Found Deceased NEW ZEALAND - Grace Millane, 22, British backpacker, Auckland, 1 Dec 2018 *Arrest* #2

[mrjitty]

Gosh. Really?

This is some thin gruel

 

[jamjim]

"9:59am - The professor is now touching on "breath play" or erotic aspyhixation, which she describes as the restriction of breath during sex. She says experts consider this as something that "needs to be considered carefully".

Prof Smith says it heightens sensations, makes the heart race, makes the skin tingle and creates a powerless feeling for the person having their breath restricted. The purpose isn't, however, to make someone feel fearful.

Both women and men are known to enjoy this practise, but people remain reluctant to talk about the pleasure associated with it.

Outside of specialist literature, Prof Smith says there isn't a lot of detail available in the mainstream for people to know how to partake in erotic asphixation safely."

Grace Millane murder trial: Live updates as defence's overseas witnesses stream into court

 

[RubyLee87]

It depends. I use Bumble very occasionally which is basically the same as Tinder, but apparently a bit softer and more feminist (women have to make the first move amongst other things).

Anyway, I don't think I've seen anything that explicit but I've seen things on women's profiles that say something like "bicurious, in a relationship, looking for a threesome" Bumble also lets you filter by what the person is looking for, ie, a hookup, a relationship, casual dating etc. I'd imagine tinder is similar.

I think the only search filters on Tinder are age, gender and distance. But like Bumble, there’s nothing to stop you writing ‘looking for hookups/ relationship / BDSM’ etc on your bio. Suppose you could make your preferences pretty clear if you wanted to.

 

[flutterby]

I really wish people would stop referencing 50 Shades as some kind of BDSM bible.

It's an absolutely awful example of BDSM, Christian Gray is awful in that book. It's an abuse manual in my mind.

In my experiences, the bottom/sub actually has *all* of the power. Safe words are always respected otherwise the relationship breaks down.

Perhaps ironically, given that it's been used as a example in court, that didn't happen to Ana in the book, and it appears so for Grace in real life too

IMO

 

[jamjim]

"10:12am - Under cross-examination, the professor of sexual cultures tells the jury that BDSM is common in society. But just because someone is interested in BDSM, that does not mean they are interested in the extreme elements of it. BDSM covers a wide spectrum of practices."

Grace Millane murder trial: Live updates as defence's overseas witnesses stream into court

 

[DanceCard]

I really wish people would stop referencing 50 Shades as some kind of BDSM bible.

It's an absolutely awful example of BDSM, Christian Gray is awful in that book. It's an abuse manual in my mind.

In my experiences, the bottom/sub actually has *all* of the power. Safe words are always respected otherwise the relationship breaks down.

Perhaps ironically, given that it's been used as a example in court, that didn't happen to Ana in the book, and it appears so for Grace in real life too

IMO

Thanks for making this point. Gray is a terrible Dom, I completely agree with your assessment of the book as an abuse manual rather than an accurate portrayal of BDSM

 

[jamjim]

"10:21am - Crown prosecutor Robin McCoubrey reads out some of the statement from Millane's former partner talking about their practice of a form of BDSM. In the statement, read to the court on Tuesday, the man says the pair researched how to safely engage in such practices, including the importance of having a safe word. Prof Smith says these are sensible precautions."

Grace Millane murder trial: Live updates as defence's overseas witnesses stream into court

 

[jamjim]

"10:28am - Safety should be a focus during breath play, Prof Smith says while being re-examined by defence lawyer Ron Mansfield. But she tells the jury that often "in the heat of the moment, [safe practise] may not happen".

She says sometimes desire overrides someone's sensible head. Mixing alcohol and drugs into the encounter can often mean people get carried away, the professor says.

Prof Smith has now finished giving evidence.

The court is now taking a break. The public gallery is now full."

Grace Millane murder trial: Live updates as defence's overseas witnesses stream into court

 

[Mariposa]

So what do we think is the defense thesis that Prof Smith is there for?

He got carried away and didn’t know how to do it safely?

I go back to the murder definition of recklessly causing great bodily injury. This guy was 26 and no naif to dating apparently. Is the jury to think he was unclear that restricting her breath for 3-10 min was reasonably likely to cause serious injury or death?

I don’t think ‘I was too turned on and or intoxicated’ is a valid legal defense to murder by strangling.

 

[flutterby]

Am I allowed to share a blog? I'm on my phone and not sure how to quote/can't do it very easily, but my goodness, this woman should have been called by the defence as an witness.

It's actually about another case, but so much applies to Grace.

A Word About Safety • Up Front • Public Address

 

[LucyRocket]

Under cross examination, Crown lawyer Robin McCoubrey asks the witness how common BDSM practices are.

"I'm not suggesting there is a massive uptake in 24/7 lifestyle choices but certainly there is a lot of interest in it," Smith replies.

"It's a spectrum of interest, some people only dabble."

An American research paper claims 20 - 25 per cent of the US population is involved in BDSM, McCoubrey continues.

"So if we assume 320 million people, that's a lot of people who are interested in it. I mean, 50 Shades of Grey sold 125 million copies. I'm assuming not everyone hated it."

McCoubrey then asks if Smith had considered evidence provided by one of Grace's ex-partners, which was read to the jury yesterday.

The statement read that Grace and the witness researched safe practices and had a safe word and a "tapping practice" to indicate when either of them felt uncomfortable.

It also said Grace didn't trust anyone on dating apps enough to try the practice with them.

All of the evidence, Smith agrees, demonstrates safe practices and precautions.

BBM

Grace Millane murder trial: Defence case continues with more expert witnesses

 

[LucyRocket]

11:15am - Court has resumed with a man entering the witness box who met Millane while she was in New Zealand. The 29-year-old - whose name is suppressed - resides in Auckland.

He came to know Millane through his work in Auckland and through discussing her travels. The man eventually began messaging with Millane on Facebook in late November, 2018.

Grace Millane murder trial: Live updates as defence's overseas witnesses stream into court

 

[flutterby]

Have any of the witnesses been named so far, except the experts?

I feel like every single person has had their name surpressed except poor Grace whose whole character has been judged

 

[LucyRocket]

Someone was named. One of the early ladies, I'm sure

 

[Mariposa]

Have any of the witnesses been named so far, except the experts?

I feel like every single person has had their name surpressed except poor Grace whose whole character has been judged

There was that female friend of hers who gave evidence about texting with Grace during Grace’s last night out. Her name wasn’t suppressed.

 

[LucyRocket]

The next witness, who has name suppression, went on a date with Grace the night before she died.

The pair met at Base Backpackers hostel where Grace was staying in Auckland and, after sharing contact details, they agreed to meet on November 30, 2018.

They first went to McDonalds and then went back to his house to watch a film in his room.

During the film, they started kissing, which led to sex.

The witness describes the sex as "normal" and says he had his hand "potentially" on Grace's neck.

He says he can't remember "100 per cent" if he put his hand around Grace's neck but it's something he does "a lot of the time" with other women because they enjoy it.

He doesn't discuss doing it with the girls before doing it, he says, but says it's a common thing he does.

Grace Millane murder trial: Defence case continues with more expert witnesses

 

[jamjim]

DBM

 

[LucyRocket]

For Pity's sake. I don't know how much more of this I can bear

 

[Mariposa]

The next witness, who has name suppression, went on a date with Grace the night before she died.

The pair met at Base Backpackers hostel where Grace was staying in Auckland and, after sharing contact details, they agreed to meet on November 30, 2018.

They first went to McDonalds and then went back to his house to watch a film in his room.

During the film, they started kissing, which led to sex.

The witness describes the sex as "normal" and says he had his hand "potentially" on Grace's neck.

He says he can't remember "100 per cent" if he put his hand around Grace's neck but it's something he does "a lot of the time" with other women because they enjoy it.

He doesn't discuss doing it with the girls before doing it, he says, but says it's a common thing he does.

Grace Millane murder trial: Defence case continues with more expert witnesses

So why is this good for the accused? Grace survived this other date in good health. Or are they trying to paint her as a bad girl who was kinkily having one night stands every night?

If Grace was on tape saying to the defendant “Hey, strangle me to the brink of death” guess what? Still a murder.

 

[Edinlass]

Yeah I agree this witness is pointless, and without a doubt just the defence clutching at straws again trying to paint Grace in a negative light. Shame on them.