Found Deceased NH - Celina Cass, 11, Stewartstown, 25 July 2011 #10 *Arrest*

[Magdalyn]

Are you saying they brought their own blanket in to her room? Not sure I am understanding what you are saying. If she is wrapped in a blanket, it is either hers or someone else's . If it is someone else's I think planting a blanket is a stretch. And whatever there should be DNA or certainlly lint or something to check out on the blanket. I don't know just trying to think logically. Seems nothing in this case makes sense. jmo

I'm saying that it's possible the blanket (if there is one) could have come from anywhere and could point to no one and not be a smoking gun. A perp could have picked it up at an out of town Walmart the day before. And that perp could have been a stranger buying from Walmart or a family member buying from Walmart. Having been in the water a week, it may not have any DNA on it. If it's a white generic sheet with no DNA on it other than Celina's, it's not a smoking gun. And even if it's a blanket from her own house, that doesn't prove it was a family member who killed her/wrapped her up in it. And if DNA is washed away in the river... no smoking gun.

If they found hair stands/blood/semen within the blanket, THAT could be evidence. (If they found DNA within Celina, same thing.) But a family member could easliy explain away why their hair could be on a blanket that's from their own house. We shed hair everywhere. I make my kids' beds every day, I'm sure my hair has fallen in their sheets somewhere.

So I'm saying, if there is a blanket, it MIGHT have strong evidence pointing in one direction ... but unless there's DNA within it, it would be circumstantial and not a 'smoking gun'.

And planting a blanket or taking someone's blanket to incriminate them may be a stretch (and not true!), but in a court of law, it can cause reasonable doubt.

Think of Baby Caylee wrapped in her own blanket, a laundry bag of which the Anthony's had the matching partner, and duct tape on her skull of a brand that was found at the Anthony house. All circumstantial, pretty much. Old Baez had an excuse for everything. May not have been tape from the same roll, no DNA on any items, laundry bag might not have been theirs, Dad had access to ALL these items ... so not a smoking gun pointing at Casey. It musta been a drowning and grandpa tossed her. Grrr.

(Note-For the record, I don't believe for a second FCA is innocent! More Grrr!)

 

[bstnh1]

I think the problem for me is that I thought it would be a slam dunk. Wrapped in a blanket, felon living in the home, SF with psycological problems. But, apparently it is not so obvious or not so simple. I would think they could have identified the blanket? I would think they could have found DNA or some identifying evidense on the blanket. To me the blanket is the answer. I just don't get it. I really wish they would say something. Tell us where they are in the investigation. jmo

I'm sure they have a lot more information than what we've been told. If not, there's trouble in River City.

 

[Texsun]

That's a million dollar question "cluciano63" Someone posted above about the paths if she is found positive. But if not, I imagine LE will only have the two male statements of what they were doing from 9 pm and their contact w/Celina, since mom and grandma have no idea being upstairs not hearing a thing after 9 pm. I'm sure those old walls are very sound proof.

Ms. Young has said over 500 and some odd tips and leads had come in. Surely a few of them MUST have been in regard to seeing these clowns out and about. 500 or so tips/leads, that is half the population of WS. I will look/post, but I was sure I read where LE said that KM was seen driving around till 2 am. I know they took his truck a week prior to taking WN's. I read that he had been questioned extensively immediately and for several days as soon as Celina was reported missing. WN just made himself scarce by running around to relatives and in and out of the Hosp. Very evasive IMO.

I might not ought to say this, but I don't think for one minute, <modsnip> was at home popping popcorn and watching movies. I believe he came in after 9:00 pm. Of course, mom has not said anything on his behalf, other than "leave him alone" in the beginning to media. But she really does not appear to be to supportive of him publicly and he is definitely no help to her at all and hasn't been from the beginning. I would think they would be standing by each other strongly in this time of need/sorrow for not even being married a year!

 

[Texsun]

People don't always listen, especially if they *think* they know better. If LN is as kind hearted as implied, she might think being suspicious of her dear 'step son' as rubbish, and she might not want to turn KM out with nowhere to go.

I'm not saying it's him, or WN, but LN wouldn't be the first 'family member' in the world who couldn't possibly fathom her child/stepson/husband could commit a crime on another family member and think the police are crazy for supecting them.

You got that right! I think it's very possible he has her convinced he didn't have anything to do it and be putting it all off onto YKW and vice versa! JMO, but I don't think either one could act without the other. I think both are up to their necks in it.
:sick:

 

[Radichio77885]

Yes, from what I have been reading there are more "clowns" then one would imagine in this small neck of the woods...of the posse variety, that is.

Chilling - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRgaTC9EFAs&feature=player_embedded#!

 

[katydid23]

katydid23,I do not know to what aspect of the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs you are referring (perhaps applying for and receiving disability compensation benefits?), but I am referring to the VA medical centers throughout the system (even those overseas) at which any veteran (who is has an honorable discharge or a discharge under honorable conditions after serving more than 180 days on active duty) can show up at any hour of the day or night and be treated on the spot, without delay, even if that veteran is not in possession of a valid VA health services identification card.

Most unfortunately, I have been the victim of a heinous domestic violence assault in the State of New Hampshire some years ago, my late first husband was under judicial restraint (unlike the person to whom I was referring in my post which you answered), he complained of chest pains, was taken to a local hospital in New Hampshire, and then was transferred at his request to a VA medical center. There was nothing LE in New Hampshire could do but to arrange for 24-hour surveillance outside the hospital room by rotating LE officers--and they did (for the six months until he died in the VA medical center to which he was transferred and then another VA medical center which is out of state).

I am sure your suggestion that VA medical center staff "could make the wheels turn pretty slow" is not meant to impugn the dedicated men and women who staff these medical centers and provide quality healthcare to our nation's veterans.

BBM: The U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs medical centers are NOT in the jurisdiction of any state or district (they are federal property), there has not any identification made of any "suspect" or person(s) of interest, and even if there were, any emergency room physician in any VA medical center has an obligation to treat any veteran without delay--even one who is under judicial restraint. Even though I'm sure your post is well intentioned, things have changed a GREAT DEAL at VA medical centers since the film "Born on the 4th of July" debuted years ago...VA healthcare, especially those medical centers affiliated with medical schools, offer the finest treatment available in this country today to the men and women who have served us so proudly and so well at great sacrifice to themselves and their families.

As I have posted on the CC threads in the past: to those veterans who read this post, thank you for your service to our country
and to Vietnam veterans, welcome home!

Yes, my first experience with the VA system was in helping my cousin register for his benefits and for his much needed treatment after coming home from the Viet Nam war. I do not remember it too clearly except for the fact that he was extremely frustrated by the long, involved and cumbersome process. Things were complicated, paperwork lost, and he spent weeks just trying to be seen. Glad to know that things are smoother now, but at the time it was incredibly slow and we went on a lot of side trips trying to make it finally happen.

And NO, I was not intending to impugn anyone. I am just saying that if the SF is currently in treatment for his psychiatric issues, then the investigation may be slowed down for now. If he wants to move to another state for treatment then I think LE might make their own moves first, to try and prevent that. I could be wrong, obviously.

 

[Kiln Wood]

Knowing that LCN is very trusting and naive, wouldn't the police warn her against having him in her home if they suspected him?

I agree we have very little information about KM, but if the police knew/thought he was guilty, surely they would advice LCN from having him in her home w/KL.

BBM

iamnotagolem,

what do you mean when you say, "LCN is very naive and trusting?"
How did this "knowing" process come about?
Have you met LCN?
Are you a personal friend (as opposed to social media friend) or a current or former neighbor?

Thank you for an interesting post.

 

[Kiln Wood]

The thing is for me---there is evidense. There has to be. I am not buying that there isn't. A person does not just disappear. There has to be a trail, a person of interest, something that leads to the perp. If there is no evidense then it must have been 'magic' and I don't buy that. jmo

BBM

mck16, yours is a post that borders on being fascinating to me.

I first learned of WS back in April when Krista Dittmeyer disappeared in central NH, I was looking for more information on her disappearance on a Google search, I found a link to a website that turned out to be WS, and I have become quite a fan since then.

"A person does not just disappear" is what I've always believed, but the threads I closely follow on WS certainly seem to disprove this; other than the CC thread, they are:

Maura Murray (NH)
Ray Gricar (PA)
The Jamison Family (OK)
Gail Nowacki Palmgren (TN)
Jacque Rawson Waller (MO)
Lauren Spierer (IN)
Robyn Gardner (Aruba)
Katelyn Markham (OH).

All that I have listed seem to have in common that these folks have been seen here on earth one moment and vanished seemingly without a trace the next moment.....

Of these, the Maura Murray and Ray Gricar disappearances are the ones that haunt me and keep me awake many nights.

If ever you do find that "something that leads to a perp," please consider sharing. Thank you for a most thought provoking post.

 

[Kiln Wood]

Ah- thanks y'all- I tend to dissect statements sometimes
I just wondered if she was kind of sending out the message, if you are an accessory after the fact/principal in the second degree, etc..we are gonna get ya...... I don't know, offering a deal without outright saying it??? Like , come on gimme something.

Interesting how LE handles cases differently across the states

BBM

sreshowtime, you already HAVE something: AAY Jane Young.....
For more on the subject, you may want to look up the WS threads on Krista Dittmeyer.

 

[Kiln Wood]

Verbiage only: Anybody = more than one person so she continues in that same plurality of speech.

:twocents: For me, and again I am very biased toward this component of the investigation (toxicology), the greatest detail of her information to the public is that she is declaring albeit subtlety that the pieces MUST be put together before she'll go riding off into the sunset with LE to "handcuff" her perp. She wants this legal battle to be as air tight as possible to get a conviction OR to demonstrate to the perp that he/she would be much better off just admitting to the crime!

BBM

Yes!!!!!

 

[Kiln Wood]

You got that right! I think it's very possible he has her convinced he didn't have anything to do it and be putting it all off onto YKW and vice versa! JMO, but I don't think either one could act without the other. I think both are up to their necks in it.
:sick:

BBM

Texsun, what makes you think that?

 

[katydid23]

I do find it odd that 2 officers would come to the house and pick up KM for a routine Q and A session. Why not interview him at home, or call him and ask him to come in to the station? It makes me feel like it was a little more than a 'routine-nothing' kind of thing. imoo

 

[Chris_Texas]

I do find it odd that 2 officers would come to the house and pick up KM for a routine Q and A session. Why not interview him at home, or call him and ask him to come in to the station? It makes me feel like it was a little more than a 'routine-nothing' kind of thing. imoo

I do not. Here's why:

First the two officers; you don't send one officer alone to talk to someone who might be involved in a potential murder. Not when you have extras available. Nor would you ever question someone in their home if you have a choice, and for multiple reasons. The two biggest are intimidation and recording, and both are huge. A person's home is their castle, they feel in control there and empowered. Not so much when you are downtown.

It is far better to show up unannounced at someone's door and "invite" them to come downtown and answer some questions. You can even give them a ride in the back of your police car as a further intimidation technique.

In short, I would not read TOO much into this guy being questioned again. And as I said in a previous post, we don't have a clue what or who he was being questioned about. This guy might have an airtight and 100% legit alibi for all we know.

 

[MsFacetious]

Ahhh but we don't know for absolute certainty there was a blanket....much less anything else attached to or around the body...several MSM mentioned the blanket- but LE/Jane Young never specifically mentioned one or anything else.

Remember though... that Jane Young never mentioned the duct tape in Krista's case either... until the arraignment.
Then she came out and told us that Krista had been beaten, robbed, duct taped and thrown in the pond by the three suspects.

When they announced they had found her body, a reporter asked about duct tape. So it was known by the media very quickly.
Yet, Jane Young didn't confirm anything until her arrests had been made. I think there is a blanket of some kind, she isn't going to tell us.

BBM

sreshowtime, you already HAVE something: AAY Jane Young.....
For more on the subject, you may want to look up the WS threads on Krista Dittmeyer.

Sreshowtime is definitely familiar with Jane Young, or at least my *ahem* strong opinion on her. Which definitely includes Krista's case.

I actually believe Sreshowtime was referring to what Jane Young may have been saying... along with "we are gonna get ya."

That she also may have been sending a message that she might work with someone who came forward... just "come on, gimme something..."

I don't think Sreshowtime was asking Jane Young to give us something.
However, I could be wrong... and if I am, I have every confidence that Sreshowtime will correct me. :seeya:

 

[MarthaM]

Some snipped for length:

I think its real strange and not so sure about "routine". It has been almost a month and the crime was in W. Stewartstown, not Colebrook. Far as I knew, KM was already interviewed and it was confirmed his vehicle was released.

I do find it odd that 2 officers would come to the house and pick up KM for a routine Q and A session. Why not interview him at home, or call him and ask him to come in to the station? It makes me feel like it was a little more than a 'routine-nothing' kind of thing. imoo

I don't find it odd. As far as it being at the Colebrook station goes, it was the State Police who went to the home, not the local PD. My guess is that the Colebrook office was the closest one so they asked to use space there for their interview. And about them taking him in to an office, I've seen officers do that in some towns, both because it's more official that way and because sometimes they want to record the interview in some way. They can't do that in a home. Or perhaps they want the witness to look at a piece of evidence. The times when I saw LE do this it was in connection to more minor cases, so I would think it might be even more important when investigating a suspicious death.

And sometimes a LE dept will just ask the person to come in and other times they'll pick up the witness and take them home again. I've seen it done both ways, and again I think sometimes it's just the way a specific agency prefers to do it.

Of course, it's also possible that they picked him up so that they'd be sure he showed up.

You are right about that, but where do you think the MSM got that information? I wouldn't think they would make it up, do you? But, that could explain a lot of things. I would think if there was a blanket that would be the smoking gun. Don't you agree? ty

I don't think the newspaper or news channel (can't remember which it was) made it up, but I do think it's very possible that somebody told a reporter that they saw the body being taken out of the water and that it was wrapped in a blanket. The 'source' could have thought they were seeing a blanket when what they saw was what the divers wrapped her in before bringing her to the surface. I'm always hesitant to rely on anything that comes from an unnamed source, and in this instance it seems that the few other news sites that picked up the 'blanket' tidbit got it from that one original paper/channel.

The thing is for me---there is evidense. There has to be. I am not buying that there isn't. A person does not just disappear. There has to be a trail, a person of interest, something that leads to the perp. If there is no evidense then it must have been 'magic' and I don't buy that. jmo

Unfortunately, a lot of people do just disappear. It's true that there's always some kind of evidence, but it's not always found. In some cases, it never will be found even though it exists or did exist at some point.

BBM

sreshowtime, you already HAVE something: AAY Jane Young.....
For more on the subject, you may want to look up the WS threads on Krista Dittmeyer.

A couple of weeks ago, I read the Dittmeyer threads at the urging of a couple of posters here. What am I missing that's so special? I really don't see it. However, there were a lot of posts to read and I might have missed something. Can you be more specific?

 

[sreshowtime]

BBM

sreshowtime, you already HAVE something: AAY Jane Young.....
For more on the subject, you may want to look up the WS threads on Krista Dittmeyer.

LOL naw, I meant HER implying
'gimme something' :crazy:

I think Jane Young is interesting

@ MS Facetious =- you got it I have feeling maybe JY says things without saying them KWIM?

And I just might call her office tomorrow and see if I can confirmation on that darn BLANKET issue that MSM mentioned

 

[sreshowtime]

Yes, from what I have been reading there are more "clowns" then one would imagine in this small neck of the woods...of the posse variety, that is.

Chilling - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRgaTC9EFAs&feature=player_embedded#!

OMG that is just a freaky song, I literally had goose bumps...OH gosh is that mess there too? I just ran across some of that searching on Katelyn MArkham.

Why do people 'glorify' that stuff??

 

[MsFacetious]

LOL naw, I meant HER implying
'gimme something' :crazy:

I think Jane Young is interesting

@ MS Facetious =- you got it I have feeling maybe JY says things without saying them KWIM?

And I just might call her office tomorrow and see if I can confirmation on that darn BLANKET issue that MSM mentioned

That's Jane Young for you. I would not want to be married to this woman. People thought *I* spoke in code! :crazy:

You are gonna call her office?? :waitasec:

To get... confirmation, like a yes or no, straight answer?? :floorlaugh:

Really, from Jane Young?? :giggle:

You are optimistic... but hey, maybe you'll catch them in whatever mood would cause them to reveal that. Never know unless you try. :seeya:

I'm pretty sure we know though. :innocent:

 

[katydid23]

OMG that is just a freaky song, I literally had goose bumps...OH gosh is that mess there too? I just ran across some of that searching on Katelyn MArkham.

Why do people 'glorify' that stuff??

There was a lot of talk about clown posse and juggaloes when researching the Hailey Dunn case as well. It seems that many of the main suspects friends were into that same music and lyrics.

 

[cluciano63]

If LE has evidence, i.e a blanket, fibers, possibly DNA...and corresponding evidence from witness statements, they will be able to figure this out and possibly make an arrest. If they don't have any of the above...they will probably have to hope for a confession to find out who/how Celina ended up in the river. That is really what it boils down to, for me anyway. 1/3 of murders in the US go unsolved, with no one being charged. It doesn't mean that 1/3 of LE are incapable, just that the evidence is not always there.
JMO