NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #10

[Lolacat]

I think it all started that Thursday night she was working.

Just the way the supervisor described her (I don't believe the supervisor was being over dramatic), something of a traumatic nature happened to Maura and no that doesn't necessarily mean a phone call triggered it.

Whatever it was, she went on a rapid down-hill spiral from that point on.

Her father (IMO) really knows a whole lot more as to the condition of his daughter that weekend he whisked into town to be with her.

I think he did his best to try and calm her down and maybe when he left, felt like she was in better shape. But obviously that wasn't the case. That is what I think his biggest regret is. Leaving her after being convinced she would work through whatever problem she was facing.

Yep- reminds me of that quote from the disappeared programme where he says "And she went into the dorm and thats the last I ever saw of her, which will haunt me forever".

 

[Fireweed]

I was just thinking, we talk a lot on this board about Maura's state of mind, and many think that driving a crappy car and taking off after the accident is evidence that Maura was irrational, but I do not see it that way. With regards to the car, the only evidence we have that the car was not running well, is what Fred told us. However, we have excellent evidence that the car was running perfectly fine: it got Maura all the way to Haverhill (seemingly) without breaking down.

As to Maura taking off after the accident, if she had been drinking, then to me that is a perfectly rational decision. I would have done the same! I would way rather take the citations and penalties for the other stuff than a DUI. Also, if she was planning on running away for good, then it is a totally rational action to take in light of her plans.

I believe Maura was a much more rational actor that day than we give her credit for. I certainly think she was distraught and stressed, but it does not seem that she was mentally incapable of rational thought. She gets maps of the area, calls around to book a room, etc. This was not a woman who just went screeching off into the unknown in her beater car.

 

[OldSteve]

I was just thinking, we talk a lot on this board about Maura's state of mind, and many think that driving a crappy car and taking off after the accident is evidence that Maura was irrational, but I do not see it that way. With regards to the car, the only evidence we have that the car was not running well, is what Fred told us. However, we have excellent evidence that the car was running perfectly fine: it got Maura all the way to Haverhill (seemingly) without breaking down.

As to Maura taking off after the accident, if she had been drinking, then to me that is a perfectly rational decision. I would have done the same! I would way rather take the citations and penalties for the other stuff than a DUI. Also, if she was planning on running away for good, then it is a totally rational action to take in light of her plans.

I believe Maura was a much more rational actor that day than we give her credit for. I certainly think she was distraught and stressed, but it does not seem that she was mentally incapable of rational thought. She gets maps of the area, calls around to book a room, etc. This was not a woman who just went screeching off into the unknown in her beater car.

BBM - goes back to one the things I mentioned and wondered about for so long in this case -
why her car was never tested?
It would tell allot, such as did it smoke? did it backfire? did it run okay?

 

[Fireweed]

I have a question for anyone who knows anything about cars: what does running on three cylinders mean in terms of the performance of the car?

 

[Lolacat]

I have a question for anyone who knows anything about cars: what does running on three cylinders mean in terms of the performance of the car?

My partner is a mechanic. I just asked him. He said it depends on the size and power of the engine. For example, a 1 litre car running on 3 cylinders would be a very rough ride and probably wouldn't make a very long journey. For a larger, more powerful engine- a 2L for example, you could make a long journey but the car would be juddery and would likely have a lot of vibration. He said it also depends on what caused the cylinder to go out - if it was a fault with the head gasket for example, the car would likely smoke. Basically, with one cylinder out, the engine would lose power and not be as responsive as it should be.

 

[Fireweed]

So then that must mean that it is highly unlikely that Maura's car was running on three cylinders???

 

[Lolacat]

So then that must mean that it is highly unlikely that Maura's car was running on three cylinders???

Well, American cars typically have larger and more powerful engines than we have here in the UK so its possible. But, it would have been juddery and not as responsive as it should have been.

 

[Fireweed]

The car Maura had would have been only slightly larger than a typical UK car.

I am just thinking what I would do if my car were in that situation but I had to drive it anyway. I would go very slowly and probably stay off the interstate, so I could pull over quickly if I had to.

One more thing, maybe you could ask your partner: would a person really need to go buy an entire new car if their old car was running on three cylinders? Couldn't you just fix that issue?

 

[Fireweed]

Now I am starting to wonder. Let's say Maura's car was actually running on 3 cylinders. If she thought as I do, then she would want to go slow, and not be on a fast-moving interstate. I am now thinking she did not take 91 up there and then exit. I think she drove on the smaller roads parallel to 91, which would have taken 3 hours and 15 minutes from Amherst, and not 2 hours and 40 minutes via the interstate. This would account for the "missing" 30 to 40 minutes. It would align up much more precisely with the timeline that we have.

 

[Lolacat]

The car Maura had would have been only slightly larger than a typical UK car.

I am just thinking what I would do if my car were in that situation but I had to drive it anyway. I would go very slowly and probably stay off the interstate, so I could pull over quickly if I had to.

One more thing, maybe you could ask your partner: would a person really need to go buy an entire new car if their old car was running on three cylinders? Couldn't you just fix that issue?

He said that having one misfiring cylinder is a common problem- particularly in petrol cars. The most common causes of a misfiring cylinder are:

1. Coil pack failure
2. Spark plug/lead problem
3. Fuel injector issue

There could be other causes but these are the most typical.

He said that customers coming in with one cylinder down usually complain that their car has lost power and is juddering/vibrating. I asked him if a misfiring cylinder (alone) would be cause to scrap a car and he said no. Its easily fixable. He said the only reason he could see for a person to scrap a car for a misfiring cylinder would be if the car was already very old, unreliable and had a range of existing other mechanical problems. So, in essence, the cylinder would be *the last straw* for the owner who has possibly already spent hundreds on fixing it up until that point. Obviously, if maintenance of such a car costs more than its worth then in that case, it would make sense to get a new car.

 

[Fireweed]

Good to know. Maura's car was a 96 (I believe) in 2004 so it was not that old of a car. I suppose it could have been a lemon, but based upon what your boyfriend says, then it does not make a lot of sense to buy a brand new car! I recall when I went to law school I asked my mechanic if my car was good for another 3 years. It just did not make sense to me to buy another car until after I was done with law school Likewise, it makes no sense to me to not just fix the car you already have, especially if you think you will be in a much better position financially in just two years.

To me, you would only spend $4,000 on another car if your other car had a problem that was very expensive to fix, and you felt that just fixing that thing would not solve your problems with that car long term. How much would it cost to fix a car firing on only three cylinders? Obviously I figure there is a range, but I am wondering ballpark on a "basic" car like a Saturn.

 

[KenShabby]

I have a question for anyone who knows anything about cars: what does running on three cylinders mean in terms of the performance of the car?

Note that "running on three cylinders" is also an idiomatic expression that can be used for all kinds of purposes. It means, basically, not operating at full capacity, or not up to snuff. If I'm feeling ill, I might describe myself as "running on less than four cylinders" — four cylinders being the standard for many small cars.

In this case, it might simply be coincidence that the expression was being used in connection with the Saturn, a four-cylinder vehicle. (I owned a 1995 Saturn myself. Not very powerful, but it was on the road for 15 years with minimal service.)

In this case,

 

[Fireweed]

I always assumed that Fred Murray meant it literally- that Maura's car only had three out of four cylinders working.

 

[goldiegirl]

Note that "running on three cylinders" is also an idiomatic expression that can be used for all kinds of purposes. It means, basically, not operating at full capacity, or not up to snuff. If I'm feeling ill, I might describe myself as "running on less than four cylinders" — four cylinders being the standard for many small cars.

In this case, it might simply be coincidence that the expression was being used in connection with the Saturn, a four-cylinder vehicle. (I owned a 1995 Saturn myself. Not very powerful, but it was on the road for 15 years with minimal service.)

In this case,

That is such a good point, and I bet you anything you're right.

 

[BillNH]

That is such a good point, and I bet you anything you're right.

I tend to agree. I have heard the expression many times and not once was it intended or taken to be a literal statement. Fred used many colloquialisms, this was just another one. IMO

 

[Fireweed]

I still then do not understand how Maura's car went on three hour trip if it was in such bad shape that she needed a new car. I can only think that Fred was either lying, or that the car was literally running on three cylinders, which would have meant that it could "run," but not very well. I have heard "not firing on all cylinders" as a saying to describe someone who is a little nutty. When it comes to cars though, I always just assumed it was meant literally.

 

[Captain_Khan]

I still then do not understand how Maura's car went on three hour trip if it was in such bad shape that she needed a new car. I can only think that Fred was either lying, or that the car was literally running on three cylinders, which would have meant that it could "run," but not very well. I have heard "not firing on all cylinders" as a saying to describe someone who is a little nutty. When it comes to cars though, I always just assumed it was meant literally.

Agreed. It also then seems strange that Maura's last known journey ended with a crash rather than a breakdown...

 

[Lolacat]

I still then do not understand how Maura's car went on three hour trip if it was in such bad shape that she needed a new car. I can only think that Fred was either lying, or that the car was literally running on three cylinders, which would have meant that it could "run," but not very well. I have heard "not firing on all cylinders" as a saying to describe someone who is a little nutty. When it comes to cars though, I always just assumed it was meant literally.

I agree too. I have to wonder if Fred was lying. But if he was- why? and what was the $4,000 for?

 

[Fireweed]

It is my own belief that Fred was in Amherst as a direct result of whatever that Thursday night phone call was about. Now I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt on a couple of things: 1. I do think Maura's car was not running all that great and that Fred and Maura had discussed the possibility of getting a new car within the recent past and 2. That Fred did not know that Maura was planning on taking off.

I think Fred knew Maura was deeply distressed and deeply troubled. I think he said and did some things that he feels guilty about, but which were, at the time, merely part of his persona as a father who "pushes hard." I think that is still a huge part of him, which is why he has a hard time understanding that the rest of us are way more forgiving to human frailty than he thinks. To him, being weak or a failure is the worst thing you can be, whereas I think most of see that as just a normal part of human existence.

He insists the past is not relevant because he does not want us looking at Maura's past. It boggles the mind. What kind of "past" does a 21 year old have anyway? I have seen nothing from Maura's past that seems at all odd to me. She made some mistakes, but we all did at that age.

 

[pokypuppy67]

Hi, I'm just jumping in here. It's been awhile since I've heard anything about this case. Did they find Maura's body?