NV - Jessica Valenzuela, 32, dead, 36 injured, car plows into crowd, Las Vegas, 20 Dec 2015 *arrest*

  • #301
I’m saying they should be in a mental institution BEFORE they commit the crime, not after. At that point, it is too late.

But in this case though, I don’t even think this girl should have been in a mental institution. As I have already said, I think she was just suffering from major depression. I believe that medication and therapy would have prevented this from happening. It seems that she was doing pretty good when she was getting help from that non-profit organization that gave her an award. She just needed some help, and obviously she wasn’t getting it in Las Vegas.

She had only been in Vegas for a week though right? Sleeping in her car with her baby.

I really don't think we know enough to even say she was suffering from depression.

Maybe she was just sad. Pissed. Bored. Evil.

If I had to guess, I think this all boils down to her obsession of a man. May be her child's father/may not be.
That's just my hunch.


Again, premeditation...
Sources say Holloway told police "I am in pain, and I want others to feel my pain also."
 
  • #302
It does make total sense, if you look at it that she snapped mentally, and was looking for a way to get out of her hopeless situation, of living in her car on the Las Vegas Strip with her baby and no money, and no way of taking care of her.

Why this specific, tragic, horrific act though? I agree with everything you've said, but I can't get that to match up to her actions. So yes, she snapped, but she went to angry and homicidal in a way that doesn't suggest depression to me.
 
  • #303
She was in Las Vegas sleeping in her car, and had no money to go any place. That makes her homeless. What ever resources she may or may not have had in Portland would be irrelevant to her situation in Las Vegas.

No it doesn't.

What do you mean no money to get anyplace? She had gas.

I could leave my home right now and drive to Baton Rouge with no money. I could sleep in my car for a week.

I would not be homeless. I would be away from my home.
 
  • #304
If she did this because she was looking for a way to get out of her "hopeless situation" by intentionally plowing down humans, then not only did she know it was wrong, it was premeditated. That's not snapping. Can't be both.

ETA: do we really know how hopeless her situation was? Are we basing it solely on the fact that she was sleeping in her car?

I think that most people would consider that sleeping in a car with a baby to be a hopeless situation. Especially if it was for more then a couple of days.
 
  • #305
WAY off topic...........KaaBoom, I love Coos Bay! You live in a beautiful place!!
 
  • #306
Because if she did in fact have a home and loving family and she chose to go to Vegas and sleep in her car WITH HER BABY, that's not hopeless. That's just stupid.

JMO

Please link to any article that says she had a loving family to go to. Thats not constant with what has already been posted, that she came from a dysfunctional family with an uneducated drug addicted and/or alcoholic mother.
 
  • #307
I think that most people would consider that sleeping in a car with a baby to be a hopeless situation. Especially if it was for more then a couple of days.

But you have to look at WHY she was in the car. Was it by choice? Were there better options that she didn't choose?
Maybe she was determined to be there for some reason no matter what.

What are we basing the "hopeless" on besides the fact that she was sleeping in her car??? Her statement? Her word means nothing to me. You kind of lose that when you murder innocent people.

Because her family is saying something completely different.
Who do we believe?
 
  • #308
Please link to any article that says she had a loving family to go to. Thats not constant with what has already been posted, that she came from a dysfunctional family with an uneducated drug addicted and/or alcoholic mother.

That's what her family has said. I just read it here. I'll go grab the link. You were saying it was bad reporting. Can't find your post now. Still looking.

ETA: and also notice I said "if she did in fact"
IF

ETA: still looking for a link even though I don't really need to. My post..,
"Because if she did in fact have a home and loving family and she chose to go to Vegas and sleep in her car WITH HER BABY, that's not hopeless. That's just stupid."

ETA:
But a family representative told CNN that Holloway wasn't homeless, had a job and comes from a loving family.

[video=cnn;us/2015/12/22/las-vegas-strip-crash-elam-dnt-erin.cnn]http://edition.cnn.com/2015/12/22/us/las-vegas-strip-pedestrians-lakeisha-holloway/index.html[/video]
 
  • #309
  • #310
She had only been in Vegas for a week though right? Sleeping in her car with her baby.

I really don't think we know enough to even say she was suffering from depression.

I believe there is already enough evidence.

Symptoms of depression can include:

Agitation, restlessness, and irritability, anger (I think there is evidence she was agitated and angry)
Becoming withdrawn or isolated (She was sleeping in her car. That's pretty isolated.)
Fatigue and lack of energy (She complained of being deprived of sleep. Thats an indication of fatigue.)
Feeling hopeless and helpless, worthless, guilty, self-hate (I can’t imagine anyone being in that situation, and not feeling that way.)
Loss of interest or pleasure in activities that were once enjoyed (She seems to have had more activities in the past, job, education, etc.)
Sudden change in appetite, often with weight gain or loss (insufficient information)
Thoughts of death or suicide(insufficient information)
Trouble concentrating(insufficient information)
Trouble sleeping or sleeping too much She complained of not getting enough sleep.

https://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000945.htm
 
  • #311
I come from what many would call a dysfunctional family riddled with substance abuse and poverty. But I come from a loving family.

Some of my childhood memories are horrific and I've seen things no child should ever see. But I was loved then and I'm loved now.

Who says she couldn't come from a dysfunctional family with an alcoholic, undereducated mother AND a loving family?

To add, I've suffered through anxiety and depression. I've never ONCE thought of hurting someone else because I was hurting. NOT ONCE.

This thread is full of excuses and "reasons" this vile human did what she did.

God bless the victims, their families and that precious baby girl who was put through unnecessary trauma.


JMO
 
  • #312
No it doesn't.

What do you mean no money to get anyplace? She had gas.

I could leave my home right now and drive to Baton Rouge with no money. I could sleep in my car for a week.

I would not be homeless. I would be away from my home.

Las Vegas to Portland is 1000 miles. Thats four tanks of gas, about $100. Unless she had a $100 she was not going to get back to Portland. So she was homeless.

And I’m still waiting for you to give me a link to any article that she has a loving family in Portland who were ready to help her if she got there.
 
  • #313
http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/22/us/las-vegas-strip-pedestrians-lakeisha-holloway/

But a family representative told CNN that Holloway wasn't homeless, had a job and comes from a loving family. The representative declined to comment on what could have prompted the incident.

Weak evidence. One unnamed source who couldn’t explain why she was sleeping in her car on the Las Vegas Strip. Sorry but I need better evidence. Preferably one with a name, but at very least someone who can give an explanation that makes some sense.

Anyway even that unnamed source doesn’t substantiate the claim that she had a loving family ready to help her out.
 
  • #314
Please link to any article that says she had a loving family to go to. Thats not constant with what has already been posted, that she came from a dysfunctional family with an uneducated drug addicted and/or alcoholic mother.

Are we basing it solely on the fact that she was sleeping in her car? No:

moms vice was alcohol reports stated

I think being homeless in high school is pretty indicative that she did not have "family" that was there for her.

In addition, folks who dont have very serious needs probably would not be "admitted" into the program she was in due to space/ funding issues


we reconnect alienated at-risk youth affected by poverty, family instability and homelessness; with high school.......

http://www.portlandoic.org/

Holloway — whose alcoholic mother kicked her out of the family house when she was a high school freshman — graduated from Portland’s Rosemary Anderson High with a 3.4 GPA and earned $17,000 in scholarships.

Holloway said her mother struggled to raise her children. The single mom with an eighth-grade education “drank more and cared less”

I was a scared little girl who knew that there was more to life outside of crime, drug addiction, lower income, alcoholism, being under-educated — all of which I grew up being familiar with,” she said.

As a homeless freshman, Holloway’s GPA dripped to 1.41.

...broken many generational cycles

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/suspect-deadly-las-vegas-strip-crash-overcame-adversity-article-1.2473587


 
  • #315
I’m saying they should be in a mental institution BEFORE they commit the crime, not after. At that point, it is too late.

But in this case though, I don’t even think this girl should have been in a mental institution. As I have already said, I think she was just suffering from major depression. I believe that medication and therapy would have prevented this from happening. It seems that she was doing pretty good when she was getting help from that non-profit organization that gave her an award. She just needed some help, and obviously she wasn’t getting it in Las Vegas.

I’m saying they should be in a mental institution BEFORE they commit the crime,

Totally imo

Additionally the pics we have seen of the baby looked nurished , attended and cared for. Mom was doing good.

The media use of snapped is jazzy, but as we have seen most cases - mentall illiness is a chronic illiness that marinates for years before taking over judgement.

Dear had been warning neighbors to put some aluminim in his roof

Holmes had drawings of killing people for a long time

Luka was releasing motion pictures of hacking somone up

Laupfner was obssessed with ongresswom for some time before killing her

Elliot Rodgers wrote a Gone With the Wind journey of misery

Cho prepared videos and pics, and horribly fell thro mental health system

There is a genetic connection to mental illiness - in reality we can say people are born with a predispostion to mental suffering at birth.

Until society realizes it is an illiness no different than a predispostioin to breast cancer, mental health will, unaddressed will contine to plague our country with the horrors we have seen.

IMO

it has long been estabished in the field there are genetics involved, just like any other illiness

........first of many studies identified five major mental illnesses that could be traced to the same gene variations. Schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, depression, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) and autism all share variations on four chromosomes.

https://www.geneticliteracyproject....n-door-to-new-treatments-of-mental-disorders/
 
  • #316
It does make total sense, if you look at it that she snapped mentally, and was looking for a way to get out of her hopeless situation, of living in her car on the Las Vegas Strip with her baby and no money, and no way of taking care of her.

and for all we know her intent may have been to kill herself and her child to avoid her child living the way she had too when younger.

It could be the first jump on the sidewalk failed in acheiving that- possibly she changed her mind once she got up on the sidewalk, pulled off the sidewalk and then a bit later decided she was going to do it.

She then went back on the sidewalk a third time

back and forth possibly

I think the media has ignored that she had a flat tire, which I found signfigant in the pulling off at the final stop.. she knew she could not get far with a flat tire so just surrendered.

or posssibly realaized she had better get the people help by getting 911 rolling

all speculation of course

she knew her child would be taken away, maybe that was her ultimate goal- to not have her baby experince what she did her early years .......MOO
 
  • #317
"Factors that may or may not have come into play."

That's an excellent way to explain it, or at least a place to start to make some sense of it. I keep trying to think what combination of factors could lead a person to do this and I can't. Even if she's ill, on drugs, desperate, scared, suicidal, being chased by demons real or imagined ... how does that end with ploughing into a crowd of people, killing or injuring everyone who got in her way? And not just once, and not by accident.

Whatever is going on in her life and whatever she's dealing with - people have survived worse. Why her and why THIS? Of all the things she might have done.

I kind of think using a car as a weapon is throwing us "off".

Why her and why THIS?-We can say the same type of things about about Elliot doing drive bys

Why her and why THIS? We could say same about movie theatre masicare

Why her and why THIS? Can ask same question about hacking someone up and putting them in a suitcase

Why her and why THIS? We can ak same question about plunging a knife in a strangers heart

Why her and why THIS? We can ask the same question about going into a elemenatary schoool......

There are really no differences - I think we have gotten desnestized to gun violence - so that is easier to wrap our heads around . Just mo
 
  • #318
Yeah maybe she was just working her sick coward guts up to it for a week in an angry freaky frenzy after leaving to go to Vegas simply to do this. Although, if I had the money to stay in a motel while working my guts up to mass murder, I'd spend it because I'd just be dead or imprisoned soon, right? What's a little more debt in that situation,right?

For some reason I get more of a sense of of impulse as oppssed to premeidated

exhaustion and insomnia , with a dash of artifical stimulent is a very dangerous mix for our brains ...we also do not know ,nor have heard anything about "food"
 
  • #319
:facepalm:Total garbage reporting. Just more Faux News style reporting from CNN. If she wasn’t homeless then what was she doing sleeping in her car on the Las Vegas Strip? Of course the representative declined to answer, because there is no explanation.

That was why I put the two question marks !!
 
  • #320
Sounds so easy...

--I wonder if they have emergency shelter housing for women with children. That's a population that has a very difficult time getting emergency housing in my area, because it's the most needed and they can't just put them all in a big dorm like they do with the guys at the mission. In my brief period of homelessness, we contacted every available local agency, both in a proactive and reactive fashion (as many won't help until it's basically too late) and I'm a social services worker, so I know them all, and were put on the waiting lists...the average wait time was two months for EMERGENCY SHELTER, and 18-36 months for more permanent. They did, however, give us a bag of peanuts, a loaf of bread, and a box of Twinkies.

--As an early education provider for low-income "at-risk" families, I used to encourage them to ask DHS for help, too. That was, until I saw the can of worms that opens. They go in saying, "I need help with my child while I get sober and housing." Months later, they're sober, they have housing, but now DHS has decided a myriad of other services they have to engage in, some not even remotely applicable...or have decided to take longer to reunite than the child was in care in the first place... Point being, it's really easy to say, "Yeah, go ask them for help that is what they do," but one might as well consider asking DHS for help as semi-voluntarily turning your child over to the state indefinitely. It would be lovely if there were agencies (or more agencies) that would allow you to put your child in short-term care during treatment, etc., without the legal battle to reunite. So, not as particularly viable an option as was presented. There are places that take women with young children in treatment, but not men with children, which doesn't matter in this case, but has mattered in several cases I've worked with.

--When I was there for Halloween, there were tons of people, and the tunnels between the casinos and hotels didn't have chairs, let alone couches. There were benches in lobbies, but anyone lingering there would be noticed. I didn't see one person crashed out on a bench near a casino/hotel. I even commented that the lack of seating areas seemed odd, as if one were having difficulties walking through all the tunnels, there's no where to sit. My experience isn't supposed to be representative of anything except my own recent experience at the Palms. But, I don't think security would look kindly upon people crashing out randomly. The baby, yes, mom, doubt it. IMO. In my brief but awful personal period of homelessness, I know that even though I managed to shower regularly and go to work every day, I looked pretty haggard and carried more bags than looked necessary. I felt like I had "homeless" written across my forehead, but maybe my shame and imagination were in play there.

--I didn't realize pan-handling was an allowed thing there. I didn't see one when I was there, but I did hang in the hotel most of the time. I live in an area where we have a huge transient population (cali to seattle and back is a thing apparently, and we're on that route), so yeah, I suppose that's a possibility. Some folks might feel they're "above it," or don't want their child exposed to that, or don't feel it's safe as it raises vulnerability and raises visibility as far as LE is concerned.

--I didn't realize there were churches on the strip helping people. Cool.

--there were probably local hotlines and mental health agencies, too. People in the throes of an episode, whether it be one of mental illness, drugs, or just evil, aren't always actually looking for help. If she was determined to do this, she's need the "world is against me" woefullness going on, and asking for and getting help doesn't fit the dramatic Parisian-style presentation she was after.

Yikes.

I just googled, there is no less than 10 shelters for women and children in LV.
I have stayed in 3 different hotels, at several different times. They had sofas and people were asleep on them. Once we get used to the time difference, we stay up later at night, and it has made me uneasy going to the room at night.
Everyone I know that has been to LV talks about how many people are out on the streets, sidewalks, the crosswalks over the blvd, pan-handling. Men, women, I'm pregnant help me, I not going to lie I want to get drunk, signs. Playing a guitar, looking pitiful, begging, looking like they are already passed out.
I have always seen church groups, pastors, missionaries, on the strip trying to help people.
I was not up in the older, seedier area, but right on the main strip. You just learn to ignore it.
Before I'd kill innocent people, put my daughter in the system and myself in prison, I'd ask for help.
I don't make excuses for people. I expect people to take responsibility for their choices.
All MOO
 

Staff online

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
125
Guests online
3,229
Total visitors
3,354

Forum statistics

Threads
632,631
Messages
18,629,436
Members
243,230
Latest member
Emz79
Back
Top