didn't understand what he said. When the victim twisted around in his seat, not only was the pistol visible but he was apparently reaching towards it as well, that's when all hell broke loose.

If what the victim said was clear and concise, then this appears to be a trigger happy cop that is pretty much afraid of his own shadow.

Thank You!!

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[Damarna]

I personally do not thing LE should be providing security at any sporting events, unless they are off the clock, being paid by the teams, arena, etc.
Professional/college sports are money making machines, and tax payers should not be footing the bill.
Sorry, big off topic.

Just an FYI - per the article linked at http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2016/...-of-lynx-game-over-black-lives-matter-shirts/


"MINNEAPOLIS (WCCO) — Four off-duty Minneapolis police officers working security at a Minnesota Lynx game walked off the job Saturday night in a protest."

IIRC the team does pay them for their service - not the tax payers.

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[B in TN]

For the poster that is a police officer: Thank you for your service. I appreciate you.

 

[human]

its better than putting innocent civilians in harms way, no? which happens all the time in Chicago,Baltimore, any number of American cities. Cities already pretty much without cops, because they are pretty much outmanned and outgunned by their peaceful citizenry. You'll excuse me if i do not want that experiment turned loose on my neighborhood.

Are you black and live in one of these neighborhoods? If not, then why does it matter if a new method of dealing with issues is tried.? Or do you go to these neighborhoods and are worried?

 

[human]

From the 15 things that has a link posted above. Is there something wrong with this idea?

Stop criminalizing everything.
You may have gotten the impression that everything is a crime these days. That's because it probably is.

The state of California, for instance, has created 1,000 new crimes in the past 25 years, while Michigan currently has 3,102 crimes on the books. New York City alone has 10,000 crimes, rules and codes the police can enforce. In many cities these crimes include innocuous activities like being in a park after hours, drinking alcohol in public, panhandling, spitting and sleeping on the subway. Some cities have even criminalized the wearing of saggy pants (true story).

This is absurd. None of these should warrant criminal punishment. The report estimates that police officers spend 90% of their time dealing with minor infractions like these and just 10% on violent crimes, resulting in a system where people of color are disproportionately summoned to court for low-level offenses — 80% of these summonses are for blacks and Latinos, to be specific.

The solution? The reports says to push police departments and district attorneys to de-prioritize enforcing and prosecuting low-level offenses. Change city charters to limit the health, park, tax and administrative offenses that police are responsible for enforcing. Reclassify misdemeanors as civil infractions, whenever possible.

 

[human]

How about this? Bad idea? From the 15 things
L4. Treat addicts and mentally ill people like they need help, not jail.
Jail is not a "one size fits all" prescription. Some issues — like acting erratically due to mental illness or possessing and using drugs due to addiction — are actually better served by medical attention, not incarceration.

The report suggests training law enforcement officials to address these issues at their discretion, with the aim of guiding addicts and people who live with mental illness into treatment programs instead of jail. Legislators should be involved only minimally, mostly to provide funding. Also train police to better identify and confront these problems using de-escalation tactics, and keep track of results through frequent data collection and analysis.

 

[human]

How about this from the 15 things?

10. Body cameras.
Body cameras have made their name as an almost knee-jerk reaction to every instance of police abuse over the past year. "Body cameras!" politicians demand, as though advocating for them suggested any kind of long term commitment to fighting misconduct.

Body cameras are far from the solution. But they can be important and helpful, especially when the local community supports their use, guided by clear regulations. There should be clear rules for when these cameras must be activated, the report says. If there's a case where they should have been used but have not been, there should be a presumption of police misconduct. Body cameras should be earmarked by states or localities, not as part of local police budgets.

Clear measures should be established to allow citizens to access this footage, in addition to protecting and validating their own right to film police.

 

[human]

How about this from the 15 things?

police to be members of the community, not just armed patrolmen.
Police are trained to handle some rough situations: people with guns, people with knives, car chases, foot pursuits. The Washington Post writes that new recruits usually spend about 60 hours learning how to handle a gun. It's all very tactical. But guess how much time they spend learning how to de-escalate tense situations, or properly handle the mentally ill? Eight hours apiece, according to the Police Executive Research Forum.

This is a problem. Police should be trained on how to develop better relationships with their communities. This training should incorporate culture, diversity, mental illness training, youth development, bias and racism.

The report recommends that recruits should be thoroughly and professionally trained on procedural bias and fairness, implicit bias, institutional bias, relationship-based and community interaction, crisis intervention, mediation, conflict resolution, appropriate engagement with youth based on science of adolescent brain development, de-escalation and minimizing use of force, coping with mental ill individuals, increasing language proficiency and cultural competency, appropriate engagement with LGBTQ, trans and gender-nonconforming people and documenting, preventing and addressing sexual harassment, abuse and assault.

 

[Gardenista]

I watched this video right after it happened and it was unedited. There have been many of these police shootings caught on camera where I was able to understand why the cops may have done what they did. Not this one. I think this cop is in BIG trouble. 4 shots into a guy that was simply reaching for his wallet ?? I can understand shots being fired when an officer is actually physically fighting with a person in hand to hand combat, but not in a case like this where the motorist is sitting still and simply following orders as he was directed.

Now, to play devils advocate. It's possible that when the officer asked him to get his license and registration out, the victim mumbled something about having a concealed carry permit or possibly said it incoherently and the officer didn't actually hear what he said. When the victim twisted around to get his wallet, the officer was able to see the butt of his pistol, and that's what set everything into motion. Normally, when it is made aware to an officer that a person has a weapon in the car, legally or not, there is a certain protocol that goes into affect until the weapon is located and secured. Asking for the guys license and registration would have been the last thing on the list if the officer had known he was armed.

I'll bet this is going to boil down to the officer involved claiming that yes, the victim did say something to him, but he didn't understand what he said. When the victim twisted around in his seat, not only was the pistol visible but he was apparently reaching towards it as well, that's when all hell broke loose.

If what the victim said was clear and concise, then this appears to be a trigger happy cop that is pretty much afraid of his own shadow.

During her live streaming, she told us he moved after the police officer told him not to. At 6:50

[video=youtube;Z7h2j0n18jg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7h2j0n18jg[/video]

 

[human]

Mentally ill in prisons

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-in-prisons-instead-of-psychiatric-hospitals/

For various reasons, these community treatment plans proved inadequate, leaving many of the mentally ill homeless or in jail. According to the Department of Justice, about 15 percent of state prisoners and 24 percent of jail inmates report symptoms meet the criteria for a psychotic disorder.

 

[galiuro]

Are you black and live in one of these neighborhoods? If not, then why does it matter if a new method of dealing with issues is tried.? Or do you go to these neighborhoods and are worried?

i live on the edge of a neighborhood that is high crime. It is not Chicago no, but it is high crime and I most definitely want a police officer around, thank you very much. So please try your little experiments somewhere not close to my city.

 

[galiuro]

From the 15 things that has a link posted above. Is there something wrong with this idea?

Stop criminalizing everything.
You may have gotten the impression that everything is a crime these days. That's because it probably is.

The state of California, for instance, has created 1,000 new crimes in the past 25 years, while Michigan currently has 3,102 crimes on the books. New York City alone has 10,000 crimes, rules and codes the police can enforce. In many cities these crimes include innocuous activities like being in a park after hours, drinking alcohol in public, panhandling, spitting and sleeping on the subway. Some cities have even criminalized the wearing of saggy pants (true story).

This is absurd. None of these should warrant criminal punishment. The report estimates that police officers spend 90% of their time dealing with minor infractions like these and just 10% on violent crimes, resulting in a system where people of color are disproportionately summoned to court for low-level offenses — 80% of these summonses are for blacks and Latinos, to be specific.

The solution? The reports says to push police departments and district attorneys to de-prioritize enforcing and prosecuting low-level offenses. Change city charters to limit the health, park, tax and administrative offenses that police are responsible for enforcing. Reclassify misdemeanors as civil infractions, whenever possible.

being in a park after hours is a BIG driver of crime in that high crime neighborhood I am on the border of.. Aint nothing good happens in this city's parks after dark and I mean nothing...