Identified! NH - Allenstown, Adult Female, 23-33, & 3 Children, Marlyse Honeychurch, Marie Vaughn, Sarah McWaters, Rea Rasmussen

[carbuff]

I'm guessing that the mother and child who died from poisonous mushrooms were probably murdered and the poison mushrooms was just his story to explain their absence, but the story could be true. "Grass mushrooms" generally refers to the ones in your yard. Many of them can be poisonous. Heads Up: Those Wild Mushrooms Growing in Your Backyard Could Be Toxic

If that was indeed their cause of death, that would likely rate a local news article. I've poked around in Oregon newspapers over the years and never found anything that looked connected, however. Death by mushroom appears to be pretty rare.

But I did find this interesting article about the commercial mushroom-gathering culture in Oregon. The Mushroom Hunters

 

[Alleykins]

I have one vague memory, and I couldn't tell you if I were a kid/teen/young adult when I heard it. The memory is old and so vague. It was a news story on the radio about a family who ate poisonous mushrooms they picked. It was an extended family, if I recall, quite a few people involved, like parents and children, and possible grandparents, as they were part of meal. I don't remember if any of them died, quite possibly they did, but what stuck out is one of the children, a girl, I think, had to have a liver transplant to save her life. I could have heard this any time between the 70s and 90s. Not helpful, I know, but I clearly recall hearing about one in my lifetime, but only one. And I think it was in California.

ETA
This may have been it, from 1996:

Family Poisoned By Eating World's Most Dangerous Mushrooms

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) _ The fuzzy white coating on top of the world's most dangerous mushroom seemed harmless to a mother and her three children.

apnews.com

 

[carbuff]

I was going to suggest this one, from Oregon: One of the rarest forms of mushroom poisoning in...

 

[Springrain]

I realize this is way out there and highly unlikely, but is it possible that MC was killed after Marlyse and the girls?

 

[Alleykins]

I realize this is way out there and highly unlikely, but is it possible that MC was killed after Marlyse and the girls?

I always thought there was something about the MC being found with Marlyse & her daughters that seemed off, because TPR had to have known it was his daughter, or at least suspected. Why else would she be with him? And I personally couldn't see him killing his daughter, intentionally, anyway. He spared D/L, and my thought is because he might have believed she was his daughter, too. So, I don't think it's too farfetched of an idea she may have been killed shortly after, but not too long after because I think they have a ballpark idea they were killed around the same time based on decomposition.

However, I've always wondered if the MC died first, not necessarily maliciously. I came to this conclusion based on what the FBI profiler said about the murders, before they ID'd TPR. She said this was personal, and the person who did this was full of rage against his victims. I can see how he could become angry with Marlyse and her daughters, especially if he were on a bender, but his daughter? No, I can't see him taking out his anger on his own flesh and blood to the same degree he would the others. What I think happened is the MC died by accident and TPR blamed Marlyse for it, and retaliated by killing the other three.

 

[pixiepixel]

I’ve always wondered if Marlyse and Marie were killed first and TPR kept Sarah and MC, who were too young to remember, around to lure in another victim.

 

[JP-Wrath]

I’ve always wondered if Marlyse and Marie were killed first and TPR kept Sarah and MC, who were too young to remember, around to lure in another victim.

Well that's not that far fetched. What I don't see is TPR disposing Sarah alone in a whole barrel and then re-opening it to dispose MC some time later. These two were killed back to back.

 

[Springrain]

Thanks everyone for your theories and opinions! I had assumed they were all killed at the same time until my mind started to wander today. An interesting aspect of the class to ponder I feel.

What I think happened is the MC died by accident and TPR blamed Marlyse for it, and retaliated by killing the other three.

This is an interesting theory and one that I can see as well. I wonder if it could have been something like falling and hitting her head.

I’ve always wondered if Marlyse and Marie were killed first and TPR kept Sarah and MC, who were too young to remember, around to lure in another victim.

This is also another interesting possibility imo and keeping the two younger girls and posing as a "single dad" would fit his MO and help him find another victim.

Lots of facets to explore with this. I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts.

 

[Tired Professor]

Thanks everyone for your theories and opinions! I had assumed they were all killed at the same time until my mind started to wander today. An interesting aspect of the class to ponder I feel.


This is an interesting theory and one that I can see as well. I wonder if it could have been something like falling and hitting her head.

This is also another interesting possibility imo and keeping the two younger girls and posing as a "single dad" would fit his MO and help him find another victim.

Lots of facets to explore with this. I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts

Some very interesting points have been brought up here in these latest posts. Here are some of my random thoughts/questions:

Who are all those kids in the birthday pics? I feel like ID’ing those people would certainly fill in some gaps. If it was indeed Marie’s seventh birthday that would be two weeks after they left California. I cannot imagine this family would move to a new state make a bunch of friends and have them over to a party in such a short period of time. I am almost wondering if this picture is actually a later birthday like maybe her eighth? That would suggest then they were killed after Dec of 79.
Also…
Why keep Dawn/Lisa? Was she close enough in age to be a replacement for MC in case anyone asked him about his daughter? Was his daughter named “Lisa” and he just figured he would try to pass Dawn off as the middle child? Maybe he chose to befriend Denise because she was already pregnant. Could she have had another baby after Dawn and they were the ones that Dawn was talking about who died eating mushrooms?

 

[Springrain]

Why keep Dawn/Lisa? Was she close enough in age to be a replacement for MC in case anyone asked him about his daughter? Was his daughter named “Lisa” and he just figured he would try to pass Dawn off as the middle child? Maybe he chose to befriend Denise because she was already pregnant. Could she have had another baby after Dawn and they were the ones that Dawn was talking about who died eating mushrooms?

RSBM

This is another great thought. IMO, this could be entirely plausible if MC had some resemblance to L/D and was within maybe 1-3 years of the MC's age.

The mushroom thing is super weird and I'm not sure what to make of it...

 

[Tired Professor]

RSBM

This is another great thought. IMO, this could be entirely plausible if MC had some resemblance to L/D and was within maybe 1-3 years of the MC's age.

The mushroom thing is super weird and I'm not sure what to make of it...

Yeah I agree about the mushrooms. I am inclined to think no mushrooms were actually involved but it was a story Dawn/Lisa was told by TPR to explain the disappearance for some persons that were close to her.

 

[pixiepixel]

Some very interesting points have been brought up here in these latest posts. Here are some of my random thoughts/questions:

Who are all those kids in the birthday pics? I feel like ID’ing those people would certainly fill in some gaps. If it was indeed Marie’s seventh birthday that would be two weeks after they left California. I cannot imagine this family would move to a new state make a bunch of friends and have them over to a party in such a short period of time.

IIRC, Marlyse’s father lived in the New England area (Connecticut?) so she was familiar with the area (maybe even lived with him for a bit - I don’t remember). It’s not entirely far fetched to assume the kids in the picture are her paternal relatives.

 

[Alleykins]

D/L remembers a woman with children, but, iirc, she didn't believe the woman was Denise.

I think TPR spared D/L for two reasons, and this is just my opinion. I could way off.

(1) I think he might have thought D/L was his. Now this begs the question, why did he kill the MC, because he most likely thought she was his, too? My answer is, he didn't kill, or intentionally kill, the MC. I'm thinking her death was accidental, and that led to him killing the other three. I could be way off here, but it might explain why he didn't kill D/L.

(2) He doesn't appear to be a typical serial killer, in that I don't think his intention when hooking up with Marlyse was to kill her and her children. From what we can tell right now, from what we know, he didn't murder people for the thrill of it, he didn't hunt people down for the specific purpose of killing them, like Ted Bundy or Henry Lee Lucas. I think he targeted vulnerable women for companionship purposes, and had the propensity to kill them if enraged, but as far as (please forgive the expression) being in it for thrill kills, like most sk's, I don't believe this was TPR. I think his were extreme crimes of passion, in that something set him off and he'd kill in a fit a rage. This opinion is subject to change as more information comes to light.

 

[JP-Wrath]

D/L remembers a woman with children, but, iirc, she didn't believe the woman was Denise.

I think TPR spared D/L for two reasons, and this is just my opinion. I could way off.

(1) I think he might have thought D/L was his. Now this begs the question, why did he kill the MC, because he most likely thought she was his, too? My answer is, he didn't kill, or intentionally kill, the MC. I'm thinking her death was accidental, and that led to him killing the other three. I could be way off here, but it might explain why he didn't kill D/L.

(2) He doesn't appear to be a typical serial killer, in that I don't think his intention when hooking up with Marlyse was to kill her and her children. From what we can tell right now, from what we know, he didn't murder people for the thrill of it, he didn't hunt people down for the specific purpose of killing them, like Ted Bundy or Henry Lee Lucas. I think he targeted vulnerable women for companionship purposes, and had the propensity to kill them if enraged, but as far as (please forgive the expression) being in it for thrill kills, like most sk's, I don't believe this was TPR. I think his were extreme crimes of passion, in that something set him off and he'd kill in a fit a rage. This opinion is subject to change as more information comes to light.

I think so. This isn't the typical sk, in case we can consider him as such.

I believe he got really mad about his first wife leaving and taking the family away from him, to the point of making sure that wasn't happening to him EVER AGAIN (just explaining the mentals, not justifying any criminal action in the slighty).

For years he targeted young mommas with family issues, and isolated them to cut any path of freedom they could have. He abused them and the children, and when things got unbearable for everyone, the worst just happened. Then he probably changed targets as he grew older (not that easy to trick young girls anymore), that's why he got engaged with his last victim, Eunsoon Jun, which he was trying to isolate from everyone too. But unfortunately for him, that was 2002, not the 70s-80s anymore, people had more ways to stay in touch, thus making more suspicious the lack of communication.

Can we rule him out in other crimes? Off course not. Apart from the unconfirmed but very likely victims of him (MC's mother, Denise Beaudin, Dawn/Lisa's not biological mother and siblings) he's major suspect in Denise Daneault&Laureen Rahn disappearances (both lived at walking distance from this at the same time in a quiet town), and has potential connection to San Joaquin Jane Doe. He was many years in the loose between Lisa's abandonment and his relationship with Jun, who knows how many more victims could be, who knows.....

Pd I should've posted this on TPR's dedicated thread instead, but anyway, it's done.

 

[Springrain]

(2) He doesn't appear to be a typical serial killer, in that I don't think his intention when hooking up with Marlyse was to kill her and her children. From what we can tell right now, from what we know, he didn't murder people for the thrill of it, he didn't hunt people down for the specific purpose of killing them, like Ted Bundy or Henry Lee Lucas. I think he targeted vulnerable women for companionship purposes, and had the propensity to kill them if enraged, but as far as (please forgive the expression) being in it for thrill kills, like most sk's, I don't believe this was TPR. I think his were extreme crimes of passion, in that something set him off and he'd kill in a fit a rage. This opinion is subject to change as more information comes to light.

RSBM
I think this is a great analysis. I wouldn't be surprised if he has more victims, but only ones connected to him with relationships - not random victims off the street. IMO I agree that he is not that type. More of an escalated domestic abuser.

 

[Alleykins]

RSBM
I think this is a great analysis. I wouldn't be surprised if he has more victims, but only ones connected to him with relationships - not random victims off the street. IMO I agree that he is not that type. More of an escalated domestic abuser.

Agree with he was more of an escalated domestic abuser, who also became more unstable and violent over time.

 

[carbuff]

Agree with he was more of an escalated domestic abuser, who also became more unstable and violent over time.

That's my impression of him also.

Not that it excuses him at all, but it does change the victim profile.

 

[squish]

D/L remembers a woman with children, but, iirc, she didn't believe the woman was Denise.

I think TPR spared D/L for two reasons, and this is just my opinion. I could way off.

(1) I think he might have thought D/L was his. Now this begs the question, why did he kill the MC, because he most likely thought she was his, too? My answer is, he didn't kill, or intentionally kill, the MC. I'm thinking her death was accidental, and that led to him killing the other three. I could be way off here, but it might explain why he didn't kill D/L.

(2) He doesn't appear to be a typical serial killer, in that I don't think his intention when hooking up with Marlyse was to kill her and her children. From what we can tell right now, from what we know, he didn't murder people for the thrill of it, he didn't hunt people down for the specific purpose of killing them, like Ted Bundy or Henry Lee Lucas. I think he targeted vulnerable women for companionship purposes, and had the propensity to kill them if enraged, but as far as (please forgive the expression) being in it for thrill kills, like most sk's, I don't believe this was TPR. I think his were extreme crimes of passion, in that something set him off and he'd kill in a fit a rage. This opinion is subject to change as more information comes to light.

I think he may have been a paedophile and targeted single mothers to gain access to their daughters.

 

[Alleykins]

I think he may have been a paedophile and targeted single mothers to gain access to their daughters.

I agree he was a pedophile, but based on what we know, I disagree he targeted single mothers for that purpose, because not every woman he was involved with that we know of had children. Denise didn't have children prior to them meeting. We don't even know if she were pregnant before they met or became pregnant shortly after. And even if he knew she were pregnant upon meeting, he had no way of knowing she was carrying a girl. Eunsoon didn't have children. We don't know if the MC's mother had children before the MC, we don't know if the woman he brought with him the last time to see his family had kids. As far as we know, for certain, only Marlyse had children. This belief is subject to change as more information is discovered.

 

[carbuff]

Well that's not that far fetched. What I don't see is TPR disposing Sarah alone in a whole barrel and then re-opening it to dispose MC some time later. These two were killed back to back.

I don't think it's what happened--I think you're right they were killed at the same time--but I wouldn't find it terribly implausible that he re-opened the barrel to hold another victim.