NC - Zahra Clare Baker, 10, Hickory, 9 Oct. 2010 #39

[Kat]

Insanity Plea use in North Carolina:

NORTH CAROLINA The state uses the M'Naghten Rule. The burden of proof is on the defendant.

M'Naghten rule (long, boring confusing version)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M'Naghten_Rules

The easiest for me to understand (have seen this explained this way over the years)

http://criminal.findlaw.com/crimes/more-criminal-topics/insanity-defense/the-mnaghten-rule.html


snipped from link directly above:

"Every man is to be presumed to be sane, and ... that to establish a defense on the ground of insanity, it must be clearly proved that, at the time of the committing of the act, the party accused was laboring under such a defect of reason, from disease of mind, and not to know the nature and quality of the act he was doing; or if he did know it, that he did not know he was doing what was wrong."

I can't imagine how this can be presented by her lawyers (with a straight face no less).

I haven't seen that she was diagnosed with a mental illness.

I haven't seen it reported that she has had serial breaks with reality.

The coverup, ransom note...etc. Would go to show sanity.

JMHO.

Still searching NC Penal code and etc...

There looks like there was a bill presented to assembly that wanted to change the not guilty by insanity to a guilty but insane (some kind of wording) option. Don't know if that was passed.

 

[tlcya]

Are you there Goth.... it's me Elisa ....

:sick::sick::sick:

I took the evening off from WS .. but had to check MSM before bed and I think our little gothic fairy snorted some fairy dust or something.

The tone of these letters is so friggin' childish and self indulgent that I can't stand it. If I didn't know better I'd think EB was my mother. :sick::sick::sick::furious::furious

I'm off to bed before I get thinking too much about how alike they are.

Please let Zahra be found and laid to rest. I have no clue who in this circus act has harmed her at this point, but I just want her to have peace and justice.

Let it go and just rest kay? G'night.

 

[impatientredhead]

EB is surely mentally ill.
EB is not criminally insane.
Those two are worlds apart.

Criminally insane impacts guilt, she is not criminally insane.
Mentally ill could be introduced during sentencing depending on what she is convicted of, but most people who are convicted have mental or emotional histories. I don't think it will be relevant.

You can think you are a vampire.
But when you cover up your vampire crimes, you are criminally sane.

 

[Oriah]

Wow, I just want to give a shout out to our mods. I know how tired I am you. You guys must be right up there.

Thank you for doing what you do.

 

[tehcloser]

Insane nope, drugged at the time - well, most of the time - yep. IMO.

 

[ynotdivein]

Yep you're right!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Gein

Edward Theodore "Ed" Gein (pronounced /ˈɡiːn/; August 27, 1906 – July 26, 1984) was an American murderer and body snatcher. His crimes, which he committed around his hometown of Plainfield, Wisconsin, garnered widespread notoriety after authorities discovered Gein had exhumed corpses from local graveyards and fashioned trophies and keepsakes from their bones and skin.

So Eric Gein emulates his hero by exhuming information from wackjob killers and fashioning trophies and keepsakes from their memoirs and letters?

 

[alwaysonmymind]

Maybe if your mail has been confiscated, an inmate must be informed or something?

ETA NO CLUE just know that when mailinga legal document to an inmate it is addressed to their inmate number, the facility, the address, the city, state across the top in bold all caps is LEGAL MAIL, but even THAT I think is subject to review by jail personnel before receipt.

FWIW, legal mail is hand delivered to the inmate, unopened. The inmate must open it in the presence of the detention officer.

 

[Suthrnqt]

From my experience, once you are in you have now become "property of the DOC". They don't have to tell you anything and they be sure to let you know that.

I work in the corrections field, and ALL mail is opened and read before it is delivered to the inmate. And EB should thank her lucky stars that she is on lock back and not general population. She wouldn't survive one day there.

 

[Paulette]

Do I hear "insanity" plea coming DOWN the pike from EB's attorney?

Is the any evidence that she'll need one? I haven't seen one iota of evidence against her? So what that she wrote that note -- Where was he when she wrote it? Getting his beauty rest? Or at her elbow?

 

[sweetmop]

I do not believe she is insane; with the qualifier being the definition of "legally insane". She would have to NOT KNOW the difference between right and wrong. She very clearly knows the difference between right and wrong in a lot of her statements: "what he did was horrifying"; "I admitted to writing the note"; "after the fact".

Plus just writing the note - she was covering up something she knew was wrong.

Nope, she sure ain't insane.

I agree 100%! She isn't insane.
And, her lawyers really have their work cut out for them.

 

[Nancy2441]

EB has all the classic signs of a true sociopath. But the must telling is the complete lack of empathy for poor little Zahra. It's all about her! It's all that matters in her sick twisted mind. I have been unfortunate to have had two sociopaths in my life. If you listen to sociopaths they are always the victims.

http://www.lovefraud.com/01_whatsaSociopath/key_symptoms_sociopath.html

 

[Suthrnqt]

FWIW, legal mail is hand delivered to the inmate, unopened. The inmate must open it in the presence of the detention officer.

In our detention center, ALL mail is opened before going to the inmate. If any contraband is discovered, it is confiscated.

 

[tlcya]

If the power were off it would look desolate anyway. And maybe they were only leaving at night? Who knows, it was just a thought. There has to be a reason the blankets and the tooth brushes were in there.

PURE SPECULATION BELOW

Perhaps one of them were kicked out or too disturbed to be there and so slept in the vehicle?

PURE SPECULATION ABOVE

Anyone want to lay odds on whether allegedy EB would leave behind her warm waterbed?

 

[Pondering Mind]

From my experience, at least regarding/incoming mail to a jail/prison..which as I mentioned is limited to books and magazines..the jailers have MUCHO leeway, imo to what they can/won't allow in as far as content. That can be such a gray area that could be used to punish an inmate or to the advantage of LE.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I really think that if Zahra's body had been decomposing in the house for any significant period of time, there would have had to be some lingering smell that LE would have noticed during the first search (and for sure the dogs would have hit on). Am I wrong?

JMO

If it were decomposing.

 

[tlcya]

In our detention center, ALL mail is opened before going to the inmate. If any contraband is discovered, it is confiscated.

wonder if opened is the same as read line for line?

 

[Virgogalsue]

With all the excitement and interest in EB's letters did anyone else notice information on the search today?
The news reporter said they were back near where Z's leg was found and that the search had been generated by 3 new leads.
At the very end of the newsclip it shows officers looking at a black garbage bag in a hole in the gound!!!


http://www.wsoctv.com/video/25609778/index.html

approx 2:29-2:34

 

[ynotdivein]

Insane nope, drugged at the time - well, most of the time - yep. IMO.

Insane? Nope. They both knew the difference between right and wrong, enough to concoct not one but TWO attempts at staging the kidnapping discovery!

They both knew a dead Zahra was wrong enough that they apparently went to great lengths to conceal her corpse!

They are both aware enough of right and wrong that she is trying her damndest to frame him, and he can't say a thing because he'll incriminate himself! (Yes that last is IMO.)

Sick, depraved, without conscience, yes. Insane, not even one little bit.

:snooty:

 

[Wise Old Owl]

IMO EB has crossed the line from sociopath to psychopath. A lot of sociopaths "function" in society without ever committing a crime - psychopaths "go that extra mile" and not only commit crimes - but very horrific and heinous ones at that.

 

[MountainChick]

From my experience, at least regarding/incoming mail to a jail/prison..which as I mentioned is limited to books and magazines..the jailers have MUCHO leeway, imo to what they can/won't allow in as far as content. That can be such a gray area that could be used to punish an inmate or to the advantage of LE.

Agreed Pondering. It is purely discretionary as to how far they may go with leniency and varies from one institution to another. IMO