NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #4

[CARIIS]

Do you know for a fact he was self-medicating with alcohol? Do you know if there was actually a "mental decline"? What are these items being based on? Why do you feel that there wasn't a trigger sometime in October that caused him to start planning something he was capable of, but had no other interest in prior? Why do you feel there is a mental health aspect such as sociopathy, when we know next to nothing about him (and are therefore taking shots in the dark at nearly anything mental health related), versus something like radicalization occurring over the last several months?

Him committing suicide also doesn't mean he thought what he did was actually wrong, at all. At its very basic, it just meant he did not want to go through our legal system.

Very respectfully

Your a neat and interesting poster.

I need to ask however = what is the resistance to some very serious mental health concerns from what we know about this man for decades??

tia

 

[Isabelle]

OMG that's horrifying.

He screwed the door shut that led to the stairway!!! What kind of security checks does security do in a place like this? For real???

 

[m00c0w]

Very respectfully

Your a neat and interesting poster.

I need to ask however = what is the resistance to some very serious mental health concerns from what we know about this man for decades??

tia

I don't necessarily have a qualm with the idea of him having one. However, I think it's a total crap-shoot to try and pinpoint anything mentally about this guy because we don't know anything mentally about this guy. Like I said in another post, you could open the DSM to a random page, point to a condition, and you could shoehorn it into this situation because we know so little. Divining a psychological condition from a few media sources with a lot of contradictory information isn't something I find to be likely.

Now, if we were looking at a bunch of sworn statements from people that knew him well, and had his internet posts, and had a pretty solid understanding of how this guy acted that wasn't likely influenced by media or people protecting him, or people trying to get their 15 minutes of fame... I think there would be some pretty valuable discussion there with regards to his mental state. At this point, I personally feel that there are just far too many holes to make any sort of real assessment. :moo:

 

[jjenny]

It's possible a seed was planted during the riots. And then it became a fantasy he revisited, and finally acted on.

I certainly think it's a possibility. He was allegedly up on the roof with a gun, waiting for rioters to show up. Perhaps he liked the feeling of power the situation gave him.

 

[jjenny]

He screwed the door shut that led to the stairway!!! What kind of security checks does security do in a place like this? For real???

He could have done it right before the shooting.

 

[m00c0w]

No, his discussion did not originate with me. Sorry. Not going back for a replay, though

My apologies, then. I went back and saw several posts between you two. I apparently didn't go back far enough.

 

[jjenny]

Do you know for a fact he was self-medicating with alcohol? Do you know if there was actually a "mental decline"? What are these items being based on? Why do you feel that there wasn't a trigger sometime in October that caused him to start planning something he was capable of, but had no other interest in prior? Why do you feel there is a mental health aspect such as sociopathy, when we know next to nothing about him (and are therefore taking shots in the dark at nearly anything mental health related), versus something like radicalization occurring over the last several months?

Him committing suicide also doesn't mean he thought what he did was actually wrong, at all. At its very basic, it just meant he did not want to go through our legal system.

Not wanting go through legal system would suggest knowing what he did was wrong, since wrongdoings are punished by the legal system.

 

[1&2&3]

He screwed the door shut that led to the stairway!!! What kind of security checks does security do in a place like this? For real???

Well that not only limited LE a quick and easy access to him, it also limited him a quick exit route.

I don't remember if the pictures that were posted of the room layout included the hall and the closest stairway. From the position of the room/suite, I would suspect he was very close to a stairway.

 

[IQuestion]

There are far more high functioning , but severely impacted folks with mental illness issues

functionality is a lot of stuff

If we look back his social interactions were problematic

his marriages obviously problematic

he could not hold a job - imo indicative of some issues earlier in his life

. It must include the ability to do the things necessary to function in society. Measurements for physical, mental, emotional, spiritual, social, and career/financial productivity need to be part of the analysis.

In my opinion, functionality as it relates to mental illness encompasses many domains

Authentic functionality, in mental illness is items like :

• Bathing and showering
• Personal hygiene and grooming (including brushing/combing/styling hair)
• Dressing

Actually he did not according to most we have heard from handle these well!

In a quiet reality he actually did not demonstrate the ability to , quite honestly, do a lot of basic things we call functionality.****

• Cleaning and maintaining the house
• Managing money
• Moving within the community
• Preparing meals
• Shopping for groceries and necessities
• Taking prescribed medications

Having nothing in your houses , never being there, eating out , housekeeping is at some level avoidance of the abovementioned.

Mental illness does not translate to stupid . Especially with the mood disorders

this goes back to what I was trying to say. Bipolar is a mood disorder.. Disruptive moods can impact many aspects of a persons life.

Being intelligent, is not a rule out for any disorder . Mood has nothing to do with intellect but can profoundly impact other parts of ones life .

IMO if we take a step back and try to look at him in his entirety

he was good with numbers

socially maladaptive ****

had difficulty with frustration tolerances wanting everything now

very socially isolative ****

was not attending to (mentioned earlier) activities that most must attend to

Again imo because he had money in like the later part of his life (allegedly) in his early years , he apparently, had great difficulty with vocation, steady employment, appeared unable to locate his life plan. Hallmarks of mental illness

Sounds like he was unkempt throughout his life -- that can be viewed as neurotic or in all likelihood an indifference - often related to depressed periods

From most reports he lacked social skills, was rude, angry often, aloof and basically disengaged from social part of his life ********

mood stuff

at the end of the day he did (alledgy) insert a gun into his mouth and pull the trigger. It is safe to assume , at the end of the day, he was not a content person, an enduring component of mood problems *****

We also, imo might relate some pretty intense negative thought and feelings about other homosapiens - he harmed close to 500 - there is some info embedded there. ******!!!!!!!!******!!!!!!!

There is a proven link to genetics. Dad was diagnosed .

For most of the world the brothers behaviors were perceived by many as different, while being off mainly as it relates to normative affect . Genetic??

In terms of americs view imo as it relates to being well a large compnent of that is defined by a career that results in income . DOes not rule out suffering with bipolar

a short list of diagnosed , medication compliant "successful" people suffering with bipolar include

Demi Lovato,
3 Catherine Zeta-Jones.
5 / 13 Vivien Leigh. 6 /
13 Carrie Fisher. 7 /
13 Jean-Claude Van Damme. 8 /
Mariette Hartley, actress:
Brian Wilson, musician:
Dick Cavett, journalist:
Margaret Trudeau, former First Lady of Canada:
Richard Dreyfuss, actor
Patrick Kennedy, former U.S. Representative:

having career money does not equate with NOT suffering wiht bipolar moo


http://mastersinhealthcare.com/blog/2011/20-successful-people-whove-struggled-with-bipolar-disorder/



https://www.google.com/search?q=suc...me..69i57j0.5894j0j9&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8


Real functionality includes the ability to get along with others and for them to be comfortable with your behavior.




https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...ctionality-in-depression-and-bipolar-disorder

CARIIS, love everything you write (sometimes I'm a little slow on the humor, though) I am intrigued by the meter of behavior
discussed here.....from just a totally evil jerk-- addict--personality disorder-- severe mental illness-- to possible cognitive decline.
I read every post and think about them as I walk or do work that doesn't require all my attention. I marked the ones in red that really indicated a pattern. One can not help but notice the attendees of this open air concert: beautiful, youthful, funloving, employed, productive, smiling, confident, cowboy boots & hats, enjoying time with pals and family, packed shoulder-to-shoulder, enjoying the simple melodized phrases/themes of country music....... And, you know what?? All doing the one thing in life that SP could never do, FIT IN!!! It didn't/couldn't happen. Sure, he may have "issues & history" (don't we all, to some extent?) I think he was jealous, angry and was going to make every one else pay for what he would never be....accepted, popular, and comfortable in his own skin. It is creepy (descriptive as opposed to derogatory) how he insulated himself from the world. Big metal electronic video machines all around him with lights and sounds providing a buffer from real life. (I wonder if he wore his brown gloves and brought his own disinfectant wipes for the machines?) Keeping the blinds down so people could not see him (or criticize him?), short/distant family encounters buffered by the "perks of the casinos" so he did not have to entertain or be hospitable to people in his home. (Especially as his gun collection grew.)

 

[m00c0w]

Not wanting go through legal system would suggest knowing what he did was wrong, since wrongdoings are punished by the legal system.

Legal and moral are not always the same for some people. He may have felt he was doing a just action. For instance, if he was radicalized, he may have not thought what he was doing was "wrong". However, he almost definitely knew that it was illegal and would face some sort of consequences. It's also possible he just didn't want to be at the mercy of whatever force was responding (do it quickly himself, versus who knows what when the cops come in). Lots of potential reasons, some that don't necessarily have to do with him feeling badly or guilty about what he did, nor that he necessarily felt he did anything morally wrong.

 

[m00c0w]

Well that not only limited LE a quick and easy access to him, it also limited him a quick exit route.

I don't remember if the pictures that were posted of the room layout included the hall and the closest stairway. From the position of the room/suite, I would suspect he was very close to a stairway.

There were stairs right outside of his main door, to the right (walking out). I'm not sure if they're the same stairs that were barricaded, but I'd assume so.

 

[ohreally]

The hairdresser also said that he told her two months ago that he had bought MD a ticket to the Philippines. She states that MD was with him. Yet MD says she only found out a few weeks before she went on her trip. Someone's not telling the truth IMO.
The hairdresser saw him for three haircuts over the last three years and said he smelled like alcohol each time and that he mentioned that he had been gambling all night.
Mr. Wynn says the only unusual thing about him was that he never drank.
I don't know who to belive with all of the differant stories. What I find hard to believe is that he was an alcoholic that got drunk all the time while gambling and yet was using his math skills to figure out the algorithm of the machine.

 

[m00c0w]

The hairdresser also said that he told her two months ago that he had bought MD a ticket to the Philippines. She states that MD was with him. Yet MD says she only found out a few weeks before she went on her trip. Someone's not telling the truth IMO.
The hairdresser saw him for three haircuts over the last three years and said he smelled like alcohol each time and that he mentioned that he had been gambling all night.
Mr. Wynn says the only unusual thing about him was that he never drank.
I don't know who to belive with all of the differant stories. What I find hard to believe is that he was an alcoholic that got drunk all the time while gambling and yet was using his math skills to figure out the algorithm of the machine.

Thank you for highlighting some of my issues with all of these witness accounts. It certainly makes it hard to come up with a valid analysis of the situation.

 

[jjenny]

I noticed the same thing. A lot of stories about him have been contradictory. Who knows what is actually accurate?

 

[CARIIS]

Do you know for a fact he was self-medicating with alcohol? Do you know if there was actually a "mental decline"? What are these items being based on? Why do you feel that there wasn't a trigger sometime in October that caused him to start planning something he was capable of, but had no other interest in prior? Why do you feel there is a mental health aspect such as sociopathy, when we know next to nothing about him (and are therefore taking shots in the dark at nearly anything mental health related), versus something like radicalization occurring over the last several months?

Him committing suicide also doesn't mean he thought what he did was actually wrong, at all. At its very basic, it just meant he did not want to go through our legal system.

Disagree

Unless someone has struggled with suicidal issues it is not like that

It is an endless battle not to do so. It has nothing to do with some system. Nor is it )especially males) attn seeking===
-- there is no concern for some system.

It is about being done - empty-


he was done

 

[human]

I noticed the same thing. A lot of stories about him have been contradictory. Who knows what is actually accurate?

All we know is that SP was loved by some, he had good relationships with his ex wives, and he planned out a meticulous way of gunning down hundreds of people.

From other shooters we saw that they wanted a gf but could not get one. Several wanted gf’s. He had many people at his beck and call.

He grew up poor but had led a life of money but even billionaires ( some) do not have enough money so maybe he did not think he had enough.

Not having much furnishings and going out to eat seems like a good thing to me so I do not see those as issues.

He was so silent about his plans. Was he chuckling about what he was going to pull off?

 

[human]

I am curious about the story a prostitute had about him having violent sex.

She said she would scream. It seems like hotel walls are thin. No one heard screams?

 

[HMSHood]

All we know is that SP was loved by some, he had good relationships with his ex wives, and he planned out a meticulous way of gunning down hundreds of people.

From other shooters we saw that they wanted a gf but could not get one. Several wanted gf’s. He had many people at his beck and call.

He grew up poor but had led a life of money but even billionaires ( some) do not have enough money so maybe he did not think he had enough.

Not having much furnishings and going out to eat seems like a good thing to me so I do not see those as issues.

He was so silent about his plans. Was he chuckling about what he was going to pull off?

Stephen Paddock is a person who is never happy despite what he has.

 

[CARIIS]

CARIIS, love everything you write (sometimes I'm a little slow on the humor, though) I am intrigued by the meter of behavior
discussed here.....from just a totally evil jerk-- addict--personality disorder-- severe mental illness-- to possible cognitive decline.
I read every post and think about them as I walk or do work that doesn't require all my attention. I marked the ones in red that really indicated a pattern. One can not help but notice the attendees of this open air concert: beautiful, youthful, funloving, employed, productive, smiling, confident, cowboy boots & hats, enjoying time with pals and family, packed shoulder-to-shoulder, enjoying the simple melodized phrases/themes of country music....... And, you know what?? All doing the one thing in life that SP could never do, FIT IN!!! It didn't/couldn't happen. Sure, he may have "issues & history" (don't we all, to some extent?) I think he was jealous, angry and was going to make every one else pay for what he would never be....accepted, popular, and comfortable in his own skin. It is creepy (descriptive as opposed to derogatory) how he insulated himself from the world. Big metal electronic video machines all around him with lights and sounds providing a buffer from real life. (I wonder if he wore his brown gloves and brought his own disinfectant wipes for the machines?) Keeping the blinds down so people could not see him (or criticize him?), short/distant family encounters buffered by the "perks of the casinos" so he did not have to entertain or be hospitable to people in his home. (Especially as his gun collection grew.)

TY

I do think for all of us there are certain
events thats haunt us . All for different reasons but there are certain ones that haunt us

I do have trouble with the concept of evil - but think that is like religion stuff.

There is imo no evil in that context.

It is a diabetic not eating sugar cookies - not a good idea

now I suppose that is ideal considering what I did for a living !!

There was nothing evil about any of the suffering people I experienced in my life

There was not.

They were sick.

That simple

not a choice

is that an excuse

nah

is it ok (such a stupid word for this) no it is not

Do I think this dude was evil ?

No I do not

He was sick

Does calling another person evil make some feel better?

Give it a reason?

Does it help understand?

IMO no === its a close off

It leads nowhere -- he is evil next thread

IMO not how life works

much more complicated

On the way to the grocery store do I end up shaking my head in confusion -- the numbe
is astounding

BUT it is also scary ....... because the next time -- there will be a next time -- this is gonna become a fad -- just like smashing people with cars has


In a bizarre fashion ( power control helplessness) this is really scary stuff

I really cant imagine another situation of more helplessness

bullets raining down on you no clear line of sight like go left or right they are just raining

the noises got to the point to where I could not hear the noise and clicked away

horrid stuff

but back on track

excuses no

he had a horrid life -- he was miserable and mentally ill and here we are

we can call him evil next week go back to whatever we think is important

but honestly

at the end of the day

it would

as a society behoove us to truly grasp what this is is it totally preventable nah

nothing is

but chalking it up to evil and moving along

only guarantees that it shall continue.....

it really is that simple...........

moo

 

[CARIIS]

Not wanting go through legal system would suggest knowing what he did was wrong, since wrongdoings are punished by the legal system.

There were many times , when folks that I had rapport with, who expressed great remorse for wanting to kill me last week because I was after them

its not an all or nothing proposition - it ebbs it flows it worse some days they are not stupid they have defective brains and brains control all

it like the brain is an ever changing entity

It would be easier to understand if it was static it is not moo