NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 3

[Peabody]

Check out this link:

<modsnip - no longer a working website>

If you watch the entire video, you will see interviews with Maura's best friends since grade school, her sister Kathleen, her fiance, and her father Fred.

You will also be able to view Maura with her hair down.

Hopefully, too, some of you can determine how "abrasive" Fred Murray truly is.

A picture is worth a thousand words!


Perhaps this will provide some insight?????




.
For those of you wanting to view photos of Maura with her

 

[docwho3]

It helps us by focusing on immediate peri-accident period free of the prior encumberances. The departure from usual procedure of immediate search and rescue if LE thought she was on foot is too great to accomodate any answer except they had reason to believe she had been picked up and was safe at the time. Why would they think that, and why would they still be unwilling to reveal it??

If they felt it would violate her legal right to privacy perhaps they would have considered that reason enough to not reveal it. And thanks for explaining what you meant.

 

[murraydwyer]

Crypto...I don't know what either the Haverhill police believed nor the NHSP...I have spent a lot of time looking at statements made on Maura's case and can only offer you the following quotes that I have found about what they had to say about the possibility that Maura was picked up. Notice the last two which appeared in the paper on the same day:

PICKED UP

2/18/04 Caledonian Record – Jeffrey Williams Chief Haverhill Police - "We don't know if someone picked her up," Williams said. "We are certainly concerned about that (possibility).
2/20/04 Brockton Enterprise - Investigators say Murray probably left in another vehicle… Police say they have considered that someone whom Maura Murray knew was traveling with her in another vehicle, but that remains unknown. She is a junior at the University of Massachusetts in Amherst.

2/20/04 Caledonian Record - While he was talking on his phone on his front porch, Atwood could see the road, but not Murray's disabled car. He saw several vehicles drive by, but couldn't tell any makes or models because it was so dark. Atwood believes one of the vehicles which had passed his house could have stopped and picked her up.

2/20/04 Seacoast Online - After the accident, witnesses said she asked them to call a wrecker….Scarinza said. "We are reasonably confident that she did not enter the woods near the accident scene. That area was searched several times."
The accident scene was in sight of several homes, although the area becomes remote after that. Scarinza said she did not seek help from any of the homeowners, so it may be that she accepted a ride somewhere, but, he said, "there is no indication that anyone picked her up." There is no evidence of foul play either, he said.

2/21/04 Caledonian Record - Lt. John Scarinza,NHSP: "There is no indication someone picked her up," Scarinza said. "At this point, I have no reason to believe that (she was taken against her will)."

2/21/04 – Daily NH Gazette –Scarinza said police believe Murray got a ride from the accident scene. But Scarinza said searchers found no sign of a struggle at the scene or any other evidence that she has been harmed.

 

[crypto6]

It helps us by focusing on immediate peri-accident period free of the prior encumbrances. The departure from usual procedure of immediate search and rescue if LE thought she was on foot is too great to accommodate any answer except they had reason to believe she had been picked up and was safe at the time. Why would they think that, and why would they still be unwilling to reveal it??

My rank order of possibilities would be:
1. She was picked up by someone she knew who was following her per plan, as you posit. This is far more likely than predator abduction, unless that area is a predator nexus so every third car has one or two. Since we don't know how events unfolded after the posited pickup, more likely than not her judgment in cohorts was good, and she made safely away.

2. She was picked up by someone she did not know who was following her or happened upon her and this person assisted her in getting safely away.

3. She was picked up by someone she knew who was following her per plan, as you posit. This turned unfortunate, and she was harmed.

4 She was picked up by someone she did not know who was following her or happened upon her and this person led to her harm. This could be LE, any of the persons claiming to have seen her, or others.

5. She walked out and perished due to the elements.

6. She walked out to safety.

Favoring scenarios 3 and 4:

A Superior Court judge saying this in ruling against Fred Murray's application to examine records: Considering that it sometimes takes several years — even decades — for the state to prosecute major crimes, a lapse of two years is not a long period of time,” Vaughn wrote. “Release of the records could jeopardize the investigation and lead to, among other things, destruction of evidence, intimidation of witnesses and loss of communications with entities providing confidential information.” .​

If my analysis is correct, the reason the judge is allowing this large amount of time without releasing the records is that a major crime investigation is underway.
Whether this is a criminal investigation of LE or of others is unclear.

 

[crypto6]

If they felt it would violate her legal right to privacy perhaps they would have considered that reason enough to not reveal it. And thanks for explaining what you meant.

That's a question for our lawyers here, and a good one.

 

[crypto6]

Crypto...I don't know what either the Haverhill police believed nor the NHSP...I have spent a lot of time looking at statements made on Maura's case and can only offer you the following quotes that I have found about what they had to say about the possibility that Maura was picked up. Notice the last two which appeared in the paper on the same day:

PICKED UP

2/18/04 Caledonian Record – Jeffrey Williams Chief Haverhill Police - "We don't know if someone picked her up," Williams said. "We are certainly concerned about that (possibility).
2/20/04 Brockton Enterprise - Investigators say Murray probably left in another vehicle… Police say they have considered that someone whom Maura Murray knew was traveling with her in another vehicle, but that remains unknown. She is a junior at the University of Massachusetts in Amherst.

2/20/04 Caledonian Record - While he was talking on his phone on his front porch, Atwood could see the road, but not Murray's disabled car. He saw several vehicles drive by, but couldn't tell any makes or models because it was so dark. Atwood believes one of the vehicles which had passed his house could have stopped and picked her up.

2/20/04 Seacoast Online - After the accident, witnesses said she asked them to call a wrecker….Scarinza said. "We are reasonably confident that she did not enter the woods near the accident scene. That area was searched several times."
The accident scene was in sight of several homes, although the area becomes remote after that. Scarinza said she did not seek help from any of the homeowners, so it may be that she accepted a ride somewhere, but, he said, "there is no indication that anyone picked her up." There is no evidence of foul play either, he said.

2/21/04 Caledonian Record - Lt. John Scarinza,NHSP: "There is no indication someone picked her up," Scarinza said. "At this point, I have no reason to believe that (she was taken against her will)."

2/21/04 – Daily NH Gazette –Scarinza said police believe Murray got a ride from the accident scene. But Scarinza said searchers found no sign of a struggle at the scene or any other evidence that she has been harmed.

Thanks. I got this after I posted my theories. I'll mull these over.

 

[docwho3]

My rank order of possibilities would be: . . .

You are a reasoning person and seem to be clear headed. I appreciate your thoughts and look forward to reading your next posts.

 

[crypto6]

Crypto...I don't know what either the Haverhill police believed nor the NHSP...I have spent a lot of time looking at statements made on Maura's case and can only offer you the following quotes that I have found about what they had to say about the possibility that Maura was picked up. Notice the last two which appeared in the paper on the same day:

PICKED UP
...........

2/21/04 Caledonian Record - Lt. John Scarinza,NHSP: "There is no indication someone picked her up," Scarinza said. "At this point, I have no reason to believe that (she was taken against her will)."

2/21/04 – Daily NH Gazette –Scarinza said police believe Murray got a ride from the accident scene. But Scarinza said searchers found no sign of a struggle at the scene or any other evidence that she has been harmed.

Certainly nuancing there. Put the two from the Gazette together: she got a ride and was not harmed at that time. Then Scarinza says in the Caledonian Record there's no evidence to believe the Haverhill police's supposition which forms the first contention of the combo.
I think he's trying to be clever in saying "The NHSP and Haverhill police assume she got a ride and was not harmed at that time, but there’s no solid evidence to back that up", or possibly there is evidence they are withholding that even confirming or denying such would compromise the investigation.

 

[PonderingThings]

Thanks for the video! Unfortunately I can't see videos on my computer (some kind of conflict) but I can hear them. I've listened to this twice.

I have another question.....

Why would Maura turn down the ride/assistance from the bus driver that lived right there, yet accept a ride from another stranger that happened down the road? This does NOT compute for me.

Personally I think there was someone in the car with her that "hid" when the guy stopped.... did the man go around the car? Could he really tell if she was alone?

 

[PonderingThings]

Also I specifically read that Maura had told the bus driver that stopped, that she had called AAA - did she really? Was there any record on her phone?

 

[crypto6]

Crypto...I don't know what either the Haverhill police believed nor the NHSP...I have spent a lot of time looking at statements made on Maura's case and can only offer you the following quotes that I have found about what they had to say about the possibility that Maura was picked up. Notice the last two which appeared in the paper on the same day:

PICKED UP

.................snip

2/21/04 Caledonian Record - Lt. John Scarinza,NHSP: "There is no indication someone picked her up," Scarinza said. "At this point, I have no reason to believe that (she was taken against her will)."

2/21/04 – Daily NH Gazette –Scarinza said police believe Murray got a ride from the accident scene. But Scarinza said searchers found no sign of a struggle at the scene or any other evidence that she has been harmed.

Putting all of these, plus the judge's ruling in a context where all the statements are true, or if not true, have been falsified to protect the investigation, here's what I come up with:
LE knows she was picked up and that some criminal activity has occurred. The fact that she was picked up was falsified and the case was being falsely classified as "Missing Person" in order to protect the knowledge that LE had evidence of the criminal activity. This was unmasked at the judge's ruling.

Opinions??

 

[PonderingThings]

Maybe the reporter(s) got the info wrong? Sadly sometimes they can't even spell the victim's name right!

 

[murraydwyer]

The bus driver did say that Maura said she called AAA...her cell phone had no service in that spot and no, as far as we've been able to determine there is no record of a call to AAA.

The bus driver also said that Maura refused help...

Butch and Barbara Atwood are from Raynham and Taunton, respectively. They consider Haverhill much safer than where they grew up in Southeastern Massachusetts.
‘‘I might be afraid if I saw Butch. He's 350 pounds and has this mustache,'' Barbara Atwood said. Patriot Ledger 2/28/04

One of the things we've found in our research is that you never know what you will find online:

Major incidents in 2003 included 31 felony cases sent to the County Attorneys office; there are 11 registered sex offenders living in our Town, 18 inactive files. Town of Haverhill Budget Committee minutes 1/19/04 - Chief of Police Jeffery Williams (these minutes don’t appear to be available online any longer)

There are still 11 registered sex offenders in the three zip codes I found for the area in close proximity to where Maura disappeared. In Wells River about five or six miles away there are 5 registered offenders (remember these are only the known sex offenders). While these numbers are not staggering, according to a former policeman I know, they are very high when you consider that these two towns combined have a population of just over 5,000. I honestly am not sure whether MA and NH lists are similar in the composition of their lists, but I just checked all of the zip codes in my town which has a population of about 54,000 plus...it is a very diverse town with a broad socio economic base....there are 12 registered (level three) sex offenders....and I have no idea what 18 inactive cases means....so it would appear that Maura's chance of being picked up by someone who was less than desirable would appear to be possible. Registered sex offenders within 10 miles of Haverhill, NH population 5,000 plus/16...my town population 54,000 plus/12.

 

[docwho3]

http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=849167&postcount=76

This might help. Evidently someone ran a test to see if coverage was available.

 

[petra]

Thanks for the video! Unfortunately I can't see videos on my computer (some kind of conflict) but I can hear them. I've listened to this twice.

I have another question.....

Why would Maura turn down the ride/assistance from the bus driver that lived right there, yet accept a ride from another stranger that happened down the road? This does NOT compute for me.

Personally I think there was someone in the car with her that "hid" when the guy stopped.... did the man go around the car? Could he really tell if she was alone?

Do you mean someone she knew or stranger threatening her?

As I understand, the car was found locked when LE got there..is that still the current believe?

 

[PonderingThings]

Ok... You're Maura. You've had an accident and driven your car off the road. You try to call and there is no cell service. Its 7-7:30pm on February 9th. It has to be cold and getting dark.

A big scary guy stops and asks if you need help. He scares you so you tell him no, that you've called AAA. He leaves and you see him pull into the driveway just ahead.

Now you are really scared (you didn't know he lived there). You decide to quickly gather your things and take off and look for help (or get a cell signal). You are a runner, in pretty good shape, so off you trot. Not in the direction you just came from, but forward.

Although you are familiar with the area for some reason (maybe disorientated because of the accident) you head off into an unpopulated area... its cold, its now dark, and you are in the middle of nowhere.

Someone, in the dark, sees you clear enough to recognise you later (I'm sorry I have my doubts about this ID but I'm going with it).

You see a light across a field and decide to head towards it. Problem is, in the dark, you fall into a creek/hole/other hazard and can't get out.
or
Do you accept a ride from a stranger?
or
Is it possible there was a hit and run accident and Maura was hit by a passing car?
or
Could Maura have knocked on someone's door and that led to a "bad thing" happening?
or
Maura made good her "planned" escape. (personally I think this is very unlikely)

All the possibilities are still open

*****************
The above is purely speculation on my part.

 

[PonderingThings]

Do you mean someone she knew or stranger threatening her?

As I understand, the car was found locked when LE got there..is that still the current believe?

Its my understanding that it is assumed that Maura was alone in the car when she had the accident. What if she wasn't? What if she did it on purpose because someone was in the car with her? What if they hid behind the car when the bus driver stopped?

Could this be someone she knew... yes... could it be a hitchhiker she picked up... yes (unlikely though)... could she have been abducted and forced to drive somewhere... I think its possible. Although there is no indication that she stopped maybe she did to go to the bathroom, or to buy a drink, and someone got in the car with her then?

 

[PonderingThings]

Docwho can you use your sleuthing abilities and find out what the weather was like in Haverhill, New Hampshire on the night of February 9, 2004. Was it clear? Was there a full moon? What time was sun set? What was the temp?

The next day what was the weather like?

Please

 

[docwho3]

Docwho can you use your sleuthing abilities and find out what the weather was like in Haverhill, New Hampshire on the night of February 9, 2004. Was it clear? Was there a full moon? What time was sun set? What was the temp?

The next day what was the weather like?

Please http://www.websleuths.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif

I think the person you need to speak to on that one is hydemi who I believe has looked into that one already.

. . .And it appears the temperature that evening was in fact in the 30's not ten or twelve as reported--so her going on foot would be more credible . . .

http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=957424&postcount=22

Edited to add:Try these two info pages:
http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstation/WXDailyHistory.asp?ID=KNHLISBO1&month=2&day=9&year=2004

http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstation/WXDailyHistory.asp?ID=KNHLISBO1&month=2&day=10&year=2004

 

[PonderingThings]

Thanks Docwho! Hopefully Hydemi will pop by the thread and also tell us if it was clear.... and moonlit.

I've been on New Hampshire road at night and they are DARK. Unless the contractor almost ran her over, and she was in the bright lights of his vehicle, I honestly don't see how he can be sure it was Maura.