MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #18

[ATasteOfHoney]

I believe poster Dana has it right; it's **obstructing traffic** and probably MB's lawyers watered it down to the "jaywalking" phrase cause it fits their narrative.

 

[bettybaby00]

Ok so what is it called if a pedestrian continues to violate crossing at a designated crosswalk & continues to walk down the middle of the road?

Another interesting point to consider...

MB supporters who claim he was killed for "jaywalking," are ignoring DJs excuse that he told OW, " we will be at our destination in a minute."

How then I wonder does one jaywalk for an extended period of time when the term is supposed to be applied to someone who is illegally crossing the street? Are we to concluded that MB and DJ were traveling in a manner that had them crossing (jaywalking) and then recrossing the street on the way to grandmas?

 

[oh_gal]

Another interesting point to consider...

MB supporters who claim he was killed for "jaywalking," are ignoring DJs excuse that he told OW, " we will be at our destination in a minute."

How then I wonder does one jaywalk for an extended period of time when the term is supposed to be applied to someone who is illegally crossing the street? Are we to concluded that MB and DJ were traveling in a manner that had them crossing (jaywalking) and then recrossing the street on the way to grandmas?

Was he crossing the street, or walking down it? (I don't know the answer to that).

 

[Dana]

Was he crossing the street, or walking down it? (I don't know the answer to that).

In my guesstimation, while OW would be driving down Canfield, which is not a short road, and seeing 2 guys crossing the street, I don't think he would have stopped them to tell them to get out of the road. So, IMO, I think they would have to be walking down the middle towards the SUV.
Also, it might be posted somewhere, a witness perhaps? said walking down the center of the road.

 

[katydid23]

Crump always describes MB as "walking down the road" ... never "walking in the middle of the road". Big difference.

Walking in the middle, AND refusing the officers request to move to the sidewalk.

 

[katydid23]

In my guesstimation, while OW would be driving down Canfield, which is not a short road, and seeing 2 guys crossing the street, I don't think he would have stopped them to tell them to get out of the road. So, IMO, I think they would have to be walking down the middle towards the SUV.
Also, it might be posted somewhere, a witness perhaps? said walking down the center of the road.

Walking down the middle. Even Dorain admitted so, as he himself said they told the officer they were a minute away from their destination, and would get out of the road then.

 

[cady]

JMO I'm still puzzled as to why DJ has not been charged with obstructing the road and also for evading arrest by running away, and for leaving (however briefly) the scene of the incident.....all I can figure is that the obstruction itself was not that big of a deal.........and what irritated OW was that they disregarded his command. Also, the ambulance, presumably on route to a hospital, with an infant in the back having breathing issues, showed up at the incident on Canfield several minutes after Brown had been shot.........and a paramedic jumped out to check on Brown.........which makes me wonder if the infant was already deceased, otherwise, shouldn't the ambulance, with siren on be racing to the nearest hospital ? I have not heard anything else about the infant, or if the siren was blaring. JMO

 

[katydid23]

Cops absolutely can enforce the rules. Police can control a city council meeting just as they controlled the "peaceful protests."

Of course they can. But it will take a tremendous amount of force. And it will look really bad in print and on mass media and in social media. So is it worth the effort? Will it creat a negative impact to have pictures of elderly blacks and the disabled being forcibly removed with pictures of the all white council looking on from behind the podium?

 

[krimekat]

Walking in the middle, AND refusing the officers request to move to the sidewalk.

which is available on both sides of Canfield Drive -- man, I love Google Maps

 

[katydid23]

JMO I'm still puzzled as to why DJ has not been charged with obstructing the road and also for evading arrest by running away, and for leaving (however briefly) the scene of the incident.....all I can figure is that the obstruction itself was not that big of a deal.........and what irritated OW was that they disregarded his command. Also, the ambulance, presumably on route to a hospital, with an infant in the back having breathing issues, showed up at the incident on Canfield several minutes after Brown had been shot.........and a paramedic jumped out to check on Brown.........which makes me wonder if the infant was already deceased, otherwise, shouldn't the ambulance, with siren on be racing to the nearest hospital ? I have not heard anything else about the infant, or if the siren was blaring. JMO

obstruction of traffic is very minor. I doubt the police wanted to charge Dorian with a small infraction, in the midst of the civil unrest. It would just add fuel to the fire and to the hyped narrative of police harassment.

 

[katydid23]

?? So OW blocked Canfield with his SUV, knowing the ambulance was coming through?? JMO

I don't think he had much choice at the time.

 

[krimekat]

JMO I'm still puzzled as to why DJ has not been charged with obstructing the road and also for evading arrest by running away, and for leaving (however briefly) the scene of the incident.....all I can figure is that the obstruction itself was not that big of a deal.........and what irritated OW was that they disregarded his command. Also, the ambulance, presumably on route to a hospital, with an infant in the back having breathing issues, showed up at the incident on Canfield several minutes after Brown had been shot.........and a paramedic jumped out to check on Brown.........which makes me wonder if the infant was already deceased, otherwise, shouldn't the ambulance, with siren on be racing to the nearest hospital ? I have not heard anything else about the infant, or if the siren was blaring. JMO

IMHO DJ will be charged with something (perjury) when all is said & done -- IMHO once the DOJ became involved, DJ became "protected"; I do know that Cole County MO wants him hence releasing his warrant . . . Have heard nothing about the infant

 

[katydid23]

I doubt the infant died. He was probably stable and he had oxygen being piped in, so he was pretty good at the time. If the ambulance comes upon a shooting victim, and their patient onboard is stable, they will often stop and help.

 

[Dana]

Of course they can. But it will take a tremendous amount of force. And it will look really bad in print and on mass media and in social media. So is it worth the effort? Will it creat a negative impact to have pictures of elderly blacks and the disabled being forcibly removed with pictures of the all white council looking on from behind the podium?

Normally, I would say yes to the police enforcement but in this case, after seeing what the last council meeting was like, enforcement would cause a riot. I think their best bet is to cancel the meetings for a few weeks until all this calms down a little. I know, sounds like the easy way out but I don't see where the last meeting did much good other than people screaming demands and chanting. The council can watch TV and see all that so what's the point? I think it's a shame when people can't control their emotions enough to discuss problems without shouting and threats.

 

[al66pine]

.... I do wish though that one of their leaders would explain the rules of a council meeting, maybe Maria Chappelle Nadal ....IMO

bbm sbm

Lovejac, brilliant.

Mo House of Reps & Senate use Robert's Rules of Order for committee hearings and floor debates on proposed laws
The obvious choice of ppl to explain, inform, educate are current & past Ferguson and/or St.L area legislators.
Ppl in those positions - in the political tent - know how the systems work.
Not talking about just RRoO, but logistics, mechanics, strategy, tactics that work,
not shrill screams, threats of violence, looting, Molotov cocktails.

JM2cts.

 

[MyBelle]

Of course they can. But it will take a tremendous amount of force. And it will look really bad in print and on mass media and in social media. So is it worth the effort? Will it creat a negative impact to have pictures of elderly blacks and the disabled being forcibly removed with pictures of the all white council looking on from behind the podium?

Message to whom? And where do you get the idea the elderly and disabled are going to be disruptive?

I don't agree that it will take a tremendous amount of force to maintain control at a city council meeting. People who don't follow rules will be escorted out or arrested. Simple concept. Doing nothing and allowing chaos is what sends the wrong message.

JMO

 

[katydid23]

Message to whom? And where do you get the idea the elderly and disabled are going to be disruptive?

I don't agree that it will take a tremendous amount of force to maintain control at a city council meeting. People who don't follow rules will be escorted out or arrested. Simple concept. Doing nothing and allowing chaos is what sends the wrong message.

JMO

Did you watch the last council meeting? I saw several elderly black protestors that would absolutely be disruptive. I saw a couple of people in wheelchairs, and I bet they would have resisted LE as well.

It sounds easy to say that people who don't follow rules will be 'escorted' out. But what happens when 200 people are shouting " he!! No we wont go!'

You cannot simply 'escort' them out. It takes physical force to do so. And that gets ugly really fast.

It is a simple concept, as you describe it, but it is easier said than done. jmo

 

[MyBelle]

Did you watch the last council meeting? I saw several elderly black protestors that would absolutely be disruptive. I saw a couple of people in wheelchairs, and I bet they would have resisted LE as well.

It sounds easy to say that people who don't follow rules will be 'escorted' out. But what happens when 200 people are shouting " he!! No we wont go!'

You cannot simply 'escort' them out. It takes physical force to do so. And that gets ugly really fast.

It is a simple concept, as you describe it, but it is easier said than done. jmo

It's easy. The meeting stops until the disruption is cleared. One of the primary instigators is elderly. That didn't stop the cops from arresting him at the I-70 protest.

JMO

 

[katydid23]

It's easy. The meeting stops until the disruption is cleared. One of the primary instigators is elderly. That didn't stop the cops from arresting him at the I-70 protest.

JMO

But the I-70 protest was easier for the cops to justify. The people were about to do something very dangerous, thus arresting them was a given. It is a lot harder when the audience is sitting in at a council meeting, and wanting the chance to speak up. Not as easy to justify forcibly removing someone for not following Robertsons Rules of Order.

 

[katydid23]

Also, to say it stops until 'the disruption' is cleared---how long would it take to clear 200+ angry protestors out of the room?