Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - #6

[Bit of hope]

Speaking of motorcycles and criminal organizations, like many other parts of the country around here in the 60's, 70's and on up into the 80's we had a thing known as the biker wars.
I will not call them by name for the obvious reasons but one of these organizations had a hold on North Carolina and Florida and a rival was over South Carolina and I think Georgia too. Anyway they were going at it hot and heavy.
These people were very territorial, highly aggressive, and had no mercy on anyone they perceived as being a threat and this included even law enforcement.
Some people may not believe it but in those days just doing something as simple as riding a bike in South Carolina while wearing a shirt with anything to do with Florida on it could have been enough to got you killed especially if you were a stranger and hanging around the area for too long. Now if just passing through on the interstate you would probably be alright. And yea they would have known what to do with the bike too.
The main thing that makes me doubt a scenario like this one is the fact that the female victim was unscathed up to the point of her murder. They probably wouldn't have killed her, at least not right then. I'm not trying to sound sordid or anything like that but it's the truth.

I think it's not a far fetched theory at all. Your last sentence, I think is spot on though. It's indeed not very likely that they would have killed her executing style, if she was a total stranger, just passing thought. As far as we know she was not sexually assaulted and in the pictures she has her clothes on.

 

[Sweetluv]

Execution style in my opinion. They did not fire into the face or head..wanted them recognizable to the right people...like sending a message. As for the rest of us, they wanted these two to remain unknown. No wallet or purse, as if they took their identification..license, credit cards...
Maybe they lived a life of drug running...or the opposite, undercover agents who were figured out. Could be why the guy with the gun was let go so easily and why their case isnt pursued by law enforcement.

 

[Ozoner]

Execution style in my opinion. They did not fire into the face or head..wanted them recognizable to the right people...like sending a message. As for the rest of us, they wanted these two to remain unknown. No wallet or purse, as if they took their identification..license, credit cards...
Maybe they lived a life of drug running...or the opposite, undercover agents who were figured out. Could be why the guy with the gun was let go so easily and why their case isnt pursued by law enforcement.

I'm not sure I follow. If they were undercover agents, why wouldn't their murders have been vigorously prosecuted, eventually (after the undercover operation ended) if not immediately after Henry was apprehended?

 

[Sweetluv]

I feel that something isnt right about this case, so i think of every angle...almost like a cover up or protection of some sort. To me, not alot of effort put into solving.....and letting Henry go so easily....

 

[Sweetluv]

The drug running seems more plausible....but i feel like im missing something....

 

[Ozoner]

I feel that something isnt right about this case, so i think of every angle...almost like a cover up or protection of some sort. To me, not a lot of effort put into solving.....and letting Henry go so easily....

I don't agree that there was a lack of effort initially. After all, their bodies were kept on public display for over a year. However, most of the effort went into trying to identify the victims. If the crime wasn't a random crime of opportunity (which it very likely was), then identification of the victims might have led to their killers, so the strategy was a sound one. After a while, LE moved on because there were no family members or other members of the public clamoring for justice. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
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Henry seemed to have an alibi for the night of the killings, and LE couldn't prove that he had had the gun in his possession on the night of the crime, so they not no choice but to let him go. He was a "good ol' boy," so LE would have had to work hard to get anyone in the community to inform on him.
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Henry's alibi is the most perplexing part of the case for me. Either the witnesses were wrong about the time he was at the hospital, or someone else had his gun that night. If he lent his gun to someone and then lied about it to LE, then it must have been someone very close to him or someone he feared. Henry admitted to filing the serial numbers off of the gun, and I doubt that he would do that to protect anyone other than himself or a member of his immediate family.

 

[T rex]

I don't agree that there was a lack of effort initially. After all, their bodies were kept on public display for over a year. However, most of the effort went into trying to identify the victims. If the crime wasn't a random crime of opportunity (which it very likely was), then identification of the victims might have led to their killers, so the strategy was a sound one. After a while, LE moved on because there were no family members or other members of the public clamoring for justice. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
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Henry seemed to have an alibi for the night of the killings, and LE couldn't prove that he had had the gun in his possession on the night of the crime, so they not no choice but to let him go. He was a "good ol' boy," so LE would have had to work hard to get anyone in the community to inform on him.
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Henry's alibi is the most perplexing part of the case for me. Either the witnesses were wrong about the time he was at the hospital, or someone else had his gun that night. If he lent his gun to someone and then lied about it to LE, then it must have been someone very close to him or someone he feared. Henry admitted to filing the serial numbers off of the gun, and I doubt that he would do that to protect anyone other than himself or a member of his immediate family.

Yes, Henry had a solid alibi and a polygraph indicated he was being truthful when he said that he didn't actually commit this crime. Those two things together would be fairly strong in his defense. I believe the serial number on the gun had probably been filed off prior to all of this because it doesn't help to cover up a murder as it does not change the ballistics. It was probably to keep it from being traced back to a theft.
As for this being a random crime or a cover up, I'm still about 50/50 on that. If they were killed for their mode of transportation I was wondering why not a boat? This would make some sense. There was a major hurricane that very night, it could have forced them to dock and come inland. If they were in the vicinity of the Caribbean it could have flushed them out, they headed up the east coast but the storm followed and they had no choice or coming down from the north on a collision course with it. It could also explain why they had no identification on them. Not only to keep them unidentified but also used to get what was wanted. I'm sure many of you like myself have come to a realization and that is there's a lot of people out there that could pass for these victims. Especially the male. It wouldn't have been hard for the right people to use their id's at some dock, gain access to their boat and then just sail away.
However there's the evidence that suggest they were out west and this would lead one to believe they were traveling on land.
I don't know. There's a lot of possibilities here.

 

[Ozoner]

Yes, Henry had a solid alibi and a polygraph indicated he was being truthful when he said that he didn't actually commit this crime. Those two things together would be fairly strong in his defense. I believe the serial number on the gun had probably been filed off prior to all of this because it doesn't help to cover up a murder as it does not change the ballistics. It was probably to keep it from being traced back to a theft.
As for this being a random crime or a cover up, I'm still about 50/50 on that. If they were killed for their mode of transportation I was wondering why not a boat? This would make some sense. There was a major hurricane that very night, it could have forced them to dock and come inland. If they were in the vicinity of the Caribbean it could have flushed them out, they headed up the east coast but the storm followed and they had no choice or coming down from the north on a collision course with it. It could also explain why they had no identification on them. Not only to keep them unidentified but also used to get what was wanted. I'm sure many of you like myself have come to a realization and that is there's a lot of people out there that could pass for these victims. Especially the male. It wouldn't have been hard for the right people to use their id's at some dock, gain access to their boat and then just sail away.
However there's the evidence that suggest they were out west and this would lead one to believe they were traveling on land.
I don't know. There's a lot of possibilities here.

A boat would be plausible if not for the potential eyewitness accounts of them in the area. The campground manager is the main witness, but then there's the possible sighting of them at a fruit stand with a motorcycle. There's also the Grant's Truck Stop mechanic up in Nebraska (?) who thinks that he worked on the couple's car.
The campground manager said that Jacques tried to sell him his ring, which suggests that the two were low on cash; that would fit with their being estranged from their families.
If they were out of cash, where would they have stayed after leaving the campground? In their car, if they had one? In a tent, pitched in somebody's field? Would they have resorted to stealing gasoline or trying to run some kind of con (fake lottery tickets, etc.)? I still think carjacking or motorcycle-jacking would make the most sense, but with no sexual assault and a seemingly impersonal double murder, I also would not rule out the possibility of vigilantism.

 

[Sweetluv]

Why though the overkill?
Three shots each
Also, her outfit and footwear do not sound as if though they were hitchhiking.
Do we know the time of day they were seen at the fruit stand and estimated time of death?

 

[T rex]

A boat would be plausible if not for the potential eyewitness accounts of them in the area. The campground manager is the main witness, but then there's the possible sighting of them at a fruit stand with a motorcycle. There's also the Grant's Truck Stop mechanic up in Nebraska (?) who thinks that he worked on the couple's car.
The campground manager said that Jacques tried to sell him his ring, which suggests that the two were low on cash; that would fit with their being estranged from their families.
If they were out of cash, where would they have stayed after leaving the campground? In their car, if they had one? In a tent, pitched in somebody's field? Would they have resorted to stealing gasoline or trying to run some kind of con (fake lottery tickets, etc.)? I still think carjacking or motorcycle-jacking would make the most sense, but with no sexual assault and a seemingly impersonal double murder, I also would not rule out the possibility of vigilantism.

I'm aware that there was a possible sighting at a fruit stand and it may be the most reliable because the coroner found fruit in their stomach contents but I've never heard the version about a motorcycle. In fact the only account of it I remember seeing the witness not only said they didn't know what transportation the couple had but couldn't even be sure if it was just the two of them or if they were accompanied by someone.
I am also aware there was a Grants Truck Stop in Nebraska but did not know the mechanic who may have worked on their vehicle was a Grants employee. Just a mechanic from Nebraska is all I've ever heard.
If you could please provide the links because either one of these things would be significant, at least it would be to me because I've never heard of it. Although it doesn't seem very likely that both would be accurate.

 

[T rex]

While on the subject of Grants Truck Stop I thought I would take the opportunity to make this post.
It is the obituary for the owner John Grant. I do not think that it would be outside of the rules seeing as how there was physical evidence found on the victim with his name on it and connected to his business. However the mods may decide to take it down.
I noticed a few little things, probably doesn't mean anything but it says him and his family once lived in N.C. and this crime occurred on his 50th birthday. Just coincidence? Probably.

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/95779824/john-gow-grant

 

[Ozoner]

I'm aware that there was a possible sighting at a fruit stand and it may be the most reliable because the coroner found fruit in their stomach contents but I've never heard the version about a motorcycle. In fact the only account of it I remember seeing the witness not only said they didn't know what transportation the couple had but couldn't even be sure if it was just the two of them or if they were accompanied by someone.
I am also aware there was a Grants Truck Stop in Nebraska but did not know the mechanic who may have worked on their vehicle was a Grants employee. Just a mechanic from Nebraska is all I've ever heard.
If you could please provide the links because either one of these things would be significant, at least it would be to me because I've never heard of it. Although it doesn't seem very likely that both would be accurate.

According to this site, the mechanic was in York, Nebraska, where the Grant's Truck Stop was located. He may not have been a Grant's employee. Still, his being from the same town is enough for me to consider his identification plausible.
SUMTER MYSTERY COUPLE....WHO ARE THEY?
I believe I read the same thing in one of the newspapers articles about the case that's available online.

The motorcycle was mentioned a while back in what of these threads; I'll leave it to you to dig for that, if you wish. It may not be reliable considering the clothing of the Does; they weren't dressed like bikers.

 

[Sweetluv]

The shoes too don't fit comfortable for hitchhiking or MC riding...pink wedged sandals

 

[Ozoner]

The shoes too don't fit comfortable for hitchhiking or MC riding...pink wedged sandals

A car would actually make more sense. If they were parked somewhere overnight, sleeping in their car along a country lane, then they would have made an easy target for car thieves.

 

[T rex]

It seems that George Henry had a 1st cousin living in Mallory SC which is 7 miles from Latta and in the same county. I don't know how I overlooked it all this time. Maybe because there is not a direct link between the two I have posted here but still yet I feel like I should have come across it along time ago. Oh well.

Mary Lucille Henry Rippy (1915-2000) - Find A...

William A. Henry (1892-1957) - Find A Grave...

 

[ssnva1]

Who dunnit?? ‍

 

[AliceInPain]

The shoes too don't fit comfortable for hitchhiking or MC riding...pink wedged sandals

I hitchhiked a lot all over Europe when I was younger and "comfortable" was not yet a word in my dictionary. My favourite shoes were stiletto boots so that's what I was wearing. I don't feel this couple were hitchhiking, but it can't be ruled out because of her shoes. Young people can be very irrational and weird.
I came across this old Italian ad and I immediately thought of the Sumter does. I hope some day soon we can see pictures of them alive and smiling.
Does anyone know if any of the dna genealogy people are involved in their case?

 

[Ginger21]

I hitchhiked a lot all over Europe when I was younger and "comfortable" was not yet a word in my dictionary. My favourite shoes were stiletto boots so that's what I was wearing. I don't feel this couple were hitchhiking, but it can't be ruled out because of her shoes. Young people can be very irrational and weird.
I came across this old Italian ad and I immediately thought of the Sumter does. I hope some day soon we can see pictures of them alive and smiling.
Does anyone know if any of the dna genealogy people are involved in their case?
View attachment 188953

I don't believe anyone is currently working on them. They've been submitted to dna doe project but I didn't see anything saying that ddp has started this case. Based on a google search it doesn't look like anyone else is but I could be wrong.

 

[Sweetluv]

So they knew they weren't brother and sister through DNA, correct? If so, does anyone know why they couldn't extract anymore genetic information? Sorry, I'm not too knowledgeable on how this all works

 

[Ginger21]

So they knew they weren't brother and sister through DNA, correct? If so, does anyone know why they couldn't extract anymore genetic information? Sorry, I'm not too knowledgeable on how this all works

They tested their dna close to the beginning of the case I believe. They were able to figure out they weren't related but didn't have the technology to do dna tests like today. I could be wrong on the times. Their original dna extraction is probably too deteriorated for them to be able to run through a dna database which is why they haven't submitted it yet.