MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #9

[cady]

JMO I really feel sorry for Wilson's former wife. Hope she is well hidden from the press. JMO

 

[sorrell skye]

The feed said it was live as I was watching it, but now it's not. IDK what happened. Maybe it was a repeat of the live march. Weird how it said LIVE as I was watching it a few minutes ago. There's no live feed now.

 

[i.b.nora]

I have not been watching it continuously today, but I think Argus Radio must be moving his location. He was on live just a bit ago.

 

[bwt42]

Re: # 3-10

Or, couldn't it have been that before or during whatever altercation/incident/verbal/non-verbal/physical/etc. happened at the car b/w MB and OW, OW grabbed for his gun in order to threaten MB with it?

He pointed it at MB, b/c whole reason he got his gun out was to threaten MB.

MB then tried to get the gun away from being pointed and aimed directly at him.

IDK but this scenario also makes sense to me.

JMO

I could buy pulled his gun to arrest MB rather than to threaten him.

 

[CHERIE.T]

DeDee,
That video floored me.
It was shocking to my core.....

 

[aa9511]

Yes Parks and Crump weren't there, but to me it's more than logical to believe that they are fully aware of what Dorian officially told investigators.

This isn't a case where 2 guys are accused of committing a crime, and then one tells a dramatically different story implicating his friend to cover his own a$$.

My opinion only of course.

I don't know, because I'm not a young black male who already has a warrant out for my arrest, who is now directly implicated in a theft for which there is proof in the form of video, and who is now basically the pariah of the entire police force because he is the other "he" in the he-said/he-said of an officer-involved shooting. Oh yeah, with the whole world watching and headlines on CNN and everywhere.

So IMO, Dorian is going to say whatever favors HIS OWN SELF the most, at least until further evidence comes in and he starts getting caught in lies and inconsistencies.

So really, we will not know what really truly happened until a trial, if it gets to that point. If even then?

JMO.

 

[branwynbreeze]

I think we can agree that OW did receive injury to face, degree of being incapacitated is currently up for debate until formally released.

http://www.assaultandbattery.org/assault-battery-on-a-police-officer/
You can be charged with assault on a police offer if:

You swing your arms to get away from a fight or other situation, and accidentally strike a police officer
You drive to close to a police officer by the side of the road (assault with a vehicle is also consider assault with a dangerous/deadly weapon)
Any minor physical contact during the course of an arrest
Sometimes if you are belligerent, angry, drunk, or otherwise just annoy the cop, a minor incident might be charged as a felony assault on an officer.

http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/chapters/chap563.htm revised Aug 28, 2013
Law enforcement officer's use of force in making an arrest.
563.046. 1. A law enforcement officer need not retreat or desist from efforts to effect the arrest, or from efforts to prevent the escape from custody, of a person he reasonably believes to have committed an offense because of resistance or threatened resistance of the arrestee. In addition to the use of physical force authorized under other sections of this chapter, he is, subject to the provisions of subsections 2 and 3, justified in the use of such physical force as he reasonably believes is immediately necessary to effect the arrest or to prevent the escape from custody.

2. The use of any physical force in making an arrest is not justified under this section unless the arrest is lawful or the law enforcement officer reasonably believes the arrest is lawful.

3. A law enforcement officer in effecting an arrest or in preventing an escape from custody is justified in using deadly force only

(1) When such is authorized under other sections of this chapter; or

(2) When he reasonably believes that such use of deadly force is immediately necessary to effect the arrest and also reasonably believes that the person to be arrested

(a) Has committed or attempted to commit a felony; or

(b) Is attempting to escape by use of a deadly weapon; or

(c) May otherwise endanger life or inflict serious physical injury unless arrested without delay.

4. The defendant shall have the burden of injecting the issue of justification under this section.

(L. 1977 S.B. 60)
Effective 1-1-79

 

[Linda7NJ]

And, if they would have swept the body up swiftly, they would have said they tainted the crime scene and they were just trying to cover up... it's a no win.

He laid there. Maggot didn't start to eat the skin. He didn't start to stink. What was the downside? I don't get it? Are they saying he was being disrespected because he was lying there? Because, that's insanity...

A few years ago, I had a neighbor ( older gentleman) who died apparently while bring his trash can back to the house. His top half had fallen inside the can while his feet were out of the can off the ground a bit.
He was discovered about 3:30 in the afternoon, I had just returned home from picking my son up from school.....his body remained in that can until 7:30 that night. There were police there and the area was taped off. He was covered up by what looked like a thin plastic sheet from where I was.

I watched as the coroner finally showed up to pronounce and remove him, and had to flatten him out...I stopped watching after that...

I've seen complicated accident fatalities that remain for hours...

It's not disrespectful, it's necessary. All IMO



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[liloleme]

That should answer it.

Unfortunately, you didn't



1. OW eye socket was blown out. Who blew it out?____ Has the family's attorney denied that MB hit OW in the face? YES or NO?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...tercation.html The source of the "orbital blowout" came originally from the Gateway Pundit. http://therightscoop.com/cnn-report...-socket-after-altercation-with-michael-brown/

I'm not buying that- other news sources refute that. I accept that you are free to believe that account.

You didn't answer this: Has the family's attorney denied that MB hit OW in the face? YES or NO?

8. I'm going to tell you that if it WASN'T assault, MB's family attorney would be all over the news stating that it wasn't true. Instead, the opposite is happening. He's saying, "in the upcoming days, you're going to hear things about MB.. but ..." Each time the man speaks, he keeps adding a few more facts about the story that continue to give thinking people more understanding as to why OW was justified in his actions. When this started out, we didn't hear anything about an altercation from him- only from an eyewitness and from the person speaking for OW. Then he finally admitted it... totally dishonest. YES he would have continued. There's no reason to believe he would not have. He assaulted the store owner. He assaulted OW. He would have continued.

9. I asked if someone hits YOU. I didn't ask about MB. I asked a personal question. Can you answer?

But, you've also created a strawman- I never said MB went directly for OW's gun. Maybe he hit him first and then went for the gun. I have no idea what happened first. But, there was a struggle for the gun. There would not be a struggle if MB didn't go for it. OW wouldn't struggle with himself.

Also, since you bring it.. is it acceptable to deflect even if you are being "drawn down on"? Can you legally touch an officer's gun if you feel you are being threatened by that officer?

And, just for the record, an officer would NEVER draw down on someone and be the first person to "ACT" through a window. That would never, ever, ever happen, just as a point of clarification (invalidating your argument).

10. Your scenario in #497 doesn't ring true. I've explained this scenario previously. If MB was shot from behind and turned around, his affected arm would now be on the opposite side of his body, requiring OW to realign his aim to at least 18-20 inches over and begin shooting again, in the same pattern. All within 2-4 seconds. Just not possible. The shot pattern doesn't substantiate this.

I can't find that link from MB's family attorney right this second- but I got interrupted in my search. It is on #9 thread and on Fox News- if someone who has it handy can post that, I'd be grateful!

Here is a statement from the Chief of Police stating that there was a struggle between MB and OW in the car and that the gun went off in the car. Daryl Parks hasn't refuted it (which, again, he would.. instead, he's confirmed it at that elusive link..)

http://www.ksdk.com/story/news/crim...olice-news-conference-michael-brown/13860601/

Here's the link, Bernina: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1408/20/ng.01.html

The attorney calls it an "altercation". He could call it, "playtime with Barney" and it wouldn't make it so. If a gunshot goes off during said altercation, I'm pretty sure that's classified as assault, regardless of what he calls it.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I really, wholly with my heart, do not believe MB would have reached inside the car and grappled with OW to get his gun. Especially as a Black man, who would have known what LE is capable of doing to him. No matter how stupid he was, I don't think he was that stupid. I'm sorry, I am just.not.buying.it at this time. It doesn't make one iota of sense to me, even for someone so stupid as people are claiming he was.

It makes a lot more sense to me that the gun was already being pointed at him by Officer Wilson. In my heard and my head, this makes a lot more sense than the above scenario.

JMO.

But we've witnessed with our own eyes just how brazen and aggressive Brown was just minutes before when he committed a strong armed robbery. Then ....he proceeded to walk down the middle of the street and defy law enforcement when told to get out of the street....this shows me a huge lapse in judgement. A real lack of cause & effect comprehension.

I really wonder if Mike Brown had other, yet to be determined, drugs in his system.

IMO


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[Elley Mae]

I just want a link to "apprx 5 hours".

 

[tlcya]

I don't know, because I'm not a young black male who already has a warrant out for my arrest, who is now directly implicated in a theft for which there is proof in the form of video, and who is now basically the pariah of the entire police force because he is the other "he" in the he-said/he-said of an officer-involved shooting. Oh yeah, with the whole world watching and headlines on CNN and everywhere.

So IMO, Dorian is going to say whatever favors HIS OWN SELF the most, at least until further evidence comes in and he starts getting caught in lies and inconsistencies.

So really, we will not know what really truly happened until a trial, if it gets to that point. If even then?

JMO.

Good points. I believe that explains Parks and Crump and their careful statements and admissions as to what was going on near the vehicle. they are only stating discussing things they feel they must admit and which are backed by substantiating facts outside of the witness DJ. They know that DJ and his original story cannot be backed and that some evidence exists disputing that version of events (MOO no link to give) and so they are admitting and spinning to the best possible light what can be or is already substantiated by the evidence and they are noticeably silent on the areas of DJ story that either a) they KNOW are not true, b) suspect are not true or c) worry are not true and do not want to lock themselves into a narrative that they think or know will be debunked.

 

[Bernina]

WARNING: GRAPHIC VIDEO CONTAINS STRONG LANGUAGE

With the moderator's permission, I am able to insert the video of the shooting. Thank you, LambChop. Also, I will include the news article posted by popsicle.

WARNING GRAPHIC VIDEO AND STRONG LANGUAGE

[video=youtube;emTEkad58YA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emTEkad58YA[/video]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...ting/14295137/

The article had a "404" error.........

Stealing 2 cans of soda to make a point sure doesn't add up to being killed. Was there a knife? Or were LE posturing? Guy videoing it said the man had "nothing". Man's dead and they handcuff him. Not the same SOP they used with MB.
2 wrongs don't make a right.
Sick, sick sick.
Sorry if this rubs peeps the wrong way, but LE over reacted IMO.

 

[aa9511]

WARNING: GRAPHIC VIDEO CONTAINS STRONG LANGUAGE

With the moderator's permission, I am able to insert the video of the shooting. Thank you, LambChop. Also, I will include the news article posted by popsicle.

WARNING GRAPHIC VIDEO AND STRONG LANGUAGE

[video=youtube;emTEkad58YA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emTEkad58YA[/video]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...ting/14295137/

Thank you for this. I'm like the guy filming - "I don't even know what to say."

 

[Linda7NJ]

I have a feeling they were more concerned about the crowd that was amassing and getting OW out of the area. I can't recall an Officer involved shooting where it took more than 2-3 hours, tops, to get a TOD, measurements, pics, and crime scene techs to get what they needed before transporting the victim out of the area. If it had happened at night, it *might* seem reasonable?

We have no way of know what else was going on, what the medical examiner/ coroner were doing, where all of those others necessary for the investigation were...

With budget cuts ....we have no idea just how thin they're being stretched.

In my own town, I recently discovered we are down to FOUR officers at night Monday through Thursday.
We have one coroner for the entire county.


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[liloleme]

I could buy pulled his gun to arrest MB rather than to threaten him.

But, OW would NOT do that from his car, through his window, with someone who is unarmed. That wouldn't be protocol. So, I don't buy that either.

 

[popsicle]

The article had a "404" error.........

Stealing 2 cans of soda to make a point sure doesn't add up to being killed. Was there a knife? Or were LE posturing? Guy videoing it said the man had "nothing". Man's dead and they handcuff him. Not the same SOP they used with MB.
2 wrongs don't make a right.
Sick, sick sick.
Sorry if this rubs peeps the wrong way, but LE over reacted IMO.

Just jumping off you Bernina :seeya:

Antonio French ✔ @AntonioFrench

There can, should & WILL be hearings about whether STL police are trained to shoot to wound or kill, but this seems to be LEGALLY justified.
10:32 PM - 20 Aug 2014

http://www.ibtimes.com/kajieme-powe...deo-showing-officers-killing-man-near-1664738

 

[sorrell skye]

For about four hours, in the unrelenting summer sun, his body remained where he fell.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/24/u...meline-4-hours-on-a-ferguson-street.html?_r=0

Also from above link:

The St. Louis County Police Department, which almost immediately took over the investigation, had officers on the scene quickly, but its homicide detectives were not called until about 40 minutes after the shooting and arrived around 1:30 p.m., according to county police logs. It was another hour before an investigator from the medical examiner’s office arrived.

“Usually they go straight to their jobs,” Officer Brian Schellman, a county police spokesman, said of the detectives who process crime scenes for evidence. But that was not possible. “They couldn’t do that right away because there weren’t enough police there to quiet the situation,” he said.

Experts in policing said there was no standard for how long a body should remain on a scene, but they expressed surprise at how Mr. Brown’s body had been allowed to remain in public view.

Asked to describe procedures in New York, Gerald Nelson, a chief who commands the patrol forces in much of Brooklyn, said that as soon as emergency medical workers have concluded that a victim is dead, “that body is immediately covered.”

St. Louis County police officials acknowledged that they were uncomfortable with the time it took to shield Mr. Brown’s body and have it removed, and that they were mindful of the shocked reaction from residents. But they also defended their work, saying the time that elapsed in getting detectives to the scene was not out of the ordinary. Once those investigators arrived, the officials said, they faced delays in processing the crime scene because of the chaos on Canfield Drive.

 

[liloleme]

Bernina, in case you missed my edited post, here's your link- from CNN:


http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../20/ng.01.html

The attorney calls it an "altercation". He could call it, "playtime with Barney" and it wouldn't make it so. If a gunshot goes off during said altercation, I'm pretty sure that's classified as assault, regardless of what he calls it.

 

[branwynbreeze]

I repeatedly come back to that. I'm having a difficult time believing that MB would have put this chain of events in place if he was clear thinking, unclouded judgement.

But we've witnessed with our own eyes just how brazen and aggressive Brown was just minutes before when he committed a strong armed robbery. Then ....he proceeded to walk down the middle of the street and defy law enforcement when told to get out of the street....this shows me a huge lapse in judgement. A real lack of cause & effect comprehension.

I really wonder if Mike Brown had other, yet to be determined, drugs in his system.

IMO


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