NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #9

[Betty P]

what guns were taken?
what narcs got murdered?
I think the report is credible but incomplete.

If you read the report about his September trips, his antics with baggage, moving from hotel to hotel to home, back to hotel like a robot you will see that if the report is accurate in relation to these movements that not only was he physically capable of doing what he did, it is highly likely he did it.
I believe he did it. I believe he acted alone.
Because, seriously, even if he was dealing in elephants it makes no difference to the events of the night of October 1st or his part in it.
Have you read the report on the door openings and closures in those rooms on that night and can you say definitively that the door leading to the second suite was not monitored?

My problem with that door is not the locking system, it is that in the images contained in the report, it appears not to have been damaged though was forcefully opened.

Remember his stash of powder was in his own car in the valet garage.
I don't know why it was there and not within his line of sight from one of the hotel windows when he could possibly have lit it ..

Its fine to ask questions but there is no evidence that anybody else helped him now.
Yes, its possible the entire report is a lie, but my gut says it's not.

Agree. JMO, the information gaps in the report most likely reflect some delays by the hotel, LE and SWAT in responding to the first "shots fired" report from the security guard. Looking at the timeline, its unlikely a quicker response would have made a lot of difference, but it may have helped a little. You had the security guard telling hotel security there were shots fired, then within a minute or less, LE outside reporting shots fired, but it took them another 5 minutes or so to get upstairs to Paddock's room

from LA Times article

http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-las-vegas-timeline-20180119-story.html

10 p.m.: Security guard Jesus Campos arrives via elevator on the 32nd floor to investigate an alert of an open door in a guest's room down the hall from Paddock's suite. Campos checks a stairwell door that blocked his entry to the floor minutes earlier and discovers that it has been fastened closed with an "L" bracket.

10:04 p.m.: Campos calls security dispatch to report the blocked door. His call is routed to the facility's maintenance department, which dispatches maintenance engineer Stephen Schuck to go to the floor.

10:05 p.m.: Paddock fires two initial shots at the Las Vegas Village, the open-air venue across the street from the hotel where the Route 91 Harvest music festival is being held, with more than 20,000 attendees. Then he fires more.

10:06 p.m.: Campos hears what he later described as rapid drilling noises as Paddock fires about 100 rounds at concertgoers. Paddock, who has placed surveillance cameras outside his room, starts shooting through his door and down the hallway at Campos, hitting the security guard in the leg. Campos, who is unarmed, takes cover and radios a hotel dispatcher for help, giving Paddock's room number on the 32nd floor.

10:07 p.m.: Paddock resumes firing hundreds of rounds at concertgoers. Two Las Vegas police officers are already in the building on another call. They head upstairs, presumably to try to find the source of the gunfire, along with two armed Mandalay Bay security guards. Over the next two minutes, Paddock takes several potshots at jet-fuel storage tanks at the nearby airport — striking them twice but not igniting the fuel — before resuming fire on the concert crowd.

10:10 p.m.: Schuck, the building engineer, arrives on the 32nd floor, and Campos yells for him to take cover. Paddock starts firing down the hallway, and Schuck radios hotel dispatch to send police to the 32nd floor.

10:11 p.m.: The two police officers arrive on the 31st floor — one floor below Paddock's — as the gunman resumes firing on the concert crowd.

10:12 p.m.: Two armed Mandalay Bay security officers arrive on the 32nd floor, and the police and security officers on the 31st floor realize that the shooting is coming from one floor above them.

10:15 p.m.: Paddock fires his final shots at concertgoers.

10:16 p.m.: The two police officers on the 31st floor enter the stairwell outside the 32nd floor hallway but do not confront Paddock.

10:57 p.m.: Police breach the sealed 32nd-floor stairwell doorway.

11:20 p.m.: Police use explosives to blow open Paddock's door, and they discover him dead.

11:26 p.m.: Police breach the interior door to Paddock's second room, where a police officer accidentally fires three rounds into the room.

The fact they had the SWAT team go on 60 minutes the next day to present themselves as heroes was a red flag that someone was trying to do spin control. SWAT didn't even breach the room until nearly an hour after the shooting began. It looks like a lot of damage control by LE and Mandalay Bay, serving more as an unnecessary distraction from the real investigation.

JMO, Paddock may have had a shady background when it came to becoming wealthy (my theory is money laundering for drug and possibly other criminal kingpins, maybe more). There were also probably a few opportunities along the way where people and/or businesses saw suspicious activity and could have raised an alarm.

All the corporate damage/image control makes the actual shooting appear more suspicious than it actually is. But they need to keep digging and reveal to the public Paddock's other illegal activities, including those involving family and prior wives and girlfriends.

ETA: Re the explosive powder in his car, IIRC LE speculated that Paddock thought he could escape after the shooting. Sounds like he had the explosives in the car to use somehow in aiding his escape. Or maybe he planned a second cataclysmic event for that night. Guy was crazy, violent.

 

[kittythehare]

Agree. JMO, the information gaps in the report most likely reflect some delays by the hotel, LE and SWAT in responding to the first "shots fired" report from the security guard. Looking at the timeline, its unlikely a quicker response would have made a lot of difference, but it may have helped a little. You had the security guard telling hotel security there were shots fired, then within a minute or less, LE outside reporting shots fired, but it took them another 5 minutes or so to get upstairs to Paddock's room

from LA Times article

http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-las-vegas-timeline-20180119-story.html





The fact they had the SWAT team go on 60 minutes the next day to present themselves as heroes was a red flag that someone was trying to do spin control. SWAT didn't even breach the room until nearly an hour after the shooting began. It looks like a lot of damage control by LE and Mandalay Bay, serving more as an unnecessary distraction from the real investigation.

JMO, Paddock may have had a shady background when it came to becoming wealthy (my theory is money laundering for drug and possibly other criminal kingpins, maybe more). There were also probably a few opportunities along the way where people and/or businesses saw suspicious activity and could have raised an alarm.

All the corporate damage/image control makes the actual shooting appear more suspicious than it actually is. But they need to keep digging and reveal to the public Paddock's other illegal activities, including those involving family and prior wives and girlfriends.

ETA: Re the explosive powder in his car, IIRC LE speculated that Paddock thought he could escape after the shooting. Sounds like he had the explosives in the car to use somehow in aiding his escape. Or maybe he planned a second cataclysmic event for that night. Guy was crazy, violent.

Yeah, that's why it is so mind blowing... guy was as crazy as a storm...

He had visited mB on numerous occasions. he knew how it worked, he had brought and removed baggage frequently.

Wy the practice runs?
Almost like a mercenary..
Why the 12 month training period?

Had he a deadline?
did he believe he had a fatal illness and only had a short time to live?

Why did he want to kill people, with guns, from heights when he could have killed more easily with readily available bomb making equipment?

Everything here is about his psyche.

He could have done what he did with far fewer guns, like very few guns..

He overdid it.

I can get no handle on his psyche, motivation, methodology..

He left several hundred images of child to be found.. why?

Why did he need 4 laptops to accompany him when two would be optimal in case one failed?

The other thing that irked me was that when Sheriff was asked why he thought Paddock stopped shooting, he replied it was because he felt lE were closing in.

But he had enough cameras mounted to be able to see every movement in the corridor..
He had researched police protocols.. he knew when they were likely to move and how long it took to get a SWAT team involved.

Also strange, and new, to me was the shooting at the tanks sequence.. I had always assumed he took shots at the tanks before he shot the people?

 

[Betty P]

Yeah, that's why it is so mind blowing... guy was as crazy as a storm...

He had visited mB on numerous occasions. he knew how it worked, he had brought and removed baggage frequently.

Wy the practice runs?
Almost like a mercenary..
Why the 12 month training period?

Had he a deadline?
did he believe he had a fatal illness and only had a short time to live?

Why did he want to kill people, with guns, from heights when he could have killed more easily with readily available bomb making equipment?

Everything here is about his psyche.

He could have done what he did with far fewer guns, like very few guns..

He overdid it.

I can get no handle on his psyche, motivation, methodology..

He left several hundred images of child to be found.. why?

Why did he need 4 laptops to accompany him when two would be optimal in case one failed?

The other thing that irked me was that when Sheriff was asked why he thought Paddock stopped shooting, he replied it was because he felt lE were closing in.

But he had enough cameras mounted to be able to see every movement in the corridor..
He had researched police protocols.. he knew when they were likely to move and how long it took to get a SWAT team involved.

Also strange, and new, to me was the shooting at the tanks sequence.. I had always assumed he took shots at the tanks before he shot the people?

JMO, he was OCD. He was pathologically dependent on being highly organized with lots of redundancy and back-up systems. It showed in his choice of hobby/career as a video poker gambler playing multiple machines for hours on end. He also had a psychological need to control other people. I think all the social isolation and years of playing endless hours of video poker (and whatever else he was doing) caused him to have a psychotic break. In his gambling addiction, he'd reached a point of diminishing returns. As LE pointed out, he wasn't making as much money with his gambling and real estate deals. In fact, he'd been losing more than winning. He was very narcissistic, so losing money was very humiliating and upsetting.

My earlier theory about money laundering also comes into play. If he was doing that (and we don't know) via video poker, etc. he was becoming less efficient at laundering cash. People paying him to launder money may have decided to terminate him. They're accustomed to losing a certain percentage of their money in the laundering process, but if his losses were becoming excessive, they wouldn't tolerate it. Perhaps going on the shooting spree was his way of living out a sick fantasy and proving to everyone that he was still a powerful guy who deserved respect. Twisted, for sure.

ETA: If he was involved in money laundering, Mandalay Bay would not want that to be made public, though I don't know how they could prevent the IRS from investigating.

ETA#2: The 4 laptops and multiple guns reminds me of how he usually played 4 or 5 video poker games at the same time. He set it all up the same as he did when he was gambling. IIRC, he was also gambling online from his room, so would have needed multiple computers to do that.

Winning at video pokers requires that you have a formula that gives you slightly higher odds of winning. To maximize that, you have to play as many games as possible and gamble large amounts of money, hence playing 4 or 5 machines for endless hours, day after day. If your winning strategy gives you an average 2 or 3% increased chance of winning, you have to gamble many, many times to make that worthwhile. I'm not an expert on that, go back in the earlier threads here and you'll see people discussing it. The increased odds of winning are very small and you have to play A LOT to win anything.

 

[kittythehare]

JMO, he was OCD. He was pathologically dependent on being highly organized with lots of redundancy and back-up systems. It showed in his choice of hobby/career as a video poker gambler playing multiple machines for hours on end. He also had a psychological need to control other people. I think all the social isolation and years of playing endless hours of video poker (and whatever else he was doing) caused him to have a psychotic break. In his gambling addiction, he'd reached a point of diminishing returns. As LE pointed out, he wasn't making as much money with his gambling and real estate deals. In fact, he'd been losing more than winning. He was very narcissistic, so losing money was very humiliating and upsetting.

My earlier theory about money laundering also comes into play. If he was doing that (and we don't know) via video poker, etc. he was becoming less efficient at laundering cash. People paying him to launder money may have decided to terminate him. They're accustomed to losing a certain percentage of their money in the laundering process, but if his losses were becoming excessive, they wouldn't tolerate it. Perhaps going on the shooting spree was his way of living out a sick fantasy and proving to everyone that he was still a powerful guy who deserved respect. Twisted, for sure.

ETA: If he was involved in money laundering, Mandalay Bay would not want that to be made public, though I don't know how they could prevent the IRS from investigating.

I know we discussed this in great detail in the early threads.. and his playing methodology.. he had a system for beating the odds, I did not understand the system because I don't understand the games.

I was kinda hoping we would receive a brief on his playing rhythm over the nights leading up to the attack and a comparison to his previous playing patterns.
I wonder whether his mental deterioration as described in the report affected his playing skill too?

I like the OCD.
It fits.

But the report stated he lived off his gambling, gambled off his gambling.. we surely could use an in depth report on his gambling .. what it indicates of his mind..

IF.. IF the other person is a trader in child , was Paddock a buyer or a seller?

how lucrative is that business?

 

[Betty P]

I know we discussed this in great detail in the early threads.. and his playing methodology.. he had a system for beating the odds, I did not understand the system because I don't understand the games.

I was kinda hoping we would receive a brief on his playing rhythm over the nights leading up to the attack and a comparison to his previous playing patterns.
I wonder whether his mental deterioration as described in the report affected his playing skill too?

I like the OCD.
It fits.

But the report stated he lived off his gambling, gambled off his gambling.. we surely could use an in depth report on his gambling .. what it indicates of his mind..

IF.. IF the other person is a trader in child , was Paddock a buyer or a seller?

how lucrative is that business?

Somewhere a few pages back, there's a copy of their timeline showing the hours he gambled in the days leading up to the shooting. He was still gambling a lot, IIRC, 8 or 9 hrs at a time. LE also did do a report showing how much money he was losing at gambling in recent months. I'd do a search for you, but have to take off from here in a little bit. I think it was FBI. They're theorizing that he was upset at losing money, could no longer keep up appearances, was psycho, etc. so that's why he did the shooting. JMO, it was a little more. His losing at gambling was upsetting for him, but also may have caused even more fear and anxiety if he was being paid to do it by others or if he was laundering cash from his own illegal business that others were invested in.

The child , I don't know about. Haven't thought much about it yet, but it could be related. Are there people in that horrid business who make a lot of money at it? Who would need someone to launder cash? IDK. JMO, I also think he had more money (and possibly accounts that he controlled) in offshore bank accounts, in other countries. I had theorized thats what his girlfriend was doing after she left the US, traveling to other Asian cities (wasn't one Taiwan?) to pick up money from foreign bank accounts Paddock had. Just a theory, not sure.

 

[watergirl62]

Agree. JMO, the information gaps in the report most likely reflect some delays by the hotel, LE and SWAT in responding to the first "shots fired" report from the security guard. Looking at the timeline, its unlikely a quicker response would have made a lot of difference, but it may have helped a little. You had the security guard telling hotel security there were shots fired, then within a minute or less, LE outside reporting shots fired, but it took them another 5 minutes or so to get upstairs to Paddock's room

from LA Times article

http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-las-vegas-timeline-20180119-story.html





The fact they had the SWAT team go on 60 minutes the next day to present themselves as heroes was a red flag that someone was trying to do spin control. SWAT didn't even breach the room until nearly an hour after the shooting began. It looks like a lot of damage control by LE and Mandalay Bay, serving more as an unnecessary distraction from the real investigation.

JMO, Paddock may have had a shady background when it came to becoming wealthy (my theory is money laundering for drug and possibly other criminal kingpins, maybe more). There were also probably a few opportunities along the way where people and/or businesses saw suspicious activity and could have raised an alarm.

All the corporate damage/image control makes the actual shooting appear more suspicious than it actually is. But they need to keep digging and reveal to the public Paddock's other illegal activities, including those involving family and prior wives and girlfriends.

ETA: Re the explosive powder in his car, IIRC LE speculated that Paddock thought he could escape after the shooting. Sounds like he had the explosives in the car to use somehow in aiding his escape. Or maybe he planned a second cataclysmic event for that night. Guy was crazy, violent.

Second cataclysmic event... Reminds me of James Holmes' (Aurora theater) booby-trapped apartment.

 

[kittythehare]

Somewhere a few pages back, there's a copy of their timeline showing the hours he gambled in the days leading up to the shooting. He was still gambling a lot, IIRC, 8 or 9 hrs at a time. LE also did do a report showing how much money he was losing at gambling in recent months. I'd do a search for you, but have to take off from here in a little bit. I think it was FBI. They're theorizing that he was upset at losing money, could no longer keep up appearances, was psycho, etc. so that's why he did the shooting. JMO, it was a little more. His losing at gambling was upsetting for him, but also may have caused even more fear and anxiety if he was being paid to do it by others or if he was laundering cash from his own illegal business that others were invested in.

The child , I don't know about. Haven't thought much about it yet, but it could be related. Are there people in that horrid business who make a lot of money at it? Who would need someone to launder cash? IDK. JMO, I also think he had more money (and possibly accounts that he controlled) in offshore bank accounts, in other countries. I had theorized thats what his girlfriend was doing after she left the US, traveling to other Asian cities (wasn't one Taiwan?) to pick up money from foreign bank accounts Paddock had. Just a theory, not sure.

The hours are in the report.. it's the pattern that interests me, whether his gaming became more erratic as his mental condition deteriorated, did he start making mistakes etc..

I do not know anything about the child business but I will research it later and post if I find anything credible and useful.

 

[Betty P]

Second cataclysmic event... Reminds me of James Holmes' (Aurora theater) booby-trapped apartment.

Yeah, great point! Paddock could have rigged his own home, but he put stuff in his car instead. He must have had some other scenario in mind, for whatever reason. :thinking:

 

[kittythehare]

https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/citizens-guide-us-federal-law-child-🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬

http://www.economics-ejournal.org/economics/discussionpapers/2017-15/file

As a notorious and highly publicizedexample, Landslide productions which sold subscriptions to websites offering child pornographywas taken down in 2001. The monthly profit of the company was 1.4 million dollars and it hadmore than 300,000 subscribers in 60 countries (Taylor and Quayle, 2003: 25; Broughton, 2009) !!!

See 4.1 !!!! It will not copy paste for me, sorry, please read it.

“Sweetie”. In a sting operation orchestrated by TDH Netherlands, 1000 potentialabusers offered Sweetie money for sexual acts in 10 weeks (Crawford, 2013; Lemz, 2014).
Furthermore, the total price of eachsession ranges from 11.50 to 46 US dollars (Terre des Hommes Netherlands, 2013a: 25)

Really feels to be his game.. I'll dig some more.. his overseas trips.. who did he meet?

This appears to be a massive area which I know nothing about so I'll just stick to peer reviewed , cited or apparently sound literature.
Am specifically searching for turnover figures..
Warning- it is deeply upsetting reading.
It's not graphic but it's cold.
figures from 2006 https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB114485422875624000

 

[CoolJ]

Paddock was an arms dealer. It is laid out in black and white. I have no idea how anyone, esp. the media can’t just put two and two together. Paddock was selling firearms, ammo and explosives. It ain’t rocket science.

 

[coastal]

From Doug Poppa

http://baltimorepostexaminer.com/sh...-injuries-851/2018/01/20#sthash.prNY4EiW.uxfs

After reviewing the 300 pages of the FBI search warrants and affidavits that were released last Friday and what I read in the LVMPD preliminary report, I feel comfortable in saying that I believe Stephen Paddock was the lone shooter responsible for the Las Vegas October 1, 2017 massacre and that he alone fired from his suite on the 32nd floor of the Mandalay Bay Hotel. There is ample evidence to support that.

Well then! That settles things nicely, doesn't it?

Move along. Nothing to see here...

I feel better already.

 

[kittythehare]

Well then! That settles things nicely, doesn't it?

Move along. Nothing to see here...

I feel better already.

It does actually and it will settle them better when he writes up his analysis of the report.
I believe him to be qualified to judge it.


I disagree with his views on MD but he's very sharp on and well informed on most aspects of this case.
that will be coming soon..
He will be interviewed by tricia this evening on blogtalk radio.
Let's see what he comes up with..

 

[x_files]

Paddock was an arms dealer. It is laid out in black and white. I have no idea how anyone, esp. the media can’t just put two and two together. Paddock was selling firearms, ammo and explosives. It ain’t rocket science.

That's my takeaway from the evidence also.

 

[dizzychick]

wonder if they are looking into the big mouth brother?

 

[kittythehare]

wonder if they are looking into the big mouth brother?

BRILLIANT thinking..

 

[Gooddeeds]

wonder if they are looking into the big mouth brother?

Being as he has announced he is keeping SP ashes in his Safety Deposit box...
That’s just a weird statement to be made public.
He also said early on he wanted to donate SP estate to help the victims...

 

[kittythehare]

Being as he has announced he is keeping SP ashes in his Safety Deposit box...
That’s just a weird statement to be made public.
He also said early on he wanted to donate SP estate to help the victims...

I couldn't help notice he was pretty subdued at the presser he held, or occurred at the time of the handing over of the ashes.. Review Journal covered the story. I remember sharing it here, or intending to..
He wants to just get back to his life now.. or words to that effect.

 

[Gooddeeds]

I couldn't help notice he was pretty subdued at the presser he held, or occurred at the time of the handing over of the ashes.. Review Journal covered the story. I remember sharing it here, or intending to..
He wants to just get back to his life now.. or words to that effect.

I missed the handing over?

 

[kittythehare]

I missed the handing over?

was here discussed a little.. either week of warrants and week of report or week before. I'll try finding it
Gottit https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime/shootings/coroner-releases-las-vegas-shooters-cremated-remains/

 

[CoolJ]

wonder if they are looking into the big mouth brother?

He is a suspicious character isn’t he? How could he not be on the radar?