GUILTY NH - AH, 14, North Conway, 9 October 2013 - # 5

[bessie]

i'm not sure...maybe a tech expert can weigh in. afaik, they can pull the luds meaning the time/type of communication (call at 2:00, text at 3:00, et cetera) but not the actual content (either the voice conversation or the written messages).

don't really know. anyone?

Very few carriers retain the content of text messages, and then only briefly. Give me a minute and I'll post a link which explains.

 

[Rivernh]

I used to work as regional manager for a major cell phone company. LE can retrieve text messages a carrier with a warrant. We would get requests all the time for people wanting to get copies of text messages on their own account, but it can only be done with a warrant.

I would think that they have a warrant for Abby's cell phone texts.

 

[Mom24]

Very few carriers retain the content of text messages, and then only briefly. Give me a minute and I'll post a link which explains.

Yes, the texts themselves are not saved by the phone company.

 

[bessie]

i'm not sure...maybe a tech expert can weigh in. afaik, they can pull the luds meaning the time/type of communication (call at 2:00, text at 3:00, et cetera) but not the actual content (either the voice conversation or the written messages).

don't really know. anyone?

Note, this is dated 2010.

Retention Periods of Major Cellular Service Providers


ETA: http://blogs.computerworld.com/1901...rovider_store_data_for_law_enforcement_access

 

[Donna64]

I'm guessing they would need a warrant to get a hold of the bf's phone. If they didn't do that then its only hearsay from what the bf's dad said. I have never heard LE say we took a look at jimmy's phone. Has anyone else?

 

[rizzo0904]

I bet the NSA can get it.

 

[cluciano63]

Having a bad feeling that we won't be hearing much more about Abigail, other than maybe vigils and volunteers wanting to search. Just feels like LE is really stuck, IMO. Hope I am wrong.

 

[Mom24]

Having a bad feeling that we won't be hearing much more about Abigail, other than maybe vigils and volunteers wanting to search. Just feels like LE is really stuck, IMO. Hope I am wrong.

Kids grow up and realize they aren't in danger, and talk. People might be travelling and not have thought much of something they saw and when they get home and catch up on the news they realize they have something to add. The more it's kept alive in the press, the more people's memories might just be jogged. I really believe someone saw something and may not have realized at the time they were seeing something important. If that person is from out of the area, the news may not have reached them yet. I'm hoping as this becomes more nationally known someone will come forward. Also, like I said if one of her peers saw something they may be afraid to come forward, but that fear will be short lived as they get older. There's a lot of difference between a 14 year and a 16 year old in terms of confidence and fears of adults. I wouldn't be surprised to find out whoever took AH had done things with other young girls in the past and those girls may come forward. But then again, I'm still convinced she went willingly with someone she knew and trusted, someone her family knew and trusted, and that person did her harm. She's 14 with no financial means, no car, no license, no way to work even if she wanted to. So if she had run away she would have had to come back. Besides, after her father's heartbreaking letter there isn't a child out there that wouldn't respond.

 

[MamaJoJo]

I'm guessing they would need a warrant to get a hold of the bf's phone. If they didn't do that then its only hearsay from what the bf's dad said. I have never heard LE say we took a look at jimmy's phone. Has anyone else?

I think LE saw the phone and based their reporting of Abby's last communications based on what they saw. No warrant needed if everyone is cooperating as LE has stated.

There are a few things that are sticking out for me. One is the discrepancy in time of the last text being at 2:52 or 2:53. IIRCC, it's been reported that the last text from AH's phone was at 2:53 and JCSr reports his son received a <3 at 2:52. What could cause that discrepancy? Was AH's last text possibly to another friend?

The second thing that sticks out is why did their communication stop with the heart? Obviously, most of us are thinking that she was abducted shortly after her last text. But wouldn't there have been other texts from JCJr? Maybe there were and LE and JCSr just haven't said. But I was thinking that the only reason there wouldn't have been any other texts from JCJr is if AH made it clear she'd be busy doing something.

I don't know. Just reading over the last few pages where everyone was rehashing the texts got me thinking. If JCJr couldn't get a hold of AH that afternoon, I wonder if he was upset thinking she was ignoring him or if his hinky-meter was going off. I wonder if ZH called the JC family looking for AH or if the Cs called ZH first. Oh, dear Abby, where are you???

 

[Mom24]

Wonder why JCjr hasn't pleaded for her return? I know they've had ZH plea for her to return and RH wrote a letter (some people feel it was directed by LE), why not have JCjr plead as well? I'm not making any inferences regarding him, I'm just wondering from a LE angle why that wouldn't be done? I see a lot of similarities here between this case and Dru Sjodin, in the aspect that the last communication was with the bf, and didn't her bf plea for her return? If there's any chance at all that she may have run away, why not have him say something to entice her to return? I know he's only 14, but peers have so much more impact than parents do at that age. This is why, like others, I'm so saddened to see that her friends don't appear to care that she's missing.
If AH was abducted, it would really help to personalize her by having her bf say something, wouldn't it?

 

[CatFancier]

Wonder why JCjr hasn't pleaded for her return? I know they've had ZH plea for her to return and RH wrote a letter (some people feel it was directed by LE), why not have JCjr plead as well? I'm not making any inferences regarding him, I'm just wondering from a LE angle why that wouldn't be done? I see a lot of similarities here between this case and Dru Sjodin, in the aspect that the last communication was with the bf, and didn't her bf plea for her return? If there's any chance at all that she may have run away, why not have him say something to entice her to return? I know he's only 14, but peers have so much more impact than parents do at that age. This is why, like others, I'm so saddened to see that her friends don't appear to care that she's missing.
If AH was abducted, it would really help to personalize her by having her bf say something, wouldn't it?

I would never allow my 14yo son to make a statement to the media, never.

 

[Donna64]

Right Cat. That is why I am saying whatever JDC told LE is "hearsay". Am I right or wrong on this?

 

[bettiepageturner]

Wonder why JCjr hasn't pleaded for her return? I know they've had ZH plea for her to return and RH wrote a letter (some people feel it was directed by LE), why not have JCjr plead as well? I'm not making any inferences regarding him, I'm just wondering from a LE angle why that wouldn't be done? I see a lot of similarities here between this case and Dru Sjodin, in the aspect that the last communication was with the bf, and didn't her bf plea for her return? If there's any chance at all that she may have run away, why not have him say something to entice her to return? I know he's only 14, but peers have so much more impact than parents do at that age. This is why, like others, I'm so saddened to see that her friends don't appear to care that she's missing.
If AH was abducted, it would really help to personalize her by having her bf say something, wouldn't it?

Good question. He may not want to, or he may have disclosed something to LE that would make his plea a little more challenging to tailor to a strategic narrative. Like if he had a very specific reason for believing Abby was in danger, and Abby and/or the perp knew that. On the other hand, and I don't mean this sarcastically or suspiciously, his dad is definitely using him to garner sympathy/attention (the good kind, for Abby) every time he posts about how hurt he looks every day. It probably is unbelievably traumatic. Imagine if he had been this close to offering to walk with her, but changed his mind and stayed on the bus. At 14, I doubt I would've been able to keep it together in the front of the media were it my significant other missing.

I would never allow my 14yo son to make a statement to the media, never.

Another great point. I bet there's some "he'll come after you next" fears among parents right now.

 

[Mom24]

I would never allow my 14yo son to make a statement to the media, never.

I don't know. I can understand not wanting the media circus, but maybe just a written statement? I do believe the media can't contact the boy directly, right? I know the father has stated that his son misses her and loves her, but it hasn't come from the boy himself. Isn't it common for LE to personalize the victim by having family and friends talk about them? I understand it's much harder when the friends are so young. Hmm...I'm waffling here because on the other hand I wouldn't want to endanger my teen if one of their friends was missing by possible abduction. I see your point, if there is a predator you don't want them fixated on another child.

 

[Hatfield]

I would never allow my 14yo son to make a statement to the media, never.

After seeing news link comments from the public, and how people can pick apart and make all kinds of comments, I totally agree and I would go a step further and probably never comment myself either no matter what age.

Unless I really had something to offer to help find her that is not known to the public and is not being shared by LE. Then, I would take the wrath and provide the info to help find the person.

It is an individual choice of course. And others may choose to do things differently.

It seems strange to me though that the other person is not afraid to go public with their comments and views, so it does make one wonder if they are being prevented from talking or choosing not to say anything.

 

[rebeccaeee]

I don't know. I can understand not wanting the media circus, but maybe just a written statement? I do believe the media can't contact the boy directly, right? I know the father has stated that his son misses her and loves her, but it hasn't come from the boy himself. Isn't it common for LE to personalize the victim by having family and friends talk about them? I understand it's much harder when the friends are so young. Hmm...I'm waffling here because on the other hand I wouldn't want to endanger my teen if one of their friends was missing by possible abduction. I see your point, if there is a predator you don't want them fixated on another child.

I can only compare this to Dylan Redwine. He spent hours texting friends, made plans to meet up with friends and when he did not, those friends knew something was up. The texting established a timeline and placed him in a specific area. When the texting stopped, so did all traces of Dylan. One of his friends shared htose texts with the media three weeks after he disappeared. Same friend was very visible and eloquent with the media but well protected by his parents too. Same friend was expecting to see Dylan early the next morning and knew something was wrong before 7 AM that day. Dylan was not reported missing for nearly 10 more hours but his FRIEND KNEW. And that same friend is pretty traumatized, by all accounts, that he did not raise a louder alarm earlier when Dylan stopped responding to his texts. You cannot place the weight of the world on the shoulders of 14 year olds. It is not their responsibility to keep track of their peers but, by the same token, text patterns and call patterns establish behavior and you can bet that it was unheard of for AH's phone to go silent that early in the afternoon and remain so, with or without a 630 ping/call. Her friends were probably also alarmed and they probably also knew this was out of sorts for her. We don't know b/c they haven't talked to the media but Dylan's friends were absolutely right to be concerned for him when the texting stopped.

 

[white rabbit]

I can only compare this to Dylan Redwine. He spent hours texting friends, made plans to meet up with friends and when he did not, those friends knew something was up. The texting established a timeline and placed him in a specific area. When the texting stopped, so did all traces of Dylan. One of his friends shared htose texts with the media three weeks after he disappeared. Same friend was very visible and eloquent with the media but well protected by his parents too. Same friend was expecting to see Dylan early the next morning and knew something was wrong before 7 AM that day. Dylan was not reported missing for nearly 10 more hours but his FRIEND KNEW. And that same friend is pretty traumatized, by all accounts, that he did not raise a louder alarm earlier when Dylan stopped responding to his texts. You cannot place the weight of the world on the shoulders of 14 year olds. It is not their responsibility to keep track of their peers but, by the same token, text patterns and call patterns establish behavior and you can bet that it was unheard of for AH's phone to go silent that early in the afternoon and remain so, with or without a 630 ping/call. Her friends were probably also alarmed and they probably also knew this was out of sorts for her. We don't know b/c they haven't talked to the media but Dylan's friends were absolutely right to be concerned for him when the texting stopped.

great post. LE has her records and "few clues" tell us either they're lying, for the purposes of the investigation, or she didn't have any contact nor contact worth mentioning for those four hours.

Cell Phone Records Yield Few Clues In Search For Missing Teenager

http://nhpr.org/post/cell-phone-records-yield-few-clues-search-missing-teenager

"WMUR-TV reports that police said Sunday they have not located the girl's phone, but have determined that the last call was made at 6:30 p.m. It's not clear where the call was made."

re-read this article if you have a chance...surfietx, it also established the timeline of agency involvement you had asked for earlier (friday pm, saturday am, et cetera for the first few days).

 

[MamaJoJo]

I can only compare this to Dylan Redwine. He spent hours texting friends, made plans to meet up with friends and when he did not, those friends knew something was up. The texting established a timeline and placed him in a specific area. When the texting stopped, so did all traces of Dylan. One of his friends shared htose texts with the media three weeks after he disappeared. Same friend was very visible and eloquent with the media but well protected by his parents too. Same friend was expecting to see Dylan early the next morning and knew something was wrong before 7 AM that day. Dylan was not reported missing for nearly 10 more hours but his FRIEND KNEW. And that same friend is pretty traumatized, by all accounts, that he did not raise a louder alarm earlier when Dylan stopped responding to his texts. You cannot place the weight of the world on the shoulders of 14 year olds. It is not their responsibility to keep track of their peers but, by the same token, text patterns and call patterns establish behavior and you can bet that it was unheard of for AH's phone to go silent that early in the afternoon and remain so, with or without a 630 ping/call. Her friends were probably also alarmed and they probably also knew this was out of sorts for her. We don't know b/c they haven't talked to the media but Dylan's friends were absolutely right to be concerned for him when the texting stopped.

I couldn't agree with you more. As I said in my post just above, only if JCJr knows she was doing something else that afternoon, would her radio-silence been normal. Whose hinky-meter went off first? Dylan's friends were instrumental in helping form the timeline of Dylan's disappearance.

That being said, unless my child had anything imperative to add, I would not let him make a public statement and I would shut down/privatize any and all social media he has. Too much can be misconstrued.

 

[rebeccaeee]

I couldn't agree with you more. As I said in my post just above, only if JCJr knows she was doing something else that afternoon, would her radio-silence been normal. Whose hinky-meter went off first? Dylan's friends were instrumental in helping form the timeline of Dylan's disappearance.

So much we don't know. JC's dad says his boy knew right away that something was up. AH's mom called the police pretty quickly that night. What we don't know is who was where between 3 and 7 and what calls were made to find Abby. I expect there were plenty of calls looking for her by plenty of people.

 

[dlc]

those texts were to her bf...all of them, IMO. and JMO but that 6:30 call/text/ping did happen...to whom, i don't know...again, fish & game didn't pull that fact out of their behind.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/10/16/fbi-to-release-new-information-in-search-for-missing-nh-girl/

Abby was seen leaving school at 2:29pm last Wednesday and exchanged a series of texts with a classmate between 2:23 and 2:53pm. At 2:35pm, she was seen walking on the power line trail from Eagle&#8217;s Way.

Her last cell phone activity was at 3:07pm when she sent a text message to the same classmate on the west side of Cranmore Mountain.

But one thing has always puzzled me with this, and perhaps it's just a matter of semantics and not relevant. We have a report of Abby exchanging a series of texts with a classmate, and we're told that JCjr saw her "texting away." If the two were texting _each other_ all that time, wouldn't he say that? In other words, there's a "distance" implied by him saying the last time he saw her she was walking, "texting away," rather than "last time I saw her she was walking away and we were texting."

Having trouble putting this the way I want to, but hopefully someone gets what I'm saying.

JMO