MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #5

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  • #241
I'm really NOT liking the tone of LE on this one... They should not have held a PC calling out the parents IMO. Think they are frustrated as are the parents and just don't want to look bad.
The parents seemed totally apologetic as if they said anything negative, LE was going to stop looking for their baby. I got a feeling that LE is putting LOTS of pressure on them and now they're afraid if they say the wrong thing, baby Lisa won't get the attention she deserves. Can't explain it properly but they seemed afraid of LE .. almost victimized themselves!! Sigh...

This is how I felt when LE stated that the parents weren't cooperating and as a resutl they were closing the command center. I hope that was merely bad reporting. I'm a supporter of LE to a fault and will give them the benifit of the doubt when info is scarce and their actions are questionable. I will usually state until I know more I'm siding with LE. After a public statement like the one above. I can't side with them until they explain themselves more. IMO.
 
  • #242
I agree, we all react differently. But these questions could not have caught them off guard. They've probably asked the same questions of themselves, and each other already.

They probably have, but putting your thoughts into words when you have a million and one things going through your mind is a different story. I have a hard time thinking straight with two people talking to me at once, or having the tv and the radio on at the same time, let alone questions being thrown at me from every direction while I have something big on my mind. It's just how my brain is wired. I need peace to think about how to word my thoughts properly or I may not make any sense (or may be misinterpreted).

Just wanted to add that there's a good chance I don't make sense right now.
 
  • #243
They have without a Chief since 9/16....anyone know who is the Active Chief for now, is it Cpt. Young?

Deputy Chief Cheryl Rose was sworn in as interim chief of police of the Kansas City Missouri Police Department on Sept. 19, 2011. She is a 24-year veteran of the department and was previously assigned as commander of the Administration Bureau.

http://www.kcmo.org/police

ETA: What boots on the ground experience would somebody as commander of the adminstrative bureau have - what is an adminstrative bureau - anyone know?
 
  • #244
  • #245
I really can see what Debbie and Jeremy are saying about needing a break from questioning. I'm sure it's grueling.....and, maybe LE --even though it sounds cruel--decided to run with that to put even more pressure on them since they seemingly don't have any leads at all. They have to do what they have to do to find Lisa......

I don't even know if that makes sense...I need caffeine.
 
  • #246
If the video is not loaded to the site, then wouldn't LE be manipulating media/free speech? This would definately be a foul ball in this ball game.

No, I don't think so. If they just asked for a copy of the video before it was loaded to the web, I don't see that they're suppressing free speech.
 
  • #247
Re the video from Today show. I watch every am and they usually re-run 1st hr vids in the 3rd hr and don't post them to the site until after the 2nd run.

Both BeanE and I are watching for it and will post ASAP!

wm :)
 
  • #248
Just jumping off your post.

After following several missing children cases I can honestly say that parents getting an attorney is not unusual at all.

I've been trying to keep up with case but I admit, I've not read all the posts.

I remember quite well when LE advised D. Thompson (Somer's Mom) to get an attorney. Not that they thought she was guilty of anything, but to have someone to help her with the high profile case. Media interviews and such. A lot of people assumed that since she got the attorney, she was guilty of something. She absolutely was not.

IMO (right now anyway) the parents did not hurt this child.
Of course my opinion can change.

JMO


My post wasn't to implicate the parents. Just my opinion as to why LE may have stated the parents didn't want to cooperate with LE. If they hired an attorney, LE will have to deal with their attorney.

I just hate that this case is turning out to be another drama with LE versus the parents of the missing child. Why does this happen over and over? :banghead:
 
  • #249
My goodness. I have more than a few questions about what has gone on, a ton of red flags popping up all over, I feel free to say so, and I don't feel the least bit Karmic-ly dirty. For starters, I don't equate LE with vultures.

Really? Ask Kevin Fox about that. He was thrown into jail, where HE was raped and beaten by inmates, after falsely confessing to molesting and murdering his 3 year old baby Riley. His "confession" was extracted after tens of hours of interrogation, with no lawyer and no way for him to leave the interview room.

Don't believe him? How about the families of these victims - names that I am sure you will recognize: Polly Klass, Elizabeth Smart, Jaycee Dugard, Jessica Lunsford, Shawn Devlin, Shasta and Dylan Groene. In each of these cases, the families were in the crosshairs of LE. I mention these particular cases because in EACH of them, it has been proven that the families were innocent. There are literally THOUSANDS of other cases where there simply is not enough evidence, but the family is still being harassed and stalked by LE, in some cases many years later.

The interview techniques used are the same strategy that are well documented as being psychological brainwashing techniques. Some innocent people will succumb to the techniques, some will not. But when a person is under the most severe emotional stress imaginable (such as having your CHILD missing) the brain is unreliable. There is no way to predict who will crack under the pressure and who will not. But the second someone cracks, it is all over. Once a confession (or semi--confession) is reached, it's over. Even a confession from the true killer will not always supersede the "confession" of a family member - even if the "confession" is immediately retracted.

I have no doubt that LE has good motivations. I don't believe that any of them deliberately try to pin a murder on an innocent person. But they have the same statistics that you do. MOST cases are perpetrated by family members. MOST. Not all. But when all other "reasonable" thoughts are exhausted, naturally they will re-explore the family. And it is no long leap to go from: there is no evidence that someone else did it" to "they MUST have done it".

So, feel free to think what you want. No one can stop you. But having some compassion for a grieving family until and unless they are actually proven to have harmed their child, can never be the wrong approach. And, having some healthy skepticism about LE is just self-preservation, in my opinion.
 
  • #250
They're coming up again on the Today Show here on the east coast, live interview.

This is probably why the video isn't loaded to the web yet.
 
  • #251
Today is rerunning the video in the 3rd hr. They just announced it!

wm
 
  • #252
I really can see what Debbie and Jeremy are saying about needing a break from questioning. I'm sure it's grueling.....and, maybe LE --even though it sounds cruel--decided to run with that to put even more pressure on them since they seemingly don't have any leads at all. They have to do what they have to do to find Lisa......

I don't even know if that makes sense...I need caffeine.

I can't believe LE wouln't have compassion. Are they that tough on parents of missing children?
 
  • #253
Well, it would seem to me now, that the ball is back in LE's court. The parents have said on national tv that they are still willing to talk to LE. LE left things yesterday at "our door is always open"

As the professional investigators, LE needs to take this opportunity and approach the parents to try to continue to work with them as the parents have announced they are perfectly willing.

Hope this doesn't turn into a pissing match with LE waiting for the parents to come ask for their continued help and parents sitting waiting for LE to come ask for their help. Meanwhile, this baby is out there somewhere, in the wind. :(
 
  • #254
Good morning, all. Praying Pumpkin Pie is found today.

RobinRoberts Robin Roberts
KC Police claim the parents of missing baby Lisa Irwin are not helping. Had a very candid conversation with the parents on @GMA this morn
29 minutes ago


GMA Good Morning America
"I just want her to come home. Our focus is Lisa ... Whatever I’ve got to do to get her home, we’ll do it." -Deborah Bradley on @GMA
3 minutes ago
Except that they both resume cooperating with LE, no matter what.......

(apparently)
 
  • #255
Re the video from Today show. I watch every am and they usually re-run 1st hr vids in the 3rd hr and don't post them to the site until after the 2nd run.

Both BeanE and I are watching for it and will post ASAP!

wm :)

Thanks and that makes sense to me now as it will hold the viewers to the box (commercials and all that).
 
  • #256
More from Today show:

Bradley also admitted on Friday that she had failed a voluntary lie-detector test that was administered by police.

“They said that I failed, and I continue to say that’s not possible because I don’t know where she’s at,’’ Bradley said. “I did not do this. I don’t remember which one (question) it was. They just kept saying I failed, I failed, and I said that’s not possible. What do you say when someone tells you that, and you know you didn’t do anything?’’

Irwin has not taken a lie-detector test but said he would undergo one if necessary.
“I’d be willing to do whatever it takes to bring my daughter Lisa home where she belongs, and if that’s what it takes, that’s what we can do,’’ Irwin said.

“We don’t care what anybody says or thinks, or what (police) think,’’ Bradley said. “Our concern is to find our Lisa and bring her home because that’s what we want. I don’t care what we have to go through to get it.’’

I don't put much store in polys - look at the recent case of Breeane Rodregez (forgive spelling) the parents failed a poly test in that case and it turned out to be their neighbour -
 
  • #257
when I watched the today show video I also noted that Debbie said she couldn't fill in gaps (it was around the time of answering questions about the LDT) but the reporter didn't pick up on it. Will be interesting to see the transcript.

LE was most likely trying to fill in those gaps of time...

moo
 
  • #258
I can't believe LE wouln't have compassion. Are they that tough on parents of missing children?

Yes, IMO they are if they have turned up no real leads then they lean heavily back into the parents. Sometimes warranted and sometimes not.
 
  • #259
Well, it would seem to me now, that the ball is back in LE's court. The parents have said on national tv that they are still willing to talk to LE. LE left things yesterday at "our door is always open"

As the professional investigators, LE needs to take this opportunity and approach the parents to try to continue to work with them as the parents have announced they are perfectly willing.

Hope this doesn't turn into a pissing match with LE waiting for the parents to come ask for their continued help and parents sitting waiting for LE to come ask for their help. Meanwhile, this baby is out there somewhere, in the wind. :(

Me too, tlcox. I really hope this is all cleared up this morning. While I can understands reasons that would make both sides mad, I would hope that finding this missing baby is much more important than hard feelings.
 
  • #260
How old are their boys who also live in the home? Just wondering if the boys know anything.
 
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