NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - # 1

[Fairy1]

I feel that if I went missing and there was record of someone from my ward calling me just hours before I was last seen and they just happened to be in the same state as I, he'd have a lot more questions asked of him than Webb has. I've felt all along that his answer was poorly crafted (especially the phrase "do whatever it was he had to do", nobody says that in normal conversation) to make it sound like he knew especially little about what Steven was doing in Vegas. IMO, that's almost as concerning as saying he knew plenty about what he was doing there. He labored the point. He could have much more easily said, "I called him to ask if he would be at church but he said he wouldnt make it that day. I said I'd see him next week and hung up".

I could be GROSSLY overanalyzing his phrases here. I understand that. Webb could be completely uninvolved. But it needs to be double checked.

I agree. AND - he said that Steven would always call him and let him know if he wasn't going to be at church. Why? And why wouldn't Steven have called him this time? Yet we are to believe that he never asked and Steven never mentioned WHY HE WAS IN VEGAS? No way.

As the mother of a teenaged son, I was thinking maybe it was just a guy thing. But no, I don't think so.

 

[laytonian]

Trying to figure out the timeline is very difficult for me and I just can't get into the minutia of it, not that it is not important. However, it is clear that he was doing alot of unexplained driving. Unless we find him, we will never know where he was going.

I still think that he intended to drive to that destination and he had been there before. He knew who he was meeting however, I do not think that person lived in Sun Anthem City, otherwise he would have abandoned the car away from his actual destination.

RESOURCE PAGE:
I've been playing around tonight, trying to organize things for myself, so I wouldn't have to keep bouncing around to find things -- and came up with this:

http://sites.google.com/site/parallelcooler/home/koecher-html

Is this AT ALL helpful to anyone else? If so, I work on it a bit more, and keep it updated. At least it has the maps, the videos, and the basics organized.

Your comment about the person he met, not living in Sun City Anthem.
WHAT IF (there I go) the other person abandoned their car elsewhere in SCA? Would the "parking enforcement" people have a record if they turned in other abandoned cars in that time period?

 

[CONCRNED CTZN]

Maybe Webb is the person who got Steven into whatever it is that he is into, knew he had talked to Steven...covered his tracks by giving that explanation. He gave Steven the location he was supposed to go possibly in that phone call, or made sure he made it. Where was Webb the night before? Maybe Steven stayed with him? Not saying that Webb did anything, but he may know and just doesn't want to give up his "other" life for Steven's sake.

 

[CONCRNED CTZN]

I agree with you...I think he had "been" doing something, and this time things just didn't go the way he planned.

Gambling does not make sense to me either.

 

[lost at sea]

I have my doubts as to Steven being involved with anything sexual. Many sexual addictions begin with . He didn't have a smartphone with internet access and he didn't have internet access at home. He didn't have a job at an office where he could view .

Im not saying that there aren't other ways to access , but statistically speaking and individual with fewer points of access to that kind of material must be less likely to get involved with the heavier stuff.

I think you'd be hard pressed to find people who meet up for casual encounters who don't habitually watch .

 

[lost at sea]

RESOURCE PAGE:
I've been playing around tonight, trying to organize things for myself, so I wouldn't have to keep bouncing around to find things -- and came up with this:

http://sites.google.com/site/parallelcooler/home/koecher-html

Is this AT ALL helpful to anyone else? If so, I work on it a bit more, and keep it updated. At least it has the maps, the videos, and the basics organized.

Your comment about the person he met, not living in Sun City Anthem.
WHAT IF (there I go) the other person abandoned their car elsewhere in SCA? Would the "parking enforcement" people have a record if they turned in other abandoned cars in that time period?

VERY nice! I like the time zone conversion too.

I'm still debating as whether or not to finish my creation. It contains some liberties I've made regarding his movements. Opinions?

 

[Fairy1]

I have my doubts as to Steven being involved with anything sexual. Many sexual addictions begin with . He didn't have a smartphone with internet access and he didn't have internet access at home. He didn't have a job at an office where he could view .

Im not saying that there aren't other ways to access , but statistically speaking and individual with fewer points of access to that kind of material must be less likely to get involved with the heavier stuff.

I think you'd be hard pressed to find people who meet up for casual encounters who don't habitually watch .

He did have a laptop and could have been accessing the Internet outside of his home.

I disagree about the sexual factor. If he is just a gay LDS man (so sorry Naegle), he would probably want to hide that fact - particularly from his family. Not all gay people are into . It could just simply be his preference. And I believe that casual encounters by single gay men are fairly common. This certainly may explain his various travels of late.

 

[CONCRNED CTZN]

Maybe that's why he was without these things...so that he did not have access to it privately. That is the first thing they tell people who catch their spouses or child looking at it on a computer...put the computer where EVERYONE can see it.

 

[CONCRNED CTZN]

Now I want to know, with regards to Webb, the time of the phone call? AND if he thought Steven was driving when he talked to him.

 

[Fairy1]

VERY nice! I like the time zone conversion too.

I'm still debating as whether or not to finish my creation. It contains some liberties I've made regarding his movements. Opinions?

We really need a solid timeline - at the very least - leading up to and including the day Steven went missing. We need more info from Naegle for that, I think.

 

[laytonian]

I have my doubts as to Steven being involved with anything sexual. Many sexual addictions begin with . He didn't have a smartphone with internet access and he didn't have internet access at home. He didn't have a job at an office where he could view .

Im not saying that there aren't other ways to access , but statistically speaking and individual with fewer points of access to that kind of material must be less likely to get involved with the heavier stuff.

I think you'd be hard pressed to find people who meet up for casual encounters who don't habitually watch .

Really? Are you talking about people who cheat on their partners, unattached singles, gays, or what? Habitually?

There's free wifi access everywhere. The latest trick is to pull up in your car next to a motel, and hop onto their open connection.

 

[CONCRNED CTZN]

Maybe I should have said "IMMORAL" behavior...gay or straight or sideways in the eyes of his church and family (although I think they would accept him anyway as long as he was back home).

 

[lost at sea]

He did have a laptop and could have been accessing the Internet outside of his home.

I disagree about the sexual factor. If he is just a gay LDS man (so sorry Naegle), he would probably want to hide that fact - particularly from his family. Not all gay people are into . It could just simply be his preference. And I believe that casual encounters by single gay men are fairly common. This certainly may explain his various travels of late.

I admittedly know little about the subject of gay LDS men. I believe the issues faced here are certainly more complex than someone, myself absolutely included, would assume and so soften my position slightly. I guess its a possibility. Anything is. Just does't jive with my gut instinct.

Naegle, could you fill us in on one other thing, as if you didnt have enough already; when did Steven last have a girlfriend? Has he had lasting relationships with women since his mission?

I had a friend back in highschool whose cousin randomly came to stay with his family for a summer. Turns out he was a child molester trying to evade his many warrants. He could never maintain a relationship for more than a month or two with a woman. I wonder if homosexuality could manifest itself similarly in the individuals heterosexual relationships.

 

[Naegle]

Naegle - Here are ALL the questions from today. I tried to leave out the duplicates and ones that we answers through other people. Sorry if I missed any. If you copy and paste this - you can just add the answer after each question. I think it would even be valuable to say - you don't know and can't find out - or that is information you cannot share at this time (due to the fact it is a police investigation)

BLESS YOU! Here I go..

• OK, I know I got in on this late, but I see NO discussion about Steven's cousin Jeff Bradshaw, who lives in Las Vegas. Is this a coincidence, or is Steve's cousin the same Jeff Bradshaw whose realty office is at 10120 S Eastern Ave, Henderson, NV 89052...an office Steven would have driven right by, if he'd traveled the logical route. I don't know if that's his office, but I believe he his in realty.
• Good point, did he contact his cousin out there? i know he had presents but who were they for, his cousins kids?He did not contact Jeff who is actually a 2nd cousin once removed(but no less family). The presents were for Steven's brother's children. They fit the age and gender of each child.
• Anyways, I would be interested in the cell tower ping locations for Webb and Stevens calls as well.Steven's ping was in vegas. See next post for GW
• Where is the list of potential employers Steven sent his resume to?I don't know, but I can try to find out.
• Like it has been stated, it seems he (GW) is making points to cover that he is in contact with Steven often. They are probably EQ teachers and he wanted him to cover teaching that Sunday. Was he at church on the 10th since he was in Springville and if not, did Steven call that Sunday and tell Webb he would not be there? EQ teachers probably alternate Sundays and if the 13th was GW's day to teach, did Steven make it back from Ruby/Springville area to teach Sunday the 10th?GW is EQ pres Steven is counselor. More later.
• has Steven's info/pic appeared on the Anderson Dairy milk cartons yet?Nope, "soon".
• This phone call was on Sunday was it not? If Steven and Webb spoke on the phone, and they determined that Webb would return to St. George and not Steven... then wouldn't Webb know that Steven wasn't going to show up for church? Why would he say Steven never called if he'd already talked to him that day? What time is church?Later
• So what we think is two trips to norhtern Utah on the 8th and 10th could very well be one trip. Which leaves the big question. Who did he stay with on the night of the 7th, 8th, and 9th?I agree, but I have no idea who he stayed with
• Could his mention of Sacramento to AnneMarie's family be a cover to explain his passing through so far from home?Yeah.
• I wonder if the police have confirmed where Steven's ex roommate was on the day he dissapeared.Yes, they seem to be satisfied he was not involves. He still gives me the creeps.
• Could what he have been carrying have been plane tickets and a travel itenary?Yes, but would have had to cover a paper trail because there wasn't one. How far is where he parked the car from the Henderson airport?Don't know.
I know that theory doesn't really fit the clues either but if the mission president there could put the word out, it couldn't hurt right?A lady from the mission said she'd contact people who were there
• Have the police checked all flights and bus tickets?I think so...
• Suppose for a moment Steven was involved in illegal human trafficking of illegal immigrants.Thanks for the laugh. I needed it!
• Certainly, people saw Steve *other* than at those occasions noted on her timeline. Remember, that timeline starts on Nov 13th -- and doesn't even list when he went to church. It'd be significant if he missed it. Maybe Naegle can clarify.I haven't spoken to anyone. All my info about his friends in St george comes from FB which you all can see.
• Half a tank of gas would have been 7.6 gallons. Do we know it was found exactly "half full" or someone just looked at the gauge and saw it was kinda-halfway?I would say kinda.
• If he had NO connection to SLC at any point during that trip to Ruby Valley why did he come home that way and stop in Springville for gas?He's familiar with that way. IMO
• It'd be nice to have a complete inventory of the car's contents, including all receipts. Even if he paid cash for things, there could be receipts in the bags....and they have information.I'll work on that. There were receipts.
• could anyone mention where Greg Webb is from?Not me...
• Have people in Ruby Valley been questioned? Steven went there, most likely, for a reason other than to visit AM. Maybe someone knows something.Not to my knowledge
• I think that something happened or started when he was living in Salt Lake. Does the family REALLY know what made him quit his job and move?see next post I think his previous co-workers and friends need to be interviewed. Maybe they already have?Not to my knowledge
• ut my biggest suggestion is this: hire a psychic/medium. I know lots of people don't believe in them but I do. Chip Coffey is one of my favorites. Here is a link to his site: http://www.chipcoffey.com/ If anything, he could at least refer you to someone reputable in the Las Vegas/St. George area. Lots of leads have been found using psychic/mediums! It might get things moving again.Please, no. One contacted us unsolicited and said Steven was dead. Not a fun experience.
• What kind of coats were found. Were they different sizes? Were they odd colors for a man to be wearing? Pink, teal, etc? ANY info on these coats is helpful.Don't know. I'll check.
• Did Steven ever work for or spend extended periods of time working at AnneMarie's families ranch?No, only a weekend youth conference or young adult conference
• Does he speak any other languages, to your knowledge, besides Portuguese and English?Not that I know of.
• Are there records/receipts available, for the 7-10 days before he disappeared?Some I'll look into details.
• Any receipts in the car, however meaningless they'd seem?See above
• What date/time/address is on the Mesquite, NV gas receipt?See above
• Does anyone know his route to Ruby Valley, NV?Not for sure
• Can we assume he came back from there, through SLC and then St George (since he stopped for gas in Springville?)That would be ny guess
• Is there any chance he went to SLC to see Annemarie before he returned from the Ruby Valley trip?She said she never saw him Did they have a deep, previous relationship?I believe they went on a few dates
• Has he been to Sacramento before?Probably...
• How close is the nearest bus stop to where that car was parked?Don't know
• I wonder, if we were to see the entire video tape from that day, what would we see? What other cars? What other people?Don't know

• Did the neighbors know the guy on the corner had cameras on his house??Don't know

• Why does the guy have cameras on his house in the first place? I live here, I know. . .Sun City Anthem is one of the safest areas in Las Vegas. But this guy has cameras pointed at a side entrance to his house and a camera pointed at his cars. Is there something about that street that we don't know about??Don't know
• I wonder if the neighbors have been asked if Steven's car had ever been seen on that street before??Don't know, but it was a fairly common looking car...
• Did Webb make it back to church that Sunday?See next
• Who was he working for? Any contacts or information there? Maybe the window washing was a cover for something else?I doubt it was a cover. Why waste time handing out flyers?
• Where there messages on Steven's phone? Where the authorities or family able to retrieve any?There were messages, but they were from known people about normal things.

 

[Fairy1]

Really? Are you talking about people who cheat on their partners, unattached singles, gays, or what? Habitually?

There's free wifi access everywhere. The latest trick is to pull up in your car next to a motel, and hop onto their open connection.

One could actually access the Internet off of a neighbor's connection right in your own home!

 

[laytonian]

VERY nice! I like the time zone conversion too.

I'm still debating as whether or not to finish my creation. It contains some liberties I've made regarding his movements. Opinions?

Go with it.

We're doing two different things.
You're looking at info, and creating potential scenarios.
I'm just looking at data.

In fact, I don't think the two can exist as one unit -- but could be used together.

As I put it together (mostly from Naegle's info), I saw things I'd not seen when it was just in a plain list.....like the hometeaching appointment and how that may fit into the various phonecalls.

 

[laytonian]

One could actually access the Internet off of a neighbor's connection right in your own home!

Heh. One could.
Our pushy neighbors wanted to know our WEP code, "because it's all so expensive". We turned 'em down. But now that everyone has a home network, I can see three open connections.

Steven worked in various internet capacities. He knew how to do all of that.

 

[lost at sea]

Wifi. So blatantly obvious. Can't believe I missed that...

 

[Fairy1]

Thanks Naegle - and THANKS sallysueannie for putting that all together!

Still more questions...

What is Steven's interest in Sacramento?

Can you please give us more info on the receipts ASAP? Important to the timeline.

Can you find out how extensively GW has been questioned. I really think there's more there.

Was Steve's ward entirely a singles ward?

 

[laytonian]

I admittedly know little about the subject of gay LDS men. I believe the issues faced here are certainly more complex than someone, myself absolutely included, would assume and so soften my position slightly. I guess its a possibility. Anything is. Just does't jive with my gut instinct.

Naegle, could you fill us in on one other thing, as if you didnt have enough already; when did Steven last have a girlfriend? Has he had lasting relationships with women since his mission?

I had a friend back in highschool whose cousin randomly came to stay with his family for a summer. Turns out he was a child molester trying to evade his many warrants. He could never maintain a relationship for more than a month or two with a woman. I wonder if homosexuality could manifest itself similarly in the individuals heterosexual relationships.

I know an LDS gay man (well...his family is, he's no longer). He's very open, but his family completely ignores the subject. Pretend that he lives alone (even though he's had a partner for years). He's 48 years old.

As far as heterosexual relationships: I have other gay friends, and like anyone else, their relationships vary. One has been married to a woman for 25 years, has a grown son, and is also openly gay. Most, however, are no longer in relationships OR continue in long-term relationships. Dating for gays is kinda like for heterosexuals, except for the need to hide it.

What I'm saying, I guess, is that being able to sustain (or not sustain) a heterosexual relationship doesn't necessarily mean one's gay. But, every healthy adult male I've ever known who's unmarried at 30, is gay. A high-ranking civilian at a local military base, was gay and we all knew it. No big deal.

The ONLY sad case I've personally known about, was my daughter's friend's brother...who was completely rejected by his family for being gay. A few years later, he found he had AIDS. Shortly before he died, he reconciled with his mother and moved back into the home. His mother carried the guilt of having rejected him, to her grave...she died at 55. BUT....this was a Catholic family, not LDS.

The currently-fashionable "gay thing" is offensive, though. It's fake, it gives people a bad reputation, and it's all for show.

Sorry for the off-topic rambling....just let me leave you with one thing: you all know gay people. You might not know they're gay, but you know them. you love them. The single aunt with the old lady roommate? Gay? Your gym teacher who never married. She's gay. Trust me. Mine was/is.