MO - Furious Friends Demand Answers After 3 Men Found Dead at Kansas City Home Days After Watching Football Game, January 2024 #4

  • #761
I can't understand why Willis hadn't got rid of the bags of the cocaine and fentanyl by the time the police arrived.

It shows me that he really was unaware that his friends were dead in his backyard. He had received numerous messages from the deceased relatives wondering where they were, so if he knew they were there surely he would have been expecting a visit by the police soon enough and disposed of the incriminating evidence.

The police didn't have a search warrant when they arrived and found the drugs did they? It was a signed consent. why would he let them in?
 
  • #762
It seems that the drug buyer(s) specifically acquired fentanyl for their personal use

Call me naive, but multiple people purposely bought or used pure fentanyl?? That dealer needs to be put away for a long time.

As far as Willis, it does sound like he knew drugs were being used in his house and I think he shares responsibility if he paid for some of it, even if he didn't know they had fentanyl. JMO.
 
  • #763
As far as Willis, it does sound like he knew drugs were being used in his house and I think he shares responsibility if he paid for some of it, even if he didn't know they had fentanyl. JMO.
The prosecutors might be running a test case with this. I don't know what they're basing the charges against Willis on, but would it really be because it was in his home...? It wasn't Carter's home, and he's facing the same charges.

If one person of the 3 hadn't gone outside and died, would that person be charged too?

If you kill someone while drunk driving, you may be charged with involuntary manslaughter. But it doesn't matter whose car you were driving...

JMO
 
  • #764
PC Affidavit re Willis & Drugs.
_____________________________________________________________________________
Call me naive, but multiple people purposely bought or used pure fentanyl?? That dealer needs to be put away for a long time.

As far as Willis, it does sound like he knew drugs were being used in his house and I think he shares responsibility if he paid for some of it, even if he didn't know they had fentanyl. JMO.
=========================================

@ChatteringBirds Thx for your post ^.
(ETA: No, I won't call you naive. Fetanyl as a street drug or recreational drug? YUCK. Ditto for cocaine & others too. UGH. I cannot imagine wanting to breathe/snort anything like that. But some ppl do. And the horrid effects on users and society in general.)

Addressing mainly the second ¶. Personally agreeing that at first blush "sounds like" he knew.
But not the same as the state being able to prove that he knew and that his actions were criminal.

Presence of Drugs That Day.
In PC affidavit page 1, ¶4, Willis' stmts.:
"On 01/09/2024 Willis stated on 01/07/2024" the three came to his house "to watch a football game where they were all drinking and smoking marijuana."
Drinking & smoking cannabis = legal in MO.
Willis did not admit to knòwing either cocaine or fent was there.


"Willis stated he believed" the three "possibly got a hold of some fentanyl at some point on Sunday."
While equivocal on its face, that stmt may not be terribly incriminating, imo.
For ex, if Willis told LE, after the three arrived, one of them said, ~ earlier I bought some Fent.”
Does that, in itself, incriminate Willis in delivering fent? In deaths of the three?


If one of the three said, Yep, let's take some fent & Willis said, Thx, but I’ll pass, does that - knowing or believing that the three were going to ingest it in his home - incriminate Willis?
Lots of unknowns as to what trial evidence will be.

Payment for Those Drugs That Day?
In PC affidavit page 1, ¶ 2, Witness#1 said, when McG “was low on money, Willis would usually supply his friends with cocaine.” How does Wit#1 know this as fact? How did Wit #1 know as a fact that McG was low on money multiple times? Did Wit#1 have a joint bank a/c w McG or review McG’s a/c balances online? Or did Wit#1 personally observe Willis “usually” providing it? Or did McG tell this to Wit#1? If Wit#1 was McG’s girlfriend/fiancée, is it possible/likely that he told her, “Don’t worry, I’m not wasting $ on cocaine. Willis is giving it to us.” Truth or a lie to her?

Page 2, ¶2, data extraction of Harr.’s phone reveals messages among 5 ppl “consistent with the purchasing and use of cocaine.” Shows that “main source of supply of cocaine” for Harr. was Carson.

Also shows info consistent w Wit#1’s stmt ^.

But PCA does not specify that the messages relate to orders/purchases/plans, delivery for cocaine that day, on 01/07. Were the messages transmitted days, weeks, or months before? If so, are they relevant to the crimes charged? IDK.
Again, lots of unknowns.

PC Affidavit provides info for arresting Willis. I’m curious to know what else will emerge at trial, esp’ly by defense in cross exam, and particularly w hearsay objections during the state’s case in chief.

Could Willis be guilty of the crimes of Delivering a Controlled Substance and 3 charges of Involuntary Manslaughter 1st Degree? Possible.

______________________________________
PC Affidavit
 
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  • #765
Presence of Drugs That Day.

Willis did not admit to knòwing either cocaine or fent was there.[/I]

[
Could Willis be guilty of the crimes of Delivering a Controlled Substance and 3 charges of Involuntary Manslaughter 1st Degree? Possible.
RSBM

Maybe they are just going to tie him to the cocaine and say 'he supplied some of the illegal drugs and they died'. Not try to tie it specifically to fentanyl. Just say: illegal drugs + deaths = involuntary manslaughter...as a warning to others?

JMO
 
  • #766
Call me naive, but multiple people purposely bought or used pure fentanyl?? That dealer needs to be put away for a long time.

As far as Willis, it does sound like he knew drugs were being used in his house and I think he shares responsibility if he paid for some of it, even if he didn't know they had fentanyl. JMO.
99.9% of opioid addicts actually prefer and desire pure fentanyl.. it's been this way for years. It happens every minute of every day-- Junkies don't want Heroin anymore.
 
  • #767
The case against Carson seems pretty cut-and-dried. He's admitted to being a drug dealer and supplying the victims, and his DNA was found on the fentanyl.

On the other hand, the case against Willis seems weak. His DNA is apparently not on the fentanyl, only on the coke. And there doesn't even seem to be any direct evidence tying him to the purchase of the cocaine. Just others with no direct knowledge claiming that it must have been him, even though the others also were regular drug buyers. If I was on that jury, I would expect more than that to put away a man for manslaughter.

Maybe an unpopular opinion, but I don't think treating someone as if they were a killer when they were just doing drugs with their pals is a good idea. It's one of those tough "War on Drugs" stances that sound good in a political debate and gets an ambitious DA's name in the papers, but as actual policy, I think it will be ineffective and lead to unintended consequences. (Like someone fleeing the scene rather than calling 911 when their friend ODs.)

People don't get treated like killers for doing drugs. IF you have 3 friends come over who wind up (all three) freezing to death from an <modsnip - no link/opinion stated as fact> overdose in your backyard patio and just let the bodies keep freezing for a few days without answering phones from loved ones while at the same time freely going in and out of your house (and never calling LE)-- well then it brings the whole situation regarding the murder charges to light.
 
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  • #768
99.9% of opioid addicts actually prefer and desire pure fentanyl.. it's been this way for years. It happens every minute of every day-- Junkies don't want Heroin anymore.
A little research shows that not to be exactly true, though. There are various reasons why fent is so widespread - easily available compared to H, cheaper, not as much needed to get high, and oftentimes, the user isn't even aware that there is fent in their fix.
IMO and personal experience - I lost my sister-in-law to a fent OD in March. Her boyfriend gave her the shot. We're hoping that he's charged in her death.
IMO.
 
  • #769
People don't get treated like killers for doing drugs. IF you have 3 friends come over who wind up (all three) freezing to death from an <modsnip - no link/opinion stated as fact> overdose in your backyard patio and just let the bodies keep freezing for a few days without answering phones from loved ones while at the same time freely going in and out of your house (and never calling LE)-- well then it brings the whole situation regarding the murder charges to light.
Is there a link to the accused going in and out of his house? I've followed this since the beginning and don't remember that.
Thank you in advance.
 
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  • #770
A little research shows that not to be exactly true, though. There are various reasons why fent is so widespread - easily available compared to H, cheaper, not as much needed to get high, and oftentimes, the user isn't even aware that there is fent in their fix.
IMO and personal experience - I lost my sister-in-law to a fent OD in March. Her boyfriend gave her the shot. We're hoping that he's charged in her death.
IMO.
Sorry to hear about your loss. It's such a waste of human life.

I didn't get the impression these guys were addicts, just recreational users. Why they would buy fenty is beyond me. Just because it was super cheap? And they never read the news about all the deaths?

Where I live, accidental fenty ODs have been big news since 2016. The coroner, public health, news media have been loudly banging the drum about it for 8 years.

Yet, people keep taking illegal drugs "for a fun time" - and then dying. The latest big story was the inquest for an otherwise bright first-year uni student...

I just can't comprehend it.
 
  • #771
A little research shows that not to be exactly true, though. There are various reasons why fent is so widespread - easily available compared to H, cheaper, not as much needed to get high, and oftentimes, the user isn't even aware that there is fent in their fix.
IMO and personal experience - I lost my sister-in-law to a fent OD in March. Her boyfriend gave her the shot. We're hoping that he's charged in her death.
IMO.
It's also easier to synthesize than morphine or heroin.
 
  • #772
A little research shows that not to be exactly true, though. There are various reasons why fent is so widespread - easily available compared to H, cheaper, not as much needed to get high, and oftentimes, the user isn't even aware that there is fent in their fix.
IMO and personal experience - I lost my sister-in-law to a fent OD in March. Her boyfriend gave her the shot. We're hoping that he's charged in her death.
IMO.

sorry for your loss
 
  • #773
Sorry to hear about your loss. It's such a waste of human life.

I didn't get the impression these guys were addicts, just recreational users. Why they would buy fenty is beyond me. Just because it was super cheap? And they never read the news about all the deaths?

Where I live, accidental fenty ODs have been big news since 2016. The coroner, public health, news media have been loudly banging the drum about it for 8 years.

Yet, people keep taking illegal drugs "for a fun time" - and then dying. The latest big story was the inquest for an otherwise bright first-year uni student...

I just can't comprehend it.
I'm pretty sure they thought they were taking cocaine.

MOO
 
  • #774
Sorry to hear about your loss. It's such a waste of human life.

I didn't get the impression these guys were addicts, just recreational users. Why they would buy fenty is beyond me. Just because it was super cheap? And they never read the news about all the deaths?

Where I live, accidental fenty ODs have been big news since 2016. The coroner, public health, news media have been loudly banging the drum about it for 8 years.

Yet, people keep taking illegal drugs "for a fun time" - and then dying. The latest big story was the inquest for an otherwise bright first-year uni student...

I just can't comprehend it.
One of the classes I teach is Opioid Awareness and often I hear “My boyfriend/girlfriend is not an addict, they just use it socially.”

Even using these drugs “socially” is very risky behavior.
 
  • #775
I'm pretty sure they thought they were taking cocaine.

MOO
That's what I believed until the report came back that the bag of fent was almost empty.
I need to find the link, but it's in this thread somewhere.
Why choose the "knock-out drug" to celebrate instead of the "party drug"?
And they would have known almost immediately that they weren't using cocaine. It's a totally different experience.
Just very strange.
IMO.
Also, thank you all for the kindness. My SIL was only mid-30's, with a teenage daughter who my in-laws have been raising pretty much her whole life. It's been very sad for our family, but even sadder knowing that we are not the only family who has experienced this kind of loss. There is a point where you pretty much know that you'll be getting that awful phone call, but there's still no way to prepare for it.
 
  • #776
Sorry to hear about your loss. It's such a waste of human life.

I didn't get the impression these guys were addicts, just recreational users. Why they would buy fenty is beyond me. Just because it was super cheap? And they never read the news about all the deaths?

Where I live, accidental fenty ODs have been big news since 2016. The coroner, public health, news media have been loudly banging the drum about it for 8 years.

Yet, people keep taking illegal drugs "for a fun time" - and then dying. The latest big story was the inquest for an otherwise bright first-year uni student...

I just can't comprehend it.
Nobody uses these drugs recreationally. You've GOT to have addictive behaviors going on to be even desiring them, especially at their ages!

Speaking of which, when people develop addictions, they stay that age emotionally until they get clean.
 
  • #777
That's what I believed until the report came back that the bag of fent was almost empty.
I need to find the link, but it's in this thread somewhere.
Why choose the "knock-out drug" to celebrate instead of the "party drug"?
And they would have known almost immediately that they weren't using cocaine. It's a totally different experience.
Just very strange.
IMO.
Also, thank you all for the kindness. My SIL was only mid-30's, with a teenage daughter who my in-laws have been raising pretty much her whole life. It's been very sad for our family, but even sadder knowing that we are not the only family who has experienced this kind of loss. There is a point where you pretty much know that you'll be getting that awful phone call, but there's still no way to prepare for it.

I'm sorry to hear about your sister-in-law, Leilei. Sending condolences to you & all of those who are missing her.
 
  • #778
I'm pretty sure they thought they were taking cocaine.

MOO
I think so too. They had cocaine and fentanyl in their systems and the combined toxicity was attributed to their deaths.

Causes of Death Revealed for 3 Chiefs Fans Found Frozen Outside Home of Friend, Who's Now Charged

A forensic exam determined David Harrington, 37, Clayton McGeeney, 36, and Ricky Johnson, 38, "all died of Fentanyl and cocaine combined toxicity," Platte County Prosecutor Eric Zahnd said during a press conference.
 
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  • #779
DBM
 
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  • #780
One of the classes I teach is Opioid Awareness and often I hear “My boyfriend/girlfriend is not an addict, they just use it socially.”

Even using these drugs “socially” is very risky behavior.

or if they're 'socializing' every weekend ... it's still addictive behaviour
 

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