MO - Elizabeth Olten, 9, St Martin's, 21 Oct 2009 #5

[danni]

From what I understand they had no idea.

So if they didn't know Elizabeth was at their house, then they also did not know the wereabouts of their own grandchildren. Correct?

 

[Jodibug]

I am not really surprised when I think about it. Children who have had terrible parenting can be quite cunning and manipulative. It is what they've learned to survive. I do NOT mean because of her grandparents, who appear to have been trying to help their grandkids. I am talking about prior to the grandparents getting custody. It would be interesting to know more about AB's life at that time.

I believe that AB probably had somewhat of a dual personality, and was extremely manipulative.

She would become what she thought you wanted her to be, in order to gain what she was after.

 

[calamityjane]

One of those girls is my daughter's best friend. She was shocked as she had never seen that side of AB before.

But she has since seen AB's online personality, and realizes that she never really knew AB. Honestly, she feels quite used. She feels like she was used to give AB rides to other social events, and that if she had ever seen anything like what is on AB's online profiles, she never would have associated with her at all.

In a sense, all those girls are victims. Many times people use people who follow a faith because they know they will show compassion and do things for them. I have been a victim of that as I am sure many can attest to similar experiences. I'm sure this is extremely difficult for your daughter and her friends.

 

[snowshuze]

From what I understand they had no idea.

I'm thinking that changes the whole timeline. Maybe Elizabeth never actually was IN the house.

 

[Ilovecookies]

So if they didn't know Elizabeth was at their house, then they also did not know the wereabouts of their own grandchildren. Correct?

The way i understand it, EO never came into the house. They allow their grandchildren to play outside, and the 6 y/o was supposedly playing outside in the drive-way (with EO) the whole time EO was at her house.

 

[Kimster]

In a sense, all those girls are victims. Many times people use people who follow a faith because they know they will show compassion and do things for them. I have been a victim of that as I am sure many can attest to similar experiences. I'm sure this is extremely difficult for your daughter and her friends.

When my oldest boy was in HS, there was a group of them who attended a local youth group at a church because "the girls were hot". I remember having a nice long talk about my son about that.

 

[danni]

Jodibug, does your daughter also have "ties" to the girls that are now talking about killing, and suicide on their myspace?

Not that it matters but I was thinking that if your daughter does maybe you know their parents! Get where I am going?

I would hate to hear that something happened to another child because of this case!

 

[PeriodicalCuriosity]

I didn't even know there was an "argument". An argument, as I understand it, has two opposing sides.

My side is that it is inappropriate to bash the mother of a murder victim five days after she buries her daughter.

Is someone disputing that?

I don't think she was "bashing" her. Her opinion on the mother was interesting to the case in the timing of the call to come home. I looked back at your posts and in no way have you said anything negative towards the gps. As much as I possibly can, I understand your emotions towards EOs mother. And I agree, it is important to be kind to EOs mother at this time. She was just stating her opinion--which is different from yours.

 

[Jodibug]

So if they didn't know Elizabeth was at their house, then they also did not know the wereabouts of their own grandchildren. Correct?

That would stand to reason.

And I don't fault them for that. I do not know where my teenages are 100% of the time. I know how to get ahold of them (their cell phones, their friends cell phones), but I certainly do not supervise them 24/7 as I have a full time job, a toddler and many other responsibilities also.

 

[Isabella]

That would stand to reason.

And I don't fault them for that. I do not know where my teenages are 100% of the time. I know how to get ahold of them (their cell phones, their friends cell phones), but I certainly do not supervise them 24/7 as I have a full time job, a toddler and many other responsibilities also.

Theres a bit of difference between teenagers and a 6 year old child though.

 

[calamityjane]

When my oldest boy was in HS, there was a group of them who attended a local youth group at a church because "the girls were hot". I remember having a nice long talk about my son about that.

It doesn't surprise me and you were wise to talk to him about it.

On a side note, I am new here but I just want to say that I sense there are a lot of people on here who are emotionally involved and are a little sensitive. We need to be patient and understanding. If it's like that here, imagine what it must be like in that school or in the neighborhood. God bless you all and I pray that you will all be able to deal with all that faces you and your families.

 

[Jodibug]

Jodibug, does your daughter also have "ties" to the girls that are now talking about killing, and suicide on their myspace?

Not that it matters but I was thinking that if your daughter does maybe you know their parents! Get where I am going?

I would hate to hear that something happened to another child because of this case!

I very rarely get on MySpace, and cannot access it from work at all.

I have not seen these other MS pages to know who you are referring to.

But I do know 95% of the parents of my kids' friends. So if I knew the names, then I might.

But I haven't had a chance to look for these MS pages. I have only heard about them on here.

 

[SnowAngels]

General observation...but for someone so into the grotesque things AB was apparently into and perhaps mentally unstable on top of it, is it a coincidence that this horrible crime was committed so closely to Halloween? Just thinking of all the the preoccupation with death this holiday seems to take on - such as lunatic murderers portrayed in some haunted houses, zombies/cemetaries, gory masks, etc.

For someone with a sick mind and a plan, seems this time of year would have been optimal for her to execute her plan.

Not sure if anyone has already brought up this idea.

 

[Elley Mae]

Well I wonder were the GP's thought that AB was at? And when they got home I wonder if she was home yet.

 

[Ilovecookies]

The house is very big, and has several exits. It quite possibile (this is all my own theory) that the 6 y/o went outside while she was supposed to be in her room or doing something else.

 

[Jodibug]

Theres a bit of difference between teenagers and a 6 year old child though.

Well I thought we were contemplating whether or not the Grandparents knew where AB was from 6-7pm.

I don't think that there is any question about where the 6 year old was, presumably still inside her home.

 

[Kimster]

That would stand to reason.

And I don't fault them for that. I do not know where my teenages are 100% of the time. I know how to get ahold of them (their cell phones, their friends cell phones), but I certainly do not supervise them 24/7 as I have a full time job, a toddler and many other responsibilities also.

OH! I'm glad you mentioned the cell phone! I was thinking this early on in the case...perhaps even before Elizabeth was found. I think parents are very prudent to supply kids with cell phones. But even then, they are not foolproof in protecting your kids - for sure!!! Perhaps Elizabeth's mom knew exactly where she was via the cell phone. I'd like to know a lot more about Elizabeth's cell phone activity and I'll bet we will learn more as this case progresses through the court system.

 

[Jodibug]

General observation...but for someone so into the grotesque things AB was apparently into and perhaps mentally unstable on top of it, is it a coincidence that this horrible crime was committed so closely to Halloween? Just thinking of all the the preoccupation with death this holiday seems to take on - such as lunatic murderers portrayed in some haunted houses, zombies/cemetaries, gory masks, etc.

For someone with a sick mind and a plan, seems this time of year would have been optimal for her to execute her plan.

Not sure if anyone has already brought up this idea.

*shrug* Who knows? Doesn't really matter.

 

[vjlaw]

The house is very big, and has several exits. It quite possibile (this is all my own theory) that the 6 y/o went outside while she was supposed to be in her room or doing something else.

Who else lives in their house? You went to school with someone who lives there or did I misunderstand you?

 

[Isabella]

Well I thought we were contemplating whether or not the Grandparents knew where AB was from 6-7pm.

I don't think that there is any question about where the 6 year old was, presumably still inside her home.

If Elizabeth was playing with her..and was never in the house i was thinking the 6 yr old had to be outside also and not in the house.