MO - Elizabeth Olten, 9, St Martin's, 21 Oct 2009 #11

[Elley Mae]

iirc she was 7 years old when Gparents came to the rescue. That would be 2nd grade, what could have happened that was so bad, that she now wants to have a relationship with her Mother.

 

[AndresEscobar]

I think on the internet where all fonts are created equal we often forget that sometimes were are dealing with children on here and I see adults say things to kids on the net that they would never say in person. Its mind boggling, this is a 16 year old girl simply expressing her opinion and there are full grown adults on there flaming her and calling her names. Is it really any wonder kids act the way they do these days, all the adults around them have gone fecking mad.

And, she's a teenager and obviously mentally fragile. What's the point of bullying her?

 

[human]

As far as more violent crime ? Are there statistics?

The high schools in the small city by me have police in them. One elementary school has police. The city by me has 85,000 people. We are 150 miles from a big city.

Drive-by shootings. Metal detectors at schools.

I have a friend that grew up in Watts. He said when he was there, maybe 40 years ago, fights were with hands. Now they are with guns and assault rifles.

I have seen bars on businesses and concertina wire around businesses in larger cities. Did that exist so much in the past?

Kids where I live used to bring their rifles to school so they could go hunting after school. Can you fathom that today?

 

[not_my_kids]

BBM


I dont care much for the music and lifestyle either but it is best we stick to the facts and that facts are these:

People today are exposed to more violent media than ever before at any time in history, they listen to more violent music, watch more violent films and TV shows, read more violent books and play more violent video games. One would think that because of this there would be more violent crime. One would be wrong also. Violent crime has went down and deceased considerably at the same time more violent media has become available.

Explain that one.

I will note however that violent youth crime has increased among those on SSRI medications. The numbers dont lie. Maybe its not the music but the legal dr prescribed drugs we have our kids on.

I'm not referring to violent media. I am referring to emo media, which teaches these kids that feeling anything at all is bad. Don't be happy, it won't last. Don't be sad, no one will care. Don't feel guilt, there should be none, it's all objective. I don't mean shoot em up video games, or slasher films, or whatever. That's a completely different genre than emo, which although, I haven't seen it specifically, is how I'm sure that AB described herself. Her actions and dress and writings before the murder were all emo.
The facts are that this is what emo teaches.

(Which is ironic, because the movement is based on people that think they have too much emotion and wished to display it outwardly, yet now the focus of the movement is repressing all feeling.)

 

[danni]

Thank you for actually posting the text. However, remember you're responding to a sixteen year old girl's internet rant. Regarding whether or not AB was criminally insane, this girl has no idea what she's talking about. Regarding the "I'd love to know what it's like to kill someone" statement, I think it's just a poor choice of words and immaturity.

someone else we know made this statment and is sitting behind bars right now IIRC! Was she immature and made a poor choice of words when she said it?

 

[human]

I have to add that there are studies where researchers showed children violent TV and they saw the anti-social behavior increase compared to control groups that were not shown the violence.

My sister's favorite movie is Rear Window. A few years ago I tried to watch it.. I had to turn it off as it was too boring. I like to watch Bruce Wills and action packed movies. I have been desensitized and I didn't even know it.

 

[AndresEscobar]

As far as more violent crime ? Are there statistics?

The high schools in the small city by me have police in them. One elementary school has police. The city by me has 85,000 people. We are 150 miles from a big city.

Drive-by shootings. Metal detectors at schools.

I have a friend that grew up in Watts. He said when he was there, maybe 40 years ago, fights were with hands. Now they are with guns and assault rifles.

I have seen bars on businesses and concertina wire around businesses in larger cities. Did that exist so much in the past?

Kids where I live used to bring their rifles to school so they could go hunting after school. Can you fathom that today?

Yes, there are statistics indicating that violent crime has gone down.

 

[human]

Yes, I remember reading those and they attributed it to abortions because less women were having children who didn't want them. But, I would like to see those statistics teased out. I didn't really look at them to see the data and what it was based on.

The poverty stricken areas of the US are a war zone for the people living in them. It certainly was not always that way.

 

[AndresEscobar]

someone else we know made this statment and is sitting behind bars right now IIRC! Was she immature and made a poor choice of words when she said it?

This is a fallacy of logic. Just because one person who supposedly said something went out and committed a violent crime, doesn't mean that anyone who says that should be round up, arrested, and presumed to be dangerous. You don't know the context or the tone of the statement. Furthermore, that doesn't mean they should be harassed by adults on their YouTube page.

 

[danni]

This is a fallacy of logic. Just because one person who supposedly said something went out and committed a violent crime, doesn't mean that anyone who says that should be round up, arrested, and presumed to be dangerous. You don't know the context or the tone of the statement. Furthermore, that doesn't mean they should be harassed by adults on their YouTube page.

Did I say what was being said here or there was RIGHT? NO Did I say what was being said here or there was WRONG? NOPE so quite frankly no one knows how I personally feel about it.

Like I said before....

If and when this girl with the video on youtube ever commits a murder or crime such as Alyssa did the defense attorney will have it removed right away just like Alyssa's attorney had her channel removed you know the one where she listed "killing people and cutting" as her hobbies. then they will say oh it was just a video, she was expressing right to free speach, or maybe they will use the defense "the system failed her"!

 

[danni]

This is a fallacy of logic. Just because one person who supposedly said something went out and committed a violent crime, doesn't mean that anyone who says that should be round up, arrested, and presumed to be dangerous. You don't know the context or the tone of the statement. Furthermore, that doesn't mean they should be harassed by adults on their YouTube page.

Also, can you please send me to a recording of what AB supposedly said so I can hear the context and tone of her statement?

It was in her confession to the police after she murdered this child but before taking the same police to said childs BODY!


http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/11/19/crimesider/entry5709430.shtml
http://news.aol.com/article/alyssa-bustamante-15-charged-as-adult-in/772912
http://www.truecrimereport.com/2009/11/alyssa_bustamante_15_charged_w.php
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575590,00.html?test=latestnews
http://www.theweeklyvice.com/2009/11/alyssa-bustamante-murdered-9-year-old.html

Take your pick!

 

[Rhyme & Reason]

Scapa...
this kid was in therapy 2 hours per day....and had been under care of doctors, therapists...

what more can they do??

IF they charged her as a juvie she would have to be released at 21..period

does that seem fair...or even "safe" for society??

She will be 16 in January ...21 is 5 years away

I think it is a good deterent to other kids to see her put away. Already she has "fans"

Please help me report the offensive tribute to Allysa at YouTube..thanks

I reported it.

 

[AndresEscobar]

Did I say what was being said here or there was RIGHT? NO Did I say what was being said here or there was WRONG? NOPE so quite frankly no one knows how I personally feel about it.

Like I said before....

Sure, if you want me to address this comment I will gladly.

if and when this girl with the video on youtube ever commits a murder or crime such as Alyssa did the defense attorney will have it removed right away just like Alyssa's attorney had her channel removed you know the one where she listed "killing people and cutting" as her hobbies. then they will say oh it was just a video, she was expressing right to free speach, or maybe they will use the defense "the system failed her"!

Have you actually watched the video in question?

Can you please provide a link that says that the defense attorney had AB's YouTube profile shut down?

Also, her comments defending AB are protected by free speech. Free speech isn't contingent on whether someone on the internet doesn't like what you say. This girls comments fall well within the boundaries of free speech. These are not boundaries that you or I have created, but have been established since the writing of the constitution. I realize you don't like that, but that's just how it is.

Also, "The system failed her" is not a legal defense

 

[AndresEscobar]

It was in her confession to the police after she murdered this child but before taking the same police to said childs BODY!


http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/11/19/crimesider/entry5709430.shtml
http://news.aol.com/article/alyssa-bustamante-15-charged-as-adult-in/772912
http://www.truecrimereport.com/2009/11/alyssa_bustamante_15_charged_w.php
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575590,00.html?test=latestnews
http://www.theweeklyvice.com/2009/11/alyssa-bustamante-murdered-9-year-old.html

Take your pick!

These are all after the fact. I was referring to the statement AB reportedly said to a friend prior to this murder, as that was what you were likening to this 16 year old girls comment. Do you have that?

 

[not_my_kids]

Actually, free speech does not count on the internet. Just as on WS, you have the right to say it. And they have the right to remove it, if they so wish.

But, if youtube removed everything that offends someone...there would be nothing but videos of happy campers holding hands and singing Cumbaya...until someone took offense at the mention of "My Lord."
MOO.

 

[AndresEscobar]

Actually, free speech does not count on the internet. Just as on WS, you have the right to say it. And they have the right to remove it, if they so wish.

But, if youtube removed everything that offends someone...there would be nothing but videos of happy campers holding hands and singing Cumbaya...until someone took offense at the mention of "My Lord."
MOO.

Sure, the media through which you are saying it can remove things based on TOS. However, whether you can be punished by your speech on the internet is within the realm of the first amendment.

 

[AndresEscobar]

double post, sorry.

 

[Csquare]

These are all after the fact. I was referring to the statement AB reportedly said to a friend prior to this murder, as that was what you were likening to this 16 year old girls comment. Do you have that?

Let me ask you this....If you had a friend that you know had some mental issues and they were talking about wanting to know what it was like to kill someone you don't feel that your friend might need some help? If not I am glad you are not my friend

 

[PAXIMUS]

As far as more violent crime ? Are there statistics?

The high schools in the small city by me have police in them. One elementary school has police. The city by me has 85,000 people. We are 150 miles from a big city.

Drive-by shootings. Metal detectors at schools.

I have a friend that grew up in Watts. He said when he was there, maybe 40 years ago, fights were with hands. Now they are with guns and assault rifles.

I have seen bars on businesses and concertina wire around businesses in larger cities. Did that exist so much in the past?

Kids where I live used to bring their rifles to school so they could go hunting after school. Can you fathom that today?

Violent crime is down even though we have more violent media AND more access to guns, its down, check the stats. Every generation thinks there is the worst and that things are getting worse and the end is near and thats never the reality of the matter.

 

[PAXIMUS]

As far as more violent crime ? Are there statistics?

The high schools in the small city by me have police in them. One elementary school has police. The city by me has 85,000 people. We are 150 miles from a big city.

Drive-by shootings. Metal detectors at schools.

I have a friend that grew up in Watts. He said when he was there, maybe 40 years ago, fights were with hands. Now they are with guns and assault rifles.

I have seen bars on businesses and concertina wire around businesses in larger cities. Did that exist so much in the past?

Kids where I live used to bring their rifles to school so they could go hunting after school. Can you fathom that today?

Violent crime is down even though we have more violent media AND more access to guns, its down, check the stats. Every generation thinks there is the worst and that things are getting worse and the end is near and thats never the reality of the matter.