NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #11

[RubyRed]

Since the follow-up probably won't appear in the Vegas papers and the exact location of this death won't be mentioned in ours, I'm going to SPECULATE that this SLC story solves yesterday's Star Motel mystery:

Salt Lake media (KSL TV for example) is reporting that Ryan Greathouse (the brother of murdered Utah police officer Josie Fox) was found dead in a Las Vegas "bedroom" at 1pm Vegas time on Thursday, Apr 23rd.

What a tangled web people weave.

 

[Canyon1]

Since the follow-up probably won't appear in the Vegas papers and the exact location of this death won't be mentioned in ours, I'm going to SPECULATE that this SLC story solves yesterday's Star Motel mystery:

Salt Lake media (KSL TV for example) is reporting that Ryan Greathouse (the brother of murdered Utah police officer Josie Fox) was found dead in a Las Vegas "bedroom" at 1pm Vegas time on Thursday, Apr 23rd.

I came on here to speculate the very same thing. It's the first thing I thought of when I saw the story on KSL. I feel so, so bad for the Greathouse family. Two children dying under tragic circumstances in a matter of months. How would you even stand it?

 

[Fairy1]

Since the follow-up probably won't appear in the Vegas papers and the exact location of this death won't be mentioned in ours, I'm going to SPECULATE that this SLC story solves yesterday's Star Motel mystery:

Salt Lake media (KSL TV for example) is reporting that Ryan Greathouse (the brother of murdered Utah police officer Josie Fox) was found dead in a Las Vegas "bedroom" at 1pm Vegas time on Thursday, Apr 23rd.

That's weird! Why would they say "bedroom?" They don't gloss over the fact the guy was a druggie whose sister was murdered because of him, but they won't say he was found in a seedy Las Vegas motel. Hmmm.

 

[Paulette]

Since the follow-up probably won't appear in the Vegas papers and the exact location of this death won't be mentioned in ours, I'm going to SPECULATE that this SLC story solves yesterday's Star Motel mystery:

Salt Lake media (KSL TV for example) is reporting that Ryan Greathouse (the brother of murdered Utah police officer Josie Fox) was found dead in a Las Vegas "bedroom" at 1pm Vegas time on Thursday, Apr 23rd.

The dead motel man story was reported on April 21st. Not the same man.

 

[believe09]

If his account was at the bank she works at, she could easily access the info. She knew his name. Every time you make an in-person deposit, the teller sees your balances. That's why they're always telling you to pull money out of checking and put it into a CD account.

When his mother said she'd deposited money for him to help catch up on the rent, that money was put into the group (family) account.

The last-week purchases you see mentioned on the timeline were either cash (a very few) or via debit card deducted from his account.



How much is the car payment on a 7-year-old car?
If he bought the car near-new, he'd be near the end of the payment term.
If he'd bought it more recently, the payments would be minimal. Like $100-$150.
Add $20/$30 a month for minimal auto insurance.
Cellphone? $50 or less.''

Using the higher figures: $230/month for those items.



Now I'm confused. Outside of the auto-billing(s) from GoDaddy billed as credit (because he's obviously not deposited money to his bank account since he disappeared), where are these credit card bills coming from?

Remember, the auto-billingt(s) surprised the family, because it was the *only* activity on his account. The news said "credit" which makes sense, because that's how the bank handles a debit when there's nothing in the account.

Of course he could have had a separate credit card, but there's never been a mention of one, nor have we heard of any massive debts outside the rent.



(bbm)
Some? Only two items have showed up on his account, since he disappeared: the two auto-billings from GoDaddy.

If the websites are still "live" and the businesses are still active, then yes, the businesses owe Steven for the domain registration.
That's up to Mr and Mrs Koecher to chase them down for $20 or $40....or maybe let them expire.



Steven personally used a debit card. That's why the amounts were deducted from his bank account as they occurred, rather than being billed and paid monthly.

When he disappeared, he had $0 in his personal account.

You're looking for a gap in his income, and credit card debts.

I think the gap was the unpaid rent and utilities. If you're not paying that, it's like having $500 extra in your pocket.

IF there was another credit card and he'd racked up some debts -- those would be clues. I'm confident we'd have found out those clues by now.

If he was making enough for car payments, minimal insurance, food and gas --that's only a few hundred dollars a month. Like the $230 mentioned above, plus food. $350 tops?

I am not looking for massive debt, just whether or not he had a credit card he was paying on. :waitasec:

If he was not paying for his car, his rent and his utilities other than cell phone, what were the bills that were being paid out of his private account? (Which is how I am reading the Q&A with the timeline.) I will defer to you, Laytonian, on whether or not his mother had access or gave herself access to his private account. I mean Steven was in financial meltdown and seemed to be purposely avoiding using the group account to solve the issue.

I was not suggesting the Koechers chase down the domain customers, simply wondering at what point the cost would be turned over directly to the customers? Perhaps Steven was renting them the domains for money above and beyond the monthly cost....perhaps this was an additional source of money.

He set up his bills to auto pay, but not all of his bills clearly. So if he was paying auto insurance, maybe a cc bill...what else since the term used was bills? Student loans still? Govt loans can be deferred during times of unemployment...it would have been useful to do so at a time of limited income.

It would be nice to know if Travis was current with Steven's pay, and how frequently he paid Steven.

He had to know he could lose his housing, car and possibly utilities in the near future.

 

[Fairy1]

I am not looking for massive debt, just whether or not he had a credit card he was paying on. :waitasec:

If he was not paying for his car, his rent and his utilities other than cell phone, what were the bills that were being paid out of his private account? (Which is how I am reading the Q&A with the timeline.) I will defer to you, Laytonian, on whether or not his mother had access or gave herself access to his private account. I mean Steven was in financial meltdown and seemed to be purposely avoiding using the group account to solve the issue.

I was not suggesting the Koechers chase down the domain customers, simply wondering at what point the cost would be turned over directly to the customers? Perhaps Steven was renting them the domains for money above and beyond the monthly cost....perhaps this was an additional source of money.

He set up his bills to auto pay, but not all of his bills clearly. So if he was paying auto insurance, maybe a cc bill...what else since the term used was bills? Student loans still? Govt loans can be deferred during times of unemployment...it would have been useful to do so at a time of limited income.

It would be nice to know if Travis was current with Steven's pay, and how frequently he paid Steven.

He had to know he could lose his housing, car and possibly utilities in the near future.

There is no evidence of any "massive" debt - or anything other than what's known to the family. We know when Steven was last paid by Travis, but nothing more.

I have always maintained that we really don't know if Steven had any additional sources of income. He may have had a different bank account that his Mom couldn't track. He may have had a P.O. Box that was paid in advance. We really don't know.

Just sayin - we don't know everything.

 

[laytonian]

I am not looking for massive debt, just whether or not he had a credit card he was paying on. :waitasec:

If he was not paying for his car, his rent and his utilities other than cell phone, what were the bills that were being paid out of his private account? (Which is how I am reading the Q&A with the timeline.) I will defer to you, Laytonian, on whether or not his mother had access or gave herself access to his private account. I mean Steven was in financial meltdown and seemed to be purposely avoiding using the group account to solve the issue.

I was not suggesting the Koechers chase down the domain customers, simply wondering at what point the cost would be turned over directly to the customers? Perhaps Steven was renting them the domains for money above and beyond the monthly cost....perhaps this was an additional source of money.

He set up his bills to auto pay, but not all of his bills clearly. So if he was paying auto insurance, maybe a cc bill...what else since the term used was bills? Student loans still? Govt loans can be deferred during times of unemployment...it would have been useful to do so at a time of limited income.

It would be nice to know if Travis was current with Steven's pay, and how frequently he paid Steven.

He had to know he could lose his housing, car and possibly utilities in the near future.

Well, yeah. We've talked about that for months -- and two words could explain the entire situation: "downward spiral". Not just financially, but the pressure to measure up, find a job, find a wife, start a family.....

A couple of months ago, Naegle and I did a long brainstorming session. She (and the family) have as many "sure would like to know if" things, as we do.

 

[Fairy1]

I wish we knew which way the wind was blowing in Steven's case.

I may have been out searching for his remains, but I always hoped we wouldn't find him. When I told Steven's Mom that at the search, she said, "well, we need to rule out the 100 things it isn't until we find the one thing that it is."

 

[laytonian]

There is no evidence of any "massive" debt - or anything other than what's known to the family. We know when Steven was last paid by Travis, but nothing more.

I have always maintained that we really don't know if Steven had any additional sources of income. He may have had a different bank account that his Mom couldn't track. He may have had a P.O. Box that was paid in advance. We really don't know.

Just sayin - we don't know everything.

Certainly. But income and debts show up in ways people don't think about. Obviously, credit reports. Spending. Things found in your apartment after you're gone. Friends/acquaintances talking.

If he had additional sources of income, why would he not pay his rent or utilities?

To save up secretly for a disappearance?
A convoluted one which involved driving all over Nevada, coming back, driving again, coming back, driving again and leaving your car in a strange neighborhood 120 miles away?

He could have packed up his clothes and computer and driven all the way cross-country before anyone missed him.

Maybe in that security video, he's carrying a portfolio full of cash? :banghead:

 

[laytonian]

I wish we knew which way the wind was blowing in Steven's case.

I may have been out searching for his remains, but I always hoped we wouldn't find him. When I told Steven's Mom that at the search, she said, "well, we need to rule out the 100 things it isn't until we find the one thing that it is."

During the search, didn't the PI or his family use the phrase "Steven was placed there"?

But what did it really mean?

1--Someone put him there (ie, remains would be found).

2--Something investigative "places" him there (ie, cellphone triangulation, something belonging to him being found in that area, etc).

The #2 takes me back to that little homeless camp, where it was reported that a "young man" had been living there "for months" until "about two weeks ago".

 

[RubyRed]

The dead motel man story was reported on April 21st. Not the same man.

Okay, then we will have to wait and see who motel man is.

 

[laytonian]

He may have had a P.O. Box that was paid in advance.

:woohoo:

Have we EVER thought about a post office box? I don't remember anyone mentioning it.

They're always paid in advance, no matter who you rent one from AND you have to show two forms of ID, even if you apply online or pay cash. That means you leave a paper trail: USPS.com and UPS Store

I think that's something we need to ask whether it's been investigated or not. It would answer a lot of questions.

 

[Fairy1]

During the search, didn't the PI or his family use the phrase "Steven was placed there"?

But what did it really mean?

1--Someone put him there (ie, remains would be found).

2--Something investigative "places" him there (ie, cellphone triangulation, something belonging to him being found in that area, etc).

The #2 takes me back to that little homeless camp, where it was reported that a "young man" had been living there "for months" until "about two weeks ago".

What I said was, "Gosh, it sure would be easier to know how to search if we knew whether it was believed Steven put himself here or if someone else put him here."

And it was a family member who said it was believed someone put Steven there.

 

[laytonian]

The dead motel man story was reported on April 21st. Not the same man.

You are absolutely right. Why, it really DID seem like it was "just yesterday"

When I am wrong, I am very very wrong.

 

[laytonian]

What I said was, "Gosh, it sure would be easier to know how to search if we knew whether it was believed Steven put himself here or if someone else put him here."

And it was a family member who said it was believed someone put Steven there.

But they could have been interpreting "placed", ya know?

I don't think he was put there. I know it wasn't a perfect search, but after all this time, remains would have been scattered....and (sorry about this) large parts wouldn't have degraded much.

There'd be clothing (shirt, shoes, pants, underwear, LDS garments, the cap, belt.....) besides remains.

 

[laytonian]

Okay, then we will have to wait and see who motel man is.

We have another character, then? Mr Security, meet Motel Man.

I wish we'd named everyone.

Oh yeah. Applehead. (In lieu of something else that when we type the name, we get into trouble here.)

 

[Paulette]

During the search, didn't the PI or his family use the phrase "Steven was placed there"?

But what did it really mean?

1--Someone put him there (ie, remains would be found).

2--Something investigative "places" him there (ie, cellphone triangulation, something belonging to him being found in that area, etc).

The #2 takes me back to that little homeless camp, where it was reported that a "young man" had been living there "for months" until "about two weeks ago".

That's very interesting. I wonder if the PI knows it wasn't Steven living there.

Perhaps this homeless man saw Steven. Or had a possession of his.

 

[RubyRed]

During the search, didn't the PI or his family use the phrase "Steven was placed there"?

But what did it really mean?

1--Someone put him there (ie, remains would be found).

2--Something investigative "places" him there (ie, cellphone triangulation, something belonging to him being found in that area, etc).

The #2 takes me back to that little homeless camp, where it was reported that a "young man" had been living there "for months" until "about two weeks ago".

Maybe the homeless person heard about the search and got the heck out of there.

 

[laytonian]

That's very interesting. I wonder if the PI knows it wasn't Steven living there.

Perhaps this homeless man saw Steven. Or had a possession of his.

I don't think so. No one knew about the homeless camp (see the pictures on the FB page) until a local pointed it out, after finding out about the search that would be held. He'd seen it there for quite awhile, but apparently didn't know anyone was missing from the area :banghead::banghead:

 

[Fairy1]

I don't think so. No one knew about the homeless camp (see the pictures on the FB page) until a local pointed it out, after finding out about the search that would be held. He'd seen it there for quite awhile, but apparently didn't know anyone was missing from the area :banghead::banghead:

I may be wrong about this - but wasn't the guy that found the camp a friend of Jeff Bradshaw, Steven's cousin?